Driver responsibility for Cub Scout Packs

[3GuysMom 10]

Are there safe driving requirements for Cub Scout Pack parents who transport Scouts? This morning I saw 3 or 4 Cubs riding in the back of a minivan with their legs dangling out of the vehicle. The committee chair was the driver.

If I discuss this with him I want to know what official regs back me up, or I may come off as just an overprotective mother hen.

I have a boy in the Pack but I do not have an official position.

 

Advice please?

 

3GuysMom

[scoutldr 732]

Everyone must be in a seat with a seatbelt on.

 

http://www.scouting.org/HealthandSafety/GSS/toc.aspx

 

[FScouter 24]

Also, see the back side of the tour permit.

http://www.scouting.org/filestore/pdf/34426.pdf

 

[packsaddle 753]

What they said and by they way, Welcome to the Forums!

It varies from state-to-state but I know that in some states it is illegal to transport minors in that manner. As a matter of fact in at least one it is potentially a felony - child endangerment. You might brush up on your traffic laws before having that conversation.

 

I once did this while cubmaster years ago: I had a local police officer visit a committee meeting to go over the law enforcement take on transporting minors. It sobered some of the cowboy types and kept me from having to be the bad guy. I even learned a thing or two - you might give it a try.

[John-in-KC 311]

What everyone else has said.

 

When I was a COR I had a new Scouter app cross my table. The person had a DWI. I talked with my Professionals about it. Put a condition on the membership ... may not drive youth other than own child to Den/Pack meeting, and could not drive other youth period.

 

THe new leader accepted that as reasonable, as did the committee chair.

[Gold Winger 9]

A DWI conviction doesn't bother me as much it might bother some. I know of too many horror stories involving over zealous enforcement of that law. A friend (not his real name) was busted and convicted because he knew that he was drunk so decided to sleep in the parking lot rather than drive home. A cop came along, "What are you doing here?" Sleeping sir because I can't drive. "Out of the car long hair, you're going with me."

 

In Virginia about 20 years back there was a fellow busted for drinking a beer while working on his car. He too was convicted because the judge decided that since the engine was running, "he was operating a motor vehicle." Another hapless Virginian was convicted because he was mowing his lawn on a lawn tractor whilst drinking a beer. Not too smart but most of us wouldn't think it was arrest worthy. Urban myths? I used to know the attorney who represented both men.

 

DUI/DWI arrest? I'd worry more about the guy who hasn't been caught and shows up with beer on his breath.

 

Back to the subject at hand. This is the 21st century. The days of riding a Scout troop to a campout in the back of a stake bed truck are gone. Seatbelts are the in thing. Six kids and only five belts, you need another driver.

 

 

 

Back to the topic at hand.

[packsaddle 753]

Opposite experiences in these parts. DUI/DWI convictions are extremely hard to get and then the punishment is a simple fine, even for multiple infractions. I admit I'm biased...a drunk nearly killed my entire family. BAC 0.35, also loaded with Xanax. Long history of drunkeness and drug abuse, even known to have had previous 'incidents' by the insurance company.

My family was on their way to school at 0800. He crossed the centerline and hit them head on.

We spent years with attorneys and surgeries and many thousands of dollars on medical stuff. My wife is permanently impaired in her ability to walk.

He paid a $200 fine and went on to flight school. Have a nice day.

 

[SctDad 10]

I can see where everyone is coming from.

 

On the topic, Children in seat belts or booster seats if the law requires them. Cut and dry. Either way they still have on a seat belt. That is the way it is in my vehicle and I hope that my parents do it the same way.

 

My 2 cents on the DUI/DWI. Look at the situation. Did the person disclose it. Was he honest. Is he a repeat offender or was it an isolated incident. How long ago did this happen. THese are things that I would take into consideration.

[Gold Winger 9]

Wow! .35 and only a fine. That's amazing but maybe I shouldn't be surprised.

 

About 15 years ago a niece was killed while walking home in her neighborhood. The unlicensed teen was celebrating his 16th birthday and was so drunk that even after they cut him out of the car, he wasn't aware that he had wrecked. I think that his BAC was close to .5

 

Being a minor he was given community service and none of the responsible adults could be shown to be responsible so no one went to jail.

 

I know you can't admit it here but did you take a baseball bat to the guy's skull?

 

 

[nldscout 18]

Time to get on my soap box on this one

 

Speaking as a judge who see drivers arrested for DWI/DUI all the time. Driving under the influence is a CRIME, no ifs ands or buts. No excuses, no well it was my forst time, BULL!!! The first time your arrested is just the first time you got caught.

 

DWI is a serious crime, and until people stop rationalizing it, it will never be taken seriously. If you bicked up the paper and read that 5-10 or what ever got arrested everyday for stealing everyone would be screaming bloody murder to have more police and stricter enforcement. You need to wake up and smell the roses if you don't think DWI is not a serious problem.

 

 

 

 

[scoutingagain 20]

Trying to answer the question at hand and forgetting about the DUI stuff for now.

 

Driving around with a car load of kids, legs dangling outside the car is illegal, and I might even consider it child endangerment. I'd discuss this with the driver, status as CC is not material, nor as far as I'm concerned are the G2SS requirements. This is irresponsible and illegal behavior on the part of the adult and he should told so. I would do so politely at first, as the point is to get him to change his behavior, not bust him on violating a rule or even a law. Sit down with him and simply ask him, does he think it's a good idea? If he knew his son was in a car where the driver deliberately disobeyed legal safety requirements for children, how would he feel? Where would he draw the line? No seatbelt? Driving 90mph? What would he do? How would he feel if one of the boys were killed or permanently disable in an accident while he was driving? Use of a seatbelt will substantially reduce that possibility.

 

He needs to see how his actions put the boys at risk, violated the law and how serious they were. Once he realizes this he won't do it again. If he does, then you can bring up laws, rules, and bring it to the attention of the committee overall and possibly the chartered organization rep. The chartered organization rep can put a restriction on his membership status as John-in-KC described. If he violates it, the COR can remove him from the Pack with a letter to council as to why.

 

Oh, and welcome to the forums. Good question. Hope you get the input you need.

 

SA