Ohio_Scouter

Lisabob,

I think that 13-14 is an OK age to run for SPL, but he really has to want it. My son was SPL in his troop for over 4 years, but he really wanted the job. IMHO, I think your son probably has enough to do with his new Venture Patrol--especially since it's just getting off the ground. My advice to him is to wait a couple of years, enjoy forming and experiencing his new patrol, and then decide on the SPL job later.

Scoutingmomma,

Sounds to me like your Council is trying to help your scouts and scouters learn the real meaning of the words "be prepared" . Happy camping!

Scoutingmomma,

All BSA Councils that I have been affiliated with over the last 50 years in Ohio have always provided tents for scouts at summer camp. They were mostly the old canvas-type tents with 1 horizontal ridge pole and 2 vertical end poles at either end of the tent set up on a wooden platform or on the ground over a plastic ground cloth. Not sure why your Council doesn't provide tents, but I would say that is highly unusual.

Hi Lisabob,

Look for sturdy, military style cots that fold down fairly small for ease of transport/storage. Eureka, Slumberjack, Coleman, and others make this type of cot normally in the $50-$100 price range. Rated capacity is about 300+ lbs., and properly cared for, they should last your troop a long time. Aluminum-frame cots are probably somewhat stronger/lighter than wood-frame cots.

Happy hunting!

Hi Lisabob,

The current scouts in our troop have never done a National Jamboree, so we can't give you a good, objective comparison between Jambo and HA, but we have done all 3 high adventure bases, and I'm here to tell you that memories from any one of those high adventures will last a lifetime, and the adventures were worth every penny we paid.

We also did one high adventure trip designed by our scouts to Yellowstone/Grand Teton National Parks, and it was just as memorable as--and significanly less expensive than--any of the 3 BSA high adventure bases.

Good luck and happy trails to you and your scouts. If you want to discuss more details on any of the high adventure trips, send me a PM .

I know it's a tough call, alleng1024. Since this scout was previously active in the troop and completed all the requirements for POR and service hours, if it were me, I would be inclined to let him ride and not levy any additional requirements. As soon as possible thereafter, however, I would enhance my program so that younger scouts wouldn't leave the troop prematurely.

Knothead,

We let our Venture Patrol design their own program in addition to and separate from our regular troop program. We allow the Venture Patrol to participate in the regular troop program if they want, and we recruit older scout volunteers to help out with the regular troop program, too.

Sometimes, the Venture Patrol program and the regular troop program campouts intersect at the same location. The younger scouts might do a 5 mile hike, and the Venture Patrol might do a 15 mile hike on a different trail, for example, camping and cooking with members of their Venture Patrol.

We believe this method helps keep it interesting for all involved and gives the younger scouts something even more exciting to look forward to when they mature as older scouts.

Our troop handles this issue with its Venture Patrol which gives the older guys some exciting things to do for their age group. Without our Venture Patrol and its associated high-adventure activities like caving, backpacking, boating, mountaineering, etc., I'm sure many of our older scouts would drop out of Scouting and find other more interesting things to do with their time.

I agree. I'm certain that it was a poor analogy--whatever the unknown implication may have been--and that more explanation from you will not help. You've said quite enough already.

Well, GAHillBilly, you've just offended me. Care to explain that remark in a bit more detail?

"3. Name the (usual) characteristics of three members of the Forum that you really appreciate having in your community."

Most of all, I really appreciate having the characteristics of trustworthiness, helpfulness, and courtesy in Forum community members. In addition to those, I appreciate humor .

Hi Lisa,

After a little more research on Northern Tier, I found that their winter OKPIK program has a Cabin Stay program for younger scouts.

This program is for younger scouts that are accompanying a group of older scouts, or visiting OKPIK on their own. Program includes skiing, snowshoeing, dog sled rides, and other winter activities. The group will stay in heated cabins and cook their meals outside. This program is open to any registered Scout youth member. The cost is $110.00 for the weekend, or $55.00 per day. Maybe this will work for your gang.

Check it out here:

http://www.ntier.org/okpik.html

Lisabob,

Our guys did Northern Tier in 2005 (Charles Rogert Canoe Base in Atikokan, Ontario, Canada). They thoroughly loved it, and we recommend it highly. As I recall, it was a high-adventure only base, and I don't know about the other Northern Tier bases.

FYI, the Greater Cleveland Area Council also has a high adventure canoe base located along the French River in Ontario, Canada. It's called Tinnerman Canoe Base, and here is a link to the leader's guide. Hope your guys find one that's right for you.

http://www.gccbsa.org/Forms/Tinnerman/2008_Leader_Guide.pdf

Now, that's a really great story, Fred !

Aw man ... and I just finished my 2012 Christmas shopping! When was that calendar mailed out, anyway?

Great story! I hope somebody finds and returns J.R.'s wallet, too.

John,

Here's an article about the recent Nalgene bottle issue from the Collegian Online at Penn State University, FYI...

The safety of Nalgene water bottles, which can be seen in stores downtown and attached to students backpacks, is being questioned after a controversial study said the bottles might cause adverse health effects.

