roguedawg

If a scout is ashamed to wear their uniform in public, then perhaps they should not be in scouts. They need to grow a backbone. What is there to be ashamed of?

RD

Kraut-60

More thoughts. I tell the boys in my outpost this passage.

Revelations 3:14-16 NIV

14To the angel of the church in Laodicea write: These are the words of the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the ruler of God's creation. 15I know your deeds, that you are neither cold nor hot. I wish you were either one or the other! 16So, because you are lukewarm neither hot nor cold I am about to spit you out of my mouth.

Kelly version: Make up your mind, nobody likes a fence-sitter.

Matthew 25-14 talks about people being responsible which what has been given to them. "You have been faithful in a few thing; I will put you in charge of many things."

Jesus said that in order for us to be great, we have to be servants. Just the same for a leader. I am speaking to the choir on this since I know that almost all the scouters here lay down their lives and time for the boys. Leadership requires sacrifice. Lukewarm leaders are basically useless. So puke them out.

Before elections make sure the boys understand that if they are not able to attend and lead, they need not be in a leadership position and should not run for a position.

I don't think a coach would put up with a quarterback that only showed up half of the games. The same should be for a scoutmaster's expectations of a SPL. I have in the past and would ask an absent SPL to give up his position if he can't fullfill it. It is not fair for the ASPL to do the SPL job. His is to assist the SPL, not do his position. We had one SPL take responsibility for his absence and asked if he could switch positions with the ASPL. I give him credit for this. RD

I tried to look back as a teenager in high school. I was on the track team and in scouts as the SPL. I asked about attendance at an upcoming meet. He asked me what was more important to me - the track team or scouts and that I had to make a choice. I walked away and lead my troop on the camp out. Later, he wanted to talk to me why I walked away from my team mates. My reply was that the troop was my team LONG before my track mates. I was the SPL over 35 scouts in 3 patrols. Him giving me an altamatum was a bad idea on his part. I was being responsible to fulfill my leadership position in the troop. I was elected and had to stay true to the scouts that elected me. They depended on me and my ASPL to be there when they needed us most. The track mates - they knew I was sold out on scouting and they respected my decision.

The jocks as school looked down on band as well as scouts. Most jocks were too concerned for themselves and not for their team. I learned more about team spirit and working together in scouts than I ever did in sports.

I feel as though I made the right choice. That is what the boys have to decide. It is all about choices. That is a lesson to be learned in life - we all have to make decisions and live with the outcomes. Other people are affected by our decisions as well. I chose not to let down 36 other people in my life.

We had a few scouts in my troop that dropped out of the troop to be bench warmers for the football team. They have regretted the decision all their life. They exchanged a sure Eagle Scout rank for a football team position based on high school politics.

We also had a SPL that did sports and fulfilled his SPL position. I had to feed him supper before the troop meeting for the length of the swim season, but it was a good investment. He is a Capt. in the Air Force right now.

Choices, choices, choices. RD

SSScout came up with the name: Faith Merit Badge

You come up with the requirements. Tick Tock Tick Tock! Four more days until the merit badge game is closed. RD

SSScout,

You got the idea! I was thinking of starting with a funny merit badge, but a serious MB is good too! I say go with this one being the first merit badge in the Halls of Merits. Is there any way to post an image of the Merit Badge? My brother and I used to make up merit badges when the Round Table meeting got boring. We would pass a note around and someone else would fill in the next requirement. Our first one was Litigation Merit Badge. It had a dollar sign as the letter "S" and "ue" next to it.

OK, here are the rules:

1. A merit name will be posted as a new topic in Open Discussion. For the next five (5) days, forum members will be permitted to submit one (1) requirement for the merit per day (maximum of four (4) submissions per merit).

2. No double posting permitted. If nobody has submitted a requirement post since your last post, then you are stuck waiting on others.

3. Please keep your posts in good taste. Witty is good, puns are good, crude is not good, insults are not good. People tend to use the pseudo-anonymity of forums as a license to do and say things that they would never attempt in person. Remember, we are all scouts here and we live by the Scout Law.

4. Try to avoid discussing the requirement posts until the voting phase begins. This will help keep the thread uncluttered.

5. After the end of the five (5) day submission period, a new poll topic will be started in Open Discuusion to vote on the best submission. Here is where the merits (pun intended) of all the posted requirements may be debated. The voting period will run for three (3) days. The current moderator may not vote in the poll (but will be able to cast a tie-breaker vote if necessary).

