ASM162

The tour permit was short a boy and a leader that would be on the tour. Once out of pocket expenses were submitted to the insurance company, it was brought to the District committee's attention that oops -- the unit's insurance was null because the boy in the accident was the boy left off the permit.

While they couldn't actually tell that, the form wasn't filled out correctly, and the CO ended up paying for the medical expenses.

This just seems like dirty pool to me.

How did the District Committee determine that the injured party was actually the one left off of the Tour Permit?

I would think that many units have found themselves in this type of situation where the Tour Permit is not accurate as far as a total head count is concerned.

There are instances when a boy gets sick the day of departure, and can't make the outing. There are also instances where Johnny changes his plans and wants to go on the outing now, because his baseball game got cancelled.

In either case, the TP that was submitted is not accurate. Does it really have to be? I mean, if the transportation requirements are still adequate, and things like 2 deep leadership, Safe Swim Defense/ Safety Afloat, Weather hazards, etc are still met, doesa it really matter if the tour permit says 15 boys, but 14 or 16 actually make the trip?

Also, what if one of the drivers has to use a different vehicle than what was listed on the tour permit? (i.e vehicle being repaired).

I mean, as long as there are enough seat belts, and driver has current and adequate insurance on said vehicle, does this pose a problem?

Many things can change between the time that the tour permit is filed and when you are leaving for the outing.

I couldn't imagine cancelling an outing just because of an inaccurate Tour Permit.

Our Troop has a continuous fundraiser, in that we buy gift cards from the local grocery store at 5% less than face value.

In other words, the troop pays $95.00 for a $100.00 gift card.

The CC takes gift card orders from the parents in the Troop, plus a few friends of the Troop, once a month. The cost to those who purchase the card(s) is, of course, the face value of the card(s). The CC then places the order for the gift cards with the grocery store. The CC then distributes the cards when they are delivered.

It works out very well, since we all go to the grocery store, and we have to spend the money anyway. It is just helping ourselves and our sons. The Troop makes enough money from this one fundraiser to pay for the monthly outings for the boys.

I respectfully submit the foloowing for your consideration.

The Patriot - Set during the American Revolution. Stars Mel Gibson and Heath Ledger.

Glory - Set during the Civil War. Subject is the first all black regiment to engage in battle during the Civil War. Stars Matthew Broderick and I believe Denzel Washington.

If time wasn't a constraint, I'd recommend Gettysburg.

I can't figure out after watching him, why service hours are so hard to find for some of the others. He does share his experiences with the others but they aren't taking the hint.

Gunny-

I think you answered your own question here.

Some youth only tend to think of themselves, and not others. I constantly remind the boys that there are opportunities for service all around them. they just need to take the initiative to volunteer. Some just won't take that step, for whatever reason.

To stay on topic, I would accept the service hours of the youth in question, so long as he is not a Den Chief for the said Den.

AnneinMpls,

Thank you! Those are the lyrics to the song. This past weekend was the first time I had heard this song, and I thoght that it was very appropriate to the setting, and life in general.

moxieman,

Thank you very much for the info. I'll keep that in mind.

All of us who attended the camporee are trying to jog our memories as to what the lyrics to the rhyme was about the pretty prairie flower. For me, at least, its tough to try and remember a rhyme, after only hearing it once.

I did send an e-mail to the camporee chairman, in hopes that he will know what I'm talking about. As for now, I want to thank you for the information.

Hi all,

We just had the Troop spend a weekend camping with several Canadian Scouting units. A very enjoyable weekend. A lot of frienship and fellowship, based on the foundation of scouting.

Anyway, there were two songs sung by the Canadian scouts at this camporee. One was a very moving song that I believe was titled "At the loose" (I'm not sure that it is the correct title).

The other song was actually borderline hazing. If a scout or scouter lost an item, and the item was found sometime during camp, the person who lost the item had to "assume the position" (which was placing their index finger on the crown of their head, and prepare to twirl around), and then sing a song that I believe started out as "I'm a pretty prairie flower,(somethin' somethin') by the hour..." It could have been "I'm a pretty little flower..."

The little rhyme ended with requesting the item that was lost.

If anyone has a clue as to what I'm talking about, and you know the lyrics, please let me know what they are.

Thank you all.

The kids have to realize that the bugs mean them no harm. this has to start at an early age, preferrably when the scouts go to day camp as tigers and wolves. It helps if the parents don't freak out as well.