The chemical Bisphenol-A (BPA) in Nalgenes line of polycarbonate containers which include the wide-mouth and narrow-mouth hard bottles has been linked to neurological and behavioral complications including breast and prostate cancer, diabetes, obesity and reproductive failures including miscarriages in animals, according to The Associated Press.

However, Nalgene officials urge consumers that their products are safe and have been so for years. An official statement released by Nalgene on its Web site states, We are confident that Nalgene polycarbonate bottles, which contain the chemical BPA, are safe for their intended use.

Nalgene has also said on its Web site that the Food and Drug Administration has concluded the bottles are safe to use.

Regardless, Nalgene has decided to eliminate bottles containing BPA because of consumer concern and has introduced an Everyday line, which contains BPA-free bottles.

Nalgene also launched a Choice information resource center that provides information about BPA and allows consumers to choose the product they think is best for them among BPA and BPA-free bottles.

Andrea Schwander (sophomore-geography), who uses a Nalgene bottle, said it is a good thing Nalgene is giving consumers information on the issues.

Without any information, I dont want to make any decisions, Schwander said. That would just make me ignorant if I just trust it without question.

Geoff Brugler, owner of Appalachian Ski & Outdoors, 123 S. Allen St., said he believes more research is needed before consumers can effectively make the choice about the bottles.

The problem with this situation is that all the information is on the Web and there is no way to authenticate it, Brugler said.

He added that if consumers are concerned, Appalachian Outdoors also carries a complete line of BPA-free bottles.

We are moving away from the BPA bottles for three main reasons: We dont want to sell anything that is unsafe, there are a lot more alternatives to choose from and finally, we want to be able to respond to what consumers are looking for, Brugler said.

At Rapid Transit Sportswear, 115 S. Allen St., where Nalgenes are also sold, owner Terry Losch said he hasnt received any direct information from the Nalgene Corporation that the bottles are unsafe.

Once we receive notification, we will immediately pull them off the shelves, Losch said.

Penn State Bookstore assistant store manager Rebecca Brouwer said she is also waiting for notification before they pull the bottles off the shelves for good. However, she added that she doesnt know when that will be.

BPA is one of the most widely used synthetic materials in the world and is also found in dental sealant, baby bottles, food can liners, CDs, DVDs, eyeglasses and other household goods, according to The AP.

The Nalgene bottles in question are the hard polycarbonate bottles including brands loop-tops, N-Gen, OTG, Oasis, Grip n Gulp and mini-grip.

They are especially popular for their durable plastic and variety of colors, according to Nalgenes Web site.

yeahbut, I'll take Ed's word over the BSA Website every time .

Check out this recruiting advice from Kudu who has had remarkable success recruiting older scouts.

http://inquiry.net/adult/recruiting.htm

If you want to hear about things that just make you smile, check out the "Scouts say the darndest things" thread from early March, 2008.

My personal favorite was related by gwd-scouter reproduced below:

RE: Scouts say the darndest things

Posted: Sunday, 3/2/2008: 2:28:35 AM quality

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Summer camp a couple of years ago. New Scout wasn't feeling well when he went to bed. I was sitting up late in the campsite when the Scout appeared, walked calmly to the trashcan and vomited. He looked up at me on his way back to the cabin and very seriously said, "sometimes a guy's just gotta barf."

Looks like CalicoPenn has the last word , although mine was in the dictionary.

zyzzyva

After a lot of research, our troop just bought several Eureka Alpenlite 2XT 4-season tents. They weigh about 7.5 lbs each, and can be used as backpacking tents year round by 2 scouts each splitting the gear in their packs. Unfortunately, they are a bit expensive, about $240.00 each brand new from Eureka, but our guys swear by them. Good luck!

Other than attending BSA high adventure base trips, our Venture Patrol likes to do a lot of backpacking, cycling, canoeing, white-water rafting, climbing, rapelling, and caving within about a 4-hour driving radius of Dayton, OH. One of our favorites is a backpacking/rapelling/caving trip to Red River Gorge, KY, or the Great Saltpetre Cave, KY.

This summer, our guys are doing a 400-500 mile self-designed high-adventure cycling trip from Cincinnati, OH to Erie, PA along part of the Underground Railway bicycle trail.

Lisabob,

Our troop has a fairly active Venture Patrol and high adventure program for our older scouts as well as a car-camping program for our younger scouts. Our position is that the Troop funds all non-personal equipment for all scouts irregardless.

We understand that high adventure and backpacking gear can be expensive given the need for lightweight tents, backpacking stoves, water purifiers, caving gear, climbing harnesses, helmets, ropes, descenders, ascenders, etc. We encourage our scouts to acquire their own backpack, sleeping bag, pad, personal first-aid kit, and other personal gear that they might want to acquire on their own.

We are fortunate in that our Troop has found ways through various fund raisers to generate several thousand dollars each year to support such programs. In our case, the Troop owns all the Troop-acquired gear and, with committee authorization, replaces it whenever it wears out, or when new gear is required.