6. The winner will also be the moderator for the next merit (this prevents a single player from dominating the game). He will post a new topic (as outlined in Rule 1 above) and the game will begin anew.

Take a look here: http://www.rangerforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=993

for an example of a merit with five requirements.

Take a look here: http://rangerforums.com/portal.php?page=7&sid=9898c0249512b4203076c34c6862f6cb

for an example of the merit badge art work.

I think we should toss out rule #2 this time since this is the first Merit Badge Game. You definately do have the point. I can be the first moderator since I brought up the game. After this one, the winner gets to be the next moderator. Have fun and enjoy it. Someone may come up with a very good merit badge and have it accepted as a real one by national. I think yours has merit. (sorry about the pun.) RD

One idea - We did this on one camp-out and it was great! We had about 30 minutes of free time after lunch before the events cranked up again. We stoked up the fire, cut up meat and veggies for our evening meal, filled the dutch oven, and dug a hole by the campfire. We lined it is coals, placed the D.O. in the hole, covered it with more coals and topped it off with dirt. When it was supper time, we just unburied our meal and ate.

Why showed the scouts how we did it and their typical answer was, "Why don't we do that?" But on the next camp out, they don't do what they were shown and end up taking an hour or two cooking. We in leadership could care less how long they take to cook a meal, just as long as it is a good meal and everyone has ate. If they would rather spend time cooking or doing a hike or visiting other troops, that is up to them. It is their camp out time. I would rather visit other campsites and have some good fellowship and goodies.

We had one bull-headed scout that took 4 hours to wash 4 dishes. He would blow off his parents, but we were not going to let him get out of doing his share of work. He finally got the point that he could spend 4 hours washing 4 dishes and cut into play time or just do it in 5 minutes and go do something fun for 3 hours and 50 minutes. By the end of the camp-out he would be a good little worker, until his parents would show and he would regress into his lazy baby mode. RD

I was wondering if scouter would be up to a merit badge game? There are some rules, but it is really fun. Basically, a person comes up with a fictional merit badge name and everybody submits the requirements for that badge. After a period of time, the merit badge is closed and the members vote for the best requirements. The winner gets the most votes. Any takers? RD

I think the idea of taking "strangers" of boys and tossing them into a patrol would be good for a Junior Leader Training Camp, but not for a campout. The concept is a reality though. We don't get to pick patrols in the real world. You get hired in a job and are put into a group of strangers. Or perhaps you are placed into a work-group or a committee at work. You have to learn to work together or the group fails. Perhaps this is a good idea for the wrong event. Of course I was not there and do not have the vision of the camping committee.

I wouldn't want some of the younger scouts being placed in a group of boys from another troop. Too great of a chance of them getting a bad experience and leaving the troop. I guess I would have to be there to see everything that happened. RD

Well, the local scouts made the newspaper. I ran into DE Nick Ross yesterday and he said that everyone was defrosted and well. -17 was reported of from Camp Ranger Joe. RD

http://www.thedailyreview.com/articles/2009/01/18/news/doc4972b10c34347797324962.txt#blogcomments

It is too cold to camp when the pet troop monkey freezes to death. This week-end is the Polar Bear Campout for 5 River's Council. It was 2 degrees this morning, and it is to get colder tonight and tomorrow. We camped at -10 and it was not as bad as you think it would be. Everything stayed frozen and you were chilly enough to not break a sweat, but not chilly enough to shiver. The worst Polar Bear was when it got up to 35-40 degrees. It was miserable since everything was getting wet. Still a good time, but we had to have a buddy check every half hour. Lots of hot chocolate, coffee, soup, and dutch oven meals.

If the parents don't want their boy to attend, that is fine with me. I saves you the hassle of taking the boy home. You also don't want to spoil their time and loose a boy from a bad camping experience.

I hope you got it on video. You could post it so leaders could see how a troop should be run. Don't worry, it will happen again, again, again and again. Congradulations. Treat your patrol leaders with a candy bar or something like that. What gets rewarded, gets repeated. RD

There is prayer in Sayre over Cooper and your family. I found your posting to be upsetting after I put myself in your shoes. It could be my son as well. I will tell my outpost to pray for you all at our next meeting. Keep us informed. God bless. RD

This adventure of hiking the entire AT would make a great adventure story and even a movie. I am not a writer though. I have a good imagination and vision though. RD

Has anyone done Pine Wood Dragsters before? You may ask, what is a Pine Wood Dragster? It is a pine wood derby car with a hole drilled out in the center of the car. A model rocket engine in put into place with the shoot placed in the front of the car. The dragsters are placed on a track and sent down a wire to a finish line. The shoot deploys and slows the car down. I have a car made, but I have not raced it yet. Here is the website I came across. God bless. RD

http://www.maximum-velocity.com/rocket_cars.htm

I contacted a Ranger Commander out in CA. He says they are a real hit. They use the stardard PWD wheels and they work fine. I got some larger wheels from a toy car at a local dollar store. as I said, I have not raced it yet, so I can't say if it is a good idea or not. I was brought up to never fire a rocket horizontally, but I guess that concept was thrown out years ago. I think an event could be run safely though. Who knows.