We had a boy at Summer camp. Sleeping in wall tents, he found that the daddy long leg spiders liked to share the same quarters. Totally freaked out. He damn near bathed in insect repellent. Still no good. His disillusionment with all things insect like came to a head, and long story short, he ended up quitting the Troop, and convinced his WEBELOS scout brother to not bother joining Boy Scouts, because of all the bugs he would encounter on a camping trip.

As adult leaders, we were dumbfounded, as to how a youth who gets so worked up with insects, could have ever wanted to join scouts in the first place; and for that matter, why did his folks let him join scouts if he can't handle the sight of insects and spiders and such. The kids just need to gradually get a feel for the place that the bugs play in nature, and slowly become comfortable being around them, and the place for that to start, in my opinion, is the home.

I think this is great. I intend to watch this with my son.

One question: Is the "Outdoor Channel" the same as "Versus"?

I ask because I used to get the Outdoor Channel, but at some point it became Versus. I don't know if the cable company changed it or if the Outdoor Channel just changed it's name.

On my very first campout with the Troop, I was sent to go and find a left handed smoke shifter. The older guys in the Troop told me that they thought that the Troop at the next campsite might have one, and to ask if we could borrow it. This, of course, played out with me making the rounds to various campsites asking if they had a left handed smoke shifter. At the last stop that I made, the SM of the Troop handed me this stove pipe type contraption that had an elbow on it, that if you held it just the right way, the smoke from any campfire would "shift to the left, and away from your face."

Well, imagine the surprise on the faces of the older guys when I came back with said smoke shifter

Anyway, this helped to prepare me for some hi-jinx that some "seasoned construction workers" tried to play on me as I was just a general laborer on the job, and only 17.(Summer job). I was asked to go find skyhooks, left-handed monkey wrenches, pails of steam, and of course the polka-dotted paint. I used this time to venture off-site and grab a quick drink, or snack, and then return with a puzzled look on my face, and with a sense of despair, would say that I couldn't find what they were looking for. After a while, my little secret was discovered, and no one seemed upset that I used that time to my advantage. I think it actually helped me gain a bit of respect with the guys on the crew. Anyway, the point that I am trying to make is that Snipe Hunting and all of the other pranks can be actually good life lessons for a young man IF DONE IN A GOOD NATURED WAY WITH RESPECT TO THE VICTIM OF THE PRANK! There are scam artists everywhere, and having a life experience that may make you question whether something is legitimate or not can be a good thing in the long run.

Thanks for the follow-up.

Now this is a great story, and shows good karma!

One good turn creates another.

Found this this AM.

Really lifted my spirits!

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/24389984/?GT1=43001

Thanks for the info.

The Council that I'm in is not super large - 2 counties, 3 districts.

I was thinking that a DD was kind of a "make work" position for someone who wanted to move up the professional ranks,but the SE didn't quite know where to put him/her; but I do see it now as a position for a senior DE to move into, as his professional career progresses.

Thanks again - the info is greatly appreciated.

As stated in the title of this post, I am wondering what are the duties of a District Director. As far as I know, the DD is not part of the Key 3. (I could be wrong.). It seems to me to be a position for someone who is perhaps too valuable to let go, but not "seasoned" enough for a Scout Executive position. YMMV

GW,

This is a great post!

In the same vein, I'd like to add that BSA National does a poor job of advertising Scouting. I'd like to know why BSA doesn't have commercials on TV/Radio ala Project S.O.A.R., BoyPower/ManPower. I think that BSA can have success in attracting youth with the current Good Turn for America and the Emergency Preparedness Award.

I also don't understand why there are not any new movies that depict boys in a scouting environment. Why is there no remake of "Follow Me Boys"?

You need to hit these kids where they live. When a boy has the latest "Guitar Hero" video game, why isn't there an insert selling scouting and the music merit badge? Same with Madden Football; include an insert in the packaging promoting scouting and the sports/ athletics mb?

I do think that part of the reason for dwindling numbers is the fact that the size of families has changed over the last 50 yrs. Today, the typical family size is four. You don't see families of 6 to 8 or larger that much anymore. When you consider that most of the youth today are in the scouting program because their father was in the program as a youth; it becomes apparent that smaller families = smaller numbers for BSA; especially if the offspring are all girls.

If BSA wants to attract more youth, they must advertise! We can only do so much at the local level.

Pargolf44067,

Our Troop ran into this situation about 2 weeks ago. Our SM cancelled the outing, due to adverse driving conditions. Our destination was about 2 hours away.

He did wait until the morning of the outing,to make the cancellation, as we were planning to leave in the late afternoon.

Things to consider:

1). Are you sure that each vehicle is capable of winter travel? (i.e snow tires, good tread vs. bald, etc.)

