BDPT00

"Kinda makes one wonder... any thoughts?"

***Yeah. I have one. What's the point?

"The union is to the left only when the flag is displayed flat upright."

*** And it is this kind of absolute statement that causes arguments. I hope you're not a trainer.

I'd love to see where this idea came from.

BDPT00

Variation a previous question: Should a Life Scout, etc. not fall into the same category ... wearing the uniform for special occasions? What's the difference?

BDPT00

c) No other flag or pennant should be placed above or, if on the same level, to the right of the flag of the United States of America, except during church services conducted by naval chaplains at sea, when the church pennant may be flown above the flag during church services for the personnel of the Navy.

*** That's pretty black and white. No problem.

Another reference:

A conference of "mainstream" Protestant denominations some decades ago concluded ...

Joe McMillan, 15 April 2003

*** Don't know who Joe is, but it's 100% opinion.

"Surely the flag code can be interpreted to include the Christian flag to have similar meaning as a pennant on the ship."

*** Also opinion. I disagree. The code is very clear, and leaves no room for this interpretation, so it remains an opinion. No different than comments shared here. I agree with some, and not with others. That's my opinion.

BDPT00

It's an issue with me. I think you just made that up, so I guess I'm the skeptic.

BDPT00

Adult Association

Can we get a scientifically derived conclusion or position on this subject from the American Psychiatric Association?

BDPT00

"I'm well aware that there are no co-SM's......but there are in this troop. I'd love to see their paperwork at recharter."

So what are you saying? emb021 is correct. Agree? Disagree?

I'd keep an eye on their program. It sounds like they choose which rules, programs, and training they like. THey skip the rest, because that's for everybody else.

BDPT00

Seems that everyone is afraid to admit that EDGE works. I'd love to hear the difference between what John/KC said and EDGE.

BDPT00

Thanks for listening. It would otherwise be, "going to work my tickets if I can."

It's a very common error, but I guess this is the only way to fix it ... one at a time when it happens.

BDPT00

It's one ticket.

One of my pet peeves ... People don't know the words to the song. None right so far.

Bobwhites, it's your try.

If you're going to sing it, especially if you're a staffer modeling for others, do it right.

BDPT00

acco40,

Aside from wearing the medal (just because I don't know what is meant by "recognized by the BSA." So is a Mentor Pin, but not authorized for uniform wear.), I'm in full agreement with your example.

We, as adults, have various reasons for doing what we do (and, therefor, earning what we earn). For others to assume we do it for recognition may or may not be correct, but it's not for others to judge any particular individual based upon their own theory or previous experience with someone else.

I'll also share an example (but not completely). I think the best example of a knot, for the sake of argument, is the James E West. Some refer to it as the "buy a knot award." There are numerous reasons for the knot to be presented to someone. Yes, it could be simply (if giving $1000 is a simple thing) a recognition for a donation. It could also be something given in honor for very personal reasons, and by someone very special to the recipient. It could well be someone's most prized knot because of the reason it was given. It's not for me or you or anyone else to judge the person wearing that knot.

BDPT00

"As far as the silver beaver is concerned that seems to be bought more than awarded in most of my years in scouting, in four different councils, and it does usually lead to a spot on the council exec committee."

Boy, not in this council. If you wear a blue jacket rather than a red one, you're at a distict disadvantage. Sounds like your selection committee is inbred and slanted. That should change.

BDPT00

Just a simple point: You have only one ticket.

BDPT00

I happen to like Beav's stance on this. People who argue try to do so with facts. Beav has people talking in circles. I'd say that puts him out front at the moment. If he's wrong, say so, and explain how or why.

The American Psychiatric whatever they call themselves seem to have the corner on the market regarding the genetic vs environmental argument, yet have absolutely no proof to back up their position. Once published, however, their position becomes fact for everyone else. Where's the beef?

The original question asked what it would take to change my mind. Proof would help.

BDPT00

I have no idea what it would take. I can tell you that there are plenty of things that would not have a positive impact on changing my mind, including comments regarding what is or is not natural. I guess I'm open-minded enough to say that something somewhere out there might change my mind, but I'm probably kidding myself to say that. Keep trying.

BDPT00

I seriously doubt that this would pass muster with the national committee.

BDPT00

I've never heard of it, and I'll make sure to put in my funeral instructions that it not to be used for me.

BDPT00

OK, so all that being said, how do you feel now about the Scout Shop trying to make a profit?

BDPT00

OT,

Sorry I have to explain it. Nothing was correct. The age was wrong. The rank thing was wrong. The sports thing was wrong (note Eagle92's post quoting from national ... "sports" is not mentioned). The point was ... ignore the post. It's incorrect.

BDPT00

Gary,

Please read my entire posting. I had quoted someone, then pointed out that it was incorrect. Find something in the post quoted that's correct, and I'll rescind my unproductive post. My concern was that someone reading it would end up with misinformation, and I couldn't think of a better way to say it without naming names. I guess there was really no easy way to do it. The posting was in error, and I wanted to point it out.

Try this instead: The posting by UCEagle72 is totally inaccurate. Please don't pay any attention to it.

I'll now add: In addition, pay close attention to Eagle 92's posting.

How's that?

BDPT00

"Varsity is a program centered around sports, and works off a sports theme. It is the same age group as Venturing (14-21) but I have never seen a Varsity team that was not connected with an LDS ward.

Just another way to keep older Scouts engaged. 14 year old First Class Scouts, who join a Varsity team, are allowed to continue working on advancement to Eagle until they reach 18."

*** Just in case someone is trying to learn something about Varsity Scouting, the above information is totally inaccurate and should be ignored.

BDPT00

Just for the fun of it...

Sherm (May I call you Sherm? Somehow, it just feels more friendly.),

Do you believe that the presence of female leaders in Scouting and OA has enhanced your ability to be an effective male role model for the Scouts, and if so, how?

It's true that some people feel that way. I don't happen to be one of them. Change takes time, and it often takes activists to make it happen. That's fine. Make some noise. I'm suggesting that the noise needs to be directed to the right ears. I won't be standing in the way if/when it ever happens. I just think the arguments are weak and often self-centered. I use "self-centered" because it's akin to the "close-minded" comment I'm assuming I'll soon hear. It depends upon the point of view. I've heard people for years saying that certain people should be allowed to do certain things. When that certain person gets older, the issue dies.

Go ahead and make noise. Be aware that you'll hear objections. Don't let up, but I'd suggest that calling people names or trying to insult them isn't the way to make changes. Instead, it causes people to dig in their heals. With the current leadership of this argument, you'll never get my support. Try something else, and I'll listen.

BDPT00