It sounds like you are going to have some fun. My troop always had a pinewood derby each year. The boys knew what they were getting for Christmas from the troop. So over Christmas break, they would work on their cars. The dads also got cars to work on as well. We would also have some dads bring in power tools like a bandsaw, beltsanders, and dremmel tools and we would have a cut night. Doing so levels the playing field for boys that do not have a dad around to help them out. Let the boys do as much as they can except using the power tools.

Just have fun with the boys.

Did Adam and Eve have belly buttons?

What does "white stone" mean?

When a person is raised from the dead, why are they given something to eat? RD

Sounds like a "SWINE DINE" to me. At Camp Brule', Ranger Joe would have the scouts separate the food from the non-food items and would take the slop to a nearby farmer. He would feed the pigs from May until the end of summer camp. Then at the end of the year he would get some pork for his family. It saved the council a lot of money instead of disposing of the garbage in the landfill.

Having the boys work towards a merit badge is a good idea as well. I would think that slaughtering a pig would freak out some kids as well as parents. Not that I would be oppossed to it. People seem to think that they get meat from the store and not from animals.

When I was younger my mom had a rooster that was mean to the other chickens. She said to get rid of it. She then told us to take the bird down to camp and teach the kids how to butcher a chicken. So I took the rooster to camp, tied a string to his leg and put a stake into the ground. I carried him to cracker barrel on Friday night. Of course that got everybody to laughing at the meeting. I was asked what his name was, My reply was, "Diner!" So on Sat. evening all these scouts were hanging around our campsite. I thought it was odd, and then one of them asked that they were waiting to see me do the rooster in. So I did, all the kids watched, and then we removed the feathers and cooked it.

But that old rooster got revenge on me. He was the toughest bird I ever chewed on. My ASM ate the other half and I tossed mine in the fire. We had this lady, Tony, that would visit our campsite. I offered her some chicken and she ate it. She was being really nice and told me that it was better than how she cooks it. I laughed and asked her if she was telling the truth. She said "NO!, it is the worst chicken I ever tasted."

But a week later my dad got a call from the DE. I guess some parents did not like that Jonnie was exposed to the blood feast. My dads response was, "You don't expect us to eat a live chicken do you?" So to answer your question,

Why doesn't this happen at every Scout summer camp in America?

Probably because the council does not want to deal with phone calls or PETA type groups.

Anyways, some of the kids at camp eat like pigs. We wouldn't want to relate summer camp to the story "Lord of the Flies" would you? RD

Write to the president elect and invite him to be the Honorary President of the BSA. If he hears more from scouts that the other groups, who is he going to listen to? I wouldn't feel right telling a person in authority over me what to do. The first amendment guarantees freedom of religion and free speech, not freedom from religion and free speech. Also without government infringment "free exercise of religion." Well Scouters, the Royal Rangers will be praying for you. RD

2eagles

Try our neighbor up north and the CSA. We did two international campouts back in 1982 and 1984 with the Canadians. It was a good time. Of course we were in New York which is a little closer to the border than you are. One year the US hosted and the other year the Canadians did. We had a contigency of about 75 scouts. I traded loads of patches. RD

I read on some of the posts that some of the patrols had fewer than 8 members. We tried to keep 8 members and if there were 10-12 members another patrol could form. Years ago, the troop was up to the time to have patrol leader elections. Two boys were upset that they did not get elected as patrol leaders. So my dad came up with the "Patrol Leader Challenge". The PLC was open to any scout, any time of the year. He announced that if any scout was able to recruit 7 boys, he could be removed from the patrol and start his own patrol with himself being the patrol leader. So the two boys rounded up 8 boys between the two of them and started a new patrol. Try this in your own troop with the patrol leaders council.