2). How do the other adults feel about driving in the said winter storm conditions?

3.) If you do decide to travel, and the designated route ends up being shutdown, are you, or someone in the group, familiar enough with the area to know how to get around the blocked route? This may add significant time to travelling.

It wasn't a total disater that we didn't go. At the next Troop Meeting, the PLC decided to add this outing to the March schedule.

Do your Scout Parents really know....everything that is required for their sons to have a program?

For the most part, I would say No. When a new scout wants to join our Troop, the SM and CC will sit down with the parents and explain how the Troop functions. A request will then go out as to have them come on board as a committee member or ASM. This mostly falls on deaf ears. The response typically is "Let me see how things go, and I'll get back to you." The impression that I get is one of, "Hey, the Troop is being run OK, I'll just sit back and let you guys and gals do your thing."

Is your committee fully staffed? Are they trained?

No, we do not have a fully staffed committee. This is due to several reasons:

1). One of the ASM's stores all of the Troop equipment. I know that the CO is supposed to do this, but they are limited in space. Therefore, this ASM takes on the additional duty of Equipment coordinator.

2). The SM has a running list of the registered vehicles of each Family in the troop. This includes the requied insurance info and the no. of belts, Driver's license no., etc. The outings are divided among the (5) ASM's of the Troop. So whoever is the lead adult for a particular outing, is also responsible for filling out the tour permit, and doing the legwork to reserve sites, obtain permits, plan the itinerary, etc. We do not have an outings coordinator.

3). We do not have a registered Chaplain in the Troop. The Troop Chaplain's Aide is responsible for any religious duties.

4). We do have a Committee Chair, Secretary, a treasurer, and an advancement chairperson on our committee. There are also presently (2) at-large committee members.

5). All committee members are trained and the SM and 3 of 5 ASM's are fully trained. (including YPT). I wish that we could get all of the ASM's trained, but conflicting work schedules and training dates come into play, and that is why we have two guys still to be trained.

This seems to work for us in the present configuration. It is not ideal, but the adult leadership that is involved is very driven to help the troop provide a decent program.

Do you have enough Assistant Scoutmasters? Is there enough parental involvement for outings?

We have never had to worry about enough ASM's for an outing. Usually 3 of the 5 ASM's plus the SM are on every trip and/or outing. There is a standing invitation to all of the parents, that they are welcome to join us on any and all outings. Typically, we have only one taker who goes with the Troop on just about every outing. So far, 2-Deep leadership has not been a problem.

If so, how did you get it to be that way?

This is the way that it has been for several years now.(I know that is not a good reason. ) There have been some personality clashes that have caused some parents to not bother with becoming a committee member or ASM. Some only want to come and help with a COH, and not be bothered with anything else. As an ASM, I would really like to see each parent have some sort of "job" within the Troop.

If not, have you communicated your needs? Do you know what your needs are?

Yes, the needs of the Troop have been communicated to every parent, and usually at least once a month in the newsletter.

I think that we have a good handle on what our needs are. I believe that we are adequately expressing the needs of the Troop to the parents. We have discussed getting an Outdoor Activities Coordinator and an Equipment Coordinator, to help take some of the burden off of the shoulders of the SM and ASM's. We'll see if we can recruit any of the new parents who are joing our Troop now.

Since we have just past this great day this year; one in which we are told to expect six more weeks of winter, I will gladly suggest "Groundhog Day"!

As for the boys choosing the movie and getting approval from the MB counselor, I believe that it is wise to have a list of movies to provide suggestions to the lad. It seems like the boys want to "Loosely" relate an action movie that they just saw, or was just released, to the requirement of the MB.

I think an interesting trip would be a backpacking adventure in Alaska!

It would be fun to hike into a valley, with a stream full of salmon, and catch and cook your meals! It would also keep you on your toes, so as to be aware of your surroundings, and prepare yourself for sudden changes in weather, as well as any wildlife encounters. (READ BEARS!).

After the adventure in the wild is complete, the trip can begin to wind down with a boat excursion in one of Alaska's many harbors. Here you will be able to see and appreciate the aquatic life. It takes my breath away just thinking about seeing hundreds of Bald Eagles soaring in the sky. Maybe even being fortunate enough to see whales! All of the seals and sea lions sunning themselves on rocky shores. This would cretainly be a trip that would not be forgotten.

I want to thank you all for the comments and suggestions.

I plan to have a pre summer camp PLC scheduled before the Troop goes to camp. It is here that the PLC can discuss the pros and cons considering participation in any or all of the activities/projects that are involved with the Troop Award of Excellence.

It will be interesting to see how the current SM reacts when the PLC makes their decision. I hope that he can just take a step back and take pride in the fact that the scouts made a decision and are going to abide by that decision, regardless of the outcome. I mean, it certainly is not the end of the world if the Troop does not earn the TAE.

It is the boys' summer camp,their experience, and I don't want to take any fun away from these guys. I want to watch them have fun with their program at summer camp.

Again, thank you!

I am becoming the SM of our Troop when we recharter in February. The current SM is stepping down to ASM, because he wants to concetrate on supporting the Venturing Crew that he started about a year ago. (He is the Crew advisor). Before I begin, I would like to state that I have a lot of respect for this man. He took on the position of SM when no one was willing to step up, and the troop has been quite successful with him at the helm.

Since I have been with the Troop, the SM has always 'pushed' the boys to earn the Troop Award of Excellence (TAE) during the week we spend at summer camp. Part of earning the TAE is that each patrol must compete in a certain number of the offered campwide games. (There are other requirements, such as the SM making sure that all necessary paperwork is turned in by a certain date, have so many scouts earn a merit badge during the week, perform a conservation project, etc.).

It has been brought to my attention that several of the boys in the Troop would rather forgo the campwide games, and do other things in that allotted time, things like playing UNO with the other guys in the Troop. Basically have more Troop time.

I am OK with this, as I see it as something the PLC should discuss and make a decision about. I do not believe that the adult leaders should have anything to add to this.

However, the current SM is of the opinion that if the Troop earns the TAE, it shows that we have fully participated in the Camp Program, and that it sends a message to the parents of the boys that their money was well spent. He makes a good point.

I am of the opinion that Summer Camp is for the scouts. If they desire to earn the TAE, they will agree to do it, and work to that end. If they choose not to, it is their loss, and they will not be recognized at the closing campfire.

Please understand that the requirements to earn the TAE are not difficult, but they can be time consuming, especially for the SPL and the PL's.

I guess what I am trying to get at is that if I continue in the same vein as the current SM, the adults will be happy, but the scouts will again complain that this is being adult led, rather than boy led. If I choose to let the boys have the summer camp experience that they want to have, I risk the possibilty of having to deal with disgruntled adult leaders and parents.

Please share your thoughts --- thanks.(This message has been edited by ASM162)

How about "Armageddon"?

Two teams (patrols)with the common goal of saving the world from devastation.

Shows team building, teamwork, problem solving and making tough decisions.

I do not know what it is rated, but it is a good movie!

Another good movie is "Miracle on Ice".

The story of the 1980 US Olympic Hockey Team.

Again, team building and team work to achieve the goal of winning the Gold medal.

Of course, there is one movie out there that in it's own off-the-wall way shows team work and problem solving....

"KISS and the Attack of the Phantom of the Park"

915,

Yes, they were homing pigeons. It was amazing to us that the birds could find their way home; usually beating us back home during training flights! The tough part was coaxing the birds to get back into the coop. The faster they made their way into the 'trap', the quicker we could clock their time.

Those birds that didn't make the cut usually ended up on the dinner plate

My grandfather had birds that would fly from Cincinati, OH; South Bend, IN; and as far away as St. Louis, Mo. to their home coop in SW Pennsylvania. We always helped him on 'lookout' when the birds were due back. I remember him always worrying that a champion bird might fall prey to a hawk, or some other such fate. Once the bird(s) made it home, we had to lure the bird into the trap, usually with food and water, so that it could be clocked in.

Times were recorded and submitted to the Pittsburgh Southern Combine. Fastest birds were awarded trophies. (Owners kept the trophies!)Very neat competition! Always fun and interesting to see how your own birds measured up against others.

ASM915

Marinated Squab was a delicacy in our humble household. With 10 people under one roof, (and only one bathroom ), it helped the family budget to have the squab for meals on occasion. My grandfather was an excellent cook, and I learned alot from him that pertained to scouting, and outdoor cooking.

Amazing how one merit badge opens the door to learn, and become familiar with other scouting /life skills.

Eamonn,

Thanks for the link to the NE Venturing website.

Looks like a lot of good info, especially for a Crew such as ours, that is new and still becoming familiar with the Venturing Program.

Without knowing the details of your budget, and the logistics of the cabin, etc. I would offer that in addition to the open fire, where you can cook on the coals; you may want to consider purchasing a couple of bags of charcoal, and set up additional 'cooking stations' for the foil pack meals. Of course, you will want to follow Leave No Trace, and utilize either established fire rings or bring along metal trash can lids and place the charcoal in the lids.