Oh my troop tended to mix up the ages of the boys so the younger ones were being training up the older boys. We also kept buddies together when they came into the troop. We kept the patrols together, but if there were any big issues or personality conflicts, there could be transfers to other patrols. We encouraged the boys to work out any differences since when they would get into the work force, they would learn how to deal with other people.

Patrol leaders had to be approved by the SM's, but the boys elected who ever they wanted. Sometimes they made poor choices and were stuck with their leaders for 6 months.

I wouldn't throw in the towel yet. BSA got through the 1929 Stock Market crash and the Great Depression. It is just that the US has had so much blessing since then, that it is a shock to the pocket book. I think that membership may increase. Why? Camping is cheap and less money means that people are going to look for alternatives for vacations and entertainment. If people are layed-off then they tend to stay home and do more stuff with their family. People need to change their lifestyles and get used to not having so much stuff.

I tend to be an optimist. I don't think that our economy is ever going to get better. There is just too much unwise spending and lending that has happened over the last few decades. It has just come to a head. People just have to change and be flexible. The more people accept this concept, the easier it will be for them.

I am totally confident that the teaching provided by the BSA will help out many families in the future. A scout is THRIFTY. A scout is BRAVE. A scout is HELPFULL. Will it be easy? No, but it will be survivalable. People need to help each other out. Get back to the basics and what really counts...people, family, and friends. If you have food and a place to lay your head, you have it good. The US is still better off than most of the world.

My employment situation is like anyone else. Eight years ago, I worked with 55 people, now since it is just past the new year, we are down to two of us. So I have survived 6 lay-offs. I am not sure which is worse, seeing all your co-workers getting layed-off or being the last man standing. All is know is that the Lord is looking out for me and my family. His is doing the same for everyone else.

So what is a scout to do? For troops, plan local camping trips. Do patrol camping. Help out a scout family that is unemployed. If you are unemployed - that means you have a lot of time on your hands to do service projects. Keep busy. Teach gardening in the spring so people can feed themselves.

Council level - that is another thing. I imagine they too will be downsizing. I interviewed for a DE position. Six months later, they layed off a DE. I am glad that I stayed in my current job because that would have been me without a job.

I can say that scouts will be still be around no matter how bad the economy is. You can bet on that. The USA had had it good for many years. Times are tough and will be getting tougher. But the USA will get tough as well. I think it will toughen us up as well and bring us closer together. We have a lot of resolve. RD

I have to admit my dad had the gift of gab and salemanship a well as leadership. So I hope I will end up as good as he was. Of course I have met other leaders that were just as good that I have learned from. That is one of the good things about the internet and forums like this. I wish I had access to this when I was younger. You can learn a lot from the internet, but mentoring can't be replaced. As John Maxwell says, "If you want to be a good leader, learn from leaders better than you." I have not heard anyone complain about his leadership book series. Try them out. RD

I did not find this topic on any of the threads, but I wanted to start one to come up with ideas to encourage scout dads to get more involved with their sons and the troop. We all know as leaders that if a boy is not getting parental support, they generally do not flourish and grow. My dad, my brother and myself had a great time in scouts. So I will start out the thread with one way that worked for us in T-11.

When my dad took over the troop, we only had about 8 boys, 1 SM, 1 ASM, and 2 CM. Of course my dad wanted the troop to grow. So he bought a dutch oven and started to cook meals with it. His whole idea was -- if dad's come on a campout, he wanted to make sure that the following:

1) They had a good hot meal,

2) A good nights sleep,

3) A relaxing time.

Good meals - as the saying goes, "A way to a man is through his stomach." So feed the men good meals. The first year, he put a push on to cook good meals. He demonstrated to the new dads how to use a dutch oven. He would not allow them to help out. He told them to just sit down, drink their coffee and eat a donut. The following campouts, the dads got really interested in cooking (and eating). So he let them help out a little. Some of the dads would even volunteer to help clean up. He would get questions like, "What are we eating this time?" or "I would like to have this on the next campout."

A good nights sleep - when the troop was young, we all camped together. After a while, the leaders got tired of speaking to the boys after lights were out because they were making too much noise. So the leaders made their own campsite about 50 feet away. This is good since the boys need to self-rule and they don't need adults solving all their problems. So in the leaders campsite, people that wanted to stay up past taps could sit around the campfire and talk quietly. Those who wanted to hit the hay early could do so.

A relaxing time - As the troop got older, we had some boys that could drive. Since they could not carry scouts in vehicles, they could carry camping gear. They would get to camp early and set up the leaders campsite before they got to camp. The men would meet at church and bring the scouts down to camp. When they arrived, us older scouts would grab their gear, put it in the tent and instruct the dads the direction to the coffee pot. The dads would try to help the boys set up camp, but the SPL would tell them that he was in charge and everything was in control. It would end up that instead of working all week at regular work and then having to work on the week-end, they could come, camp, and just relax. They would soon learn that the best troops are the ones where the boys lead them.

In about two years we noticed that the men would want to get involved more in the troop. So we offered them the troop committee. They would come and help out more. Instead of complaining why things were done a certain way, they could help out and change things. So they did. We also told the men that they were part of the leaders patrol. So the men started to act like a patrol. So the comradery would kick in. Instead of finding excuses not to participate, they would find excuses to camp. Some camp outs we had more men in attendance than scouts. Some of the scouts would wuss out and attend a school dance, but the dads would buddy up and attend a camp out. We even had dads that stated that they "hated camping", attend polar bear camp outs. They didn't hate camping, they just did not like the discomforts of poor meals, working, and lack of sleep.

T-11 grew to about 55 boys and 15-20 adults and maintained this for about 12 years. So I know that it works. Of course there were other factors as well not just the three listed above, but a small troop has to have a starting point. I hope this thread will help some troops to grow. It took about 3-4 years for the troop to be built up, so it does not happen overnight. Enjoy and God bless. RD

Please add your ideas. Let's work together.

IM_Kathy,

In rangers, we would call your son an "IRON MAN" since the cooking equipment of choice is the dutch oven, "CI" AKA cast iron. We had a scout named Steve that was an "IRON MAN". When he was SPL, he planned a hike. He carried that dutch oven 10 miles! We tried to get him to do foil cooking, but he would not. We even offered to drive the D.O. to the campsite, but he said he just told the scouts that you had to carry everything on your own back.

We had an unwritten rule in my troop concerning left overs. If members of another patrol were still hungry, the could eat the left overs from another patrol. The kicker was that they had to clean the container it was cooked in. My patrol started it because the other two patrols consistantly had crappy meals, not Happy Meals, but crappy meals. It actually was started as a joke since we had burned a meal. My brother was about to clean the dutch oven and they came in the nick of time. He offered the burnt offering as a joke and they jumped on it. So we figured why should we clean-up. So the tradition was started. I remember them scrapping off the charred food and eating it. Yuk. I guess if you are hungry enough, you will eat anything.

Another rule to put an end to poor cooks. If a person burned a meal really bad, then they had to clean the burned cooking equipment. We had one scout that did not like the other patrol members and would intentionally burn the meals he was assigned to cook so he would not be asked to cook again. After cleaning up a few ruined meals, he changed is attitude.

Even if the boys ruined all their meals or ate everything in sight, they knew that if they came to the leader's campsite, they could get a peanut butter and jelly sandwich. We always had that as a back-up. But sometimes these boys would have awesome meals and still be hungry and there would go the jars and bread. RD

I just got off the phone with my brother and he reminded me of an incident that occurred in our old troop. So here it is. In my troop we used to have an adult leaders patrol and three scout patrols. They would all camp close but separate from each other. We started to notice that some of the food would come up missing in our adult patrol campsite on one of our camp outs. We heard through one of the patrol leaders that the kids were to lazy to cook their own food and were swiping ours instead. (as well as fire wood, water, and washing dished in our wash tins) So we tried to think up a good way to keep the little thieves from raiding us.

So the next camp out we made our menu. We decided to swap labels on all of our canned food and label paper bags with the contents. So our "deviled ham" became "fancy feast". Our "chilli" became "Alpo". A bag of chips was placed inside an empty bag of dry cat food. Beef jerky was placed inside a bag of "Beggen Strips" Our grocery bag of snacks was labeled "Freeze dried liver". Dry cereal was put into a dog biscuit box. I think you get the idea. So after we ate some of our meals we would leave the containers out in the open so raiders would see what they were eating.

Some of the boys came up and were having a fine dine, until they noticed what they thought they were eating. We found uneaten sandwiches left in the fire. One of the dads stayed behind in a tent to see who was swiping food. He said he almost wet himself holding back his laughter. He said he had to scream in his pillow.

Later in the evening we had our usual campfire sing along and snacks. The boys came up to the campfire since they knew we had broken out the snacks. We opened the freeze dried liver bag and started taking out the contents. We brought out the beef jerky and chips and started passing it around. For some odd reason, they didn't want to partake of any goodies that night. They decided to return to their own campsites and do some of their own cooking.

So we never had this problem again.

I hope you liked the story. RD