Volunteer question - remember, feedback is a gift

[tcherven]

I''ve been with my older son''s troop for 6 months as a committee member, 4 as secretary.

 

Today, I had the committee chair approach me and ask if I wanted to be the Scoutmaster. The fact that I''ve been through Wood Badge influenced him in that decision.

 

He thinks I would be an asset to the troop, especially since I did not come from the affiliated pack. He figures it puts me outside any cliques that have developed. The troop is moving to Boy Lead, but he wants someone who can really help it along.

 

I''ve also become the Tiger Den Leader for my younger son, but I do have a co-den leader.

 

My original thought was to become an Assistant Scoutmaster when my younger son joined the troop, and if needed Scoutmaster. The committee chair just fast-forwarded my plans by five years.

 

The troop has some active parents who do a great job.

 

I''d like to do this, I''m just wondering if the timing is off a bit. I was never a boy scout as a youth, and I''ve only been with the troop for 6 months.

 

Pros and Cons of being a scoutmaster?

How much time does it really take? Is it still the hour per week (per position per scout)?

Who''s a good person to talk to?

 

Thanks so much.

 

Tom C

C-44-06 Fox

[Lisabob]

"Who''''s a good person to talk to?"

 

The previous Scoutmaster? (unless this is a coup to overthrow him)

SMs of some other troops that you think do a great job?

A Unit Commissioner whose perspective you appreciate and trust?

Your WB patrol mates, if any of them have experience with troops? Members of other WB patrols, if your own patrol lacks that background?

Your WB TG or other WB staffers?

 

 

 

 

[Beavah]

Yah, it''s a bit early, eh? Usually I''d advise a couple of years of participatin'' as an ASM before you go for the bigger hat. I''d want to know what was up with the current SM, and why the committee wanted to go with an inexperienced adult (albeit a trained one). Before you take a job, make sure you know the backstory you''re goin'' to be walkin'' in on.

 

But there''s always the chance that someone worse will get the job

 

Ask your district for the names and contact information for the three best troops in your district that have a size similar to your son''s troop. Then go buy those SM''s lunch. Then go visit a meeting and an outing. Find one of ''em who seems like a close fit for you personality-wise, and who runs a program that''s a good fit for what you want to accomplish. If yeh do decide to take the big hat, make a standing appointment for lunch to talk scouting every month or two with this "mentor."

 

Second, sit with the CC and outline what exactly you want from da committee. No time to negotiate like the present. Get ''em to commit while they''re trying to recruit you - pay for additional outdoor skills training, set length of term, expectations for support. Get ''em all on the same page before you get goin''.

 

Beavah

 

[Oak Tree]

I agree with Beavah''s point about negotiating. And one point that may or may not apply in your situation - be clear on what the role of the former Scoutmaster should be. If he was at all controversial, and is still hanging around, I''d ask the CC to ask him to step away from the unit.

 

Your prior plan was a good one, although five years is more of a learning curve than most of us get. But six months is less. I would normally suggest you should see a minimum of one year - it''s good to get a feeling for all the troop''s current operation.

 

If there are cliques, that''s not an ideal situation. Normally if I were CC, I''d want someone from the affiliated pack. You''d expect that they should have good relationships with more of the parents and kids. So there are some red flags here (well, maybe not red, perhaps just pink flags). But I agree with Beavah on this point, too...they might get someone worse.

 

Perhaps you''ve really impressed the CC with your common sense, great attitude, and willingness to help. You could be a great SM. But it is odd that there''s no one more experienced who''s a good candidate for the job. You are really inexperienced at the troop level, although you clearly have pretty much all the training and base knowledge that you need. How big is the troop?

 

How much time will it take?

That will largely depend on you, how much you want to put into it, how much you want to delegate, and how able you are to find additional volunteers.

 

Who to talk to?

Anyone you trust. All of Lisa''s and Beavah''s suggestions are good. Heck, you could even find someone on this forum whose advice you like, and PM them.

[tcherven]

Well, it''s nice to know I''ve been doing some things right.

 

The first group of people I approached for feedback was my Wood Badge patrol. I''ve already received emails from most of them - 2 of them were in Troop leadership positions when we went through the course.

 

The situation is actually quite simple: The current Scoutmaster has been in the position for 3 years, and is now in the process of starting a new business. That''s a venture that takes a lot of effort and time. He feels he cannot contribute to the troop as he should, and so has stepped down. The previous Scoutmaster, who has now the troop''s Eagle Coach, has agreed to resume the Scoutmaster position until the next recharter, which is still 4 1/2 months off.

 

I''m not too worried about the "clique" issue. I think that what was meant is that there are some friendships that have developed over time, and sometimes the power gets too concentrated among a few people.

 

As far as my 5 year plan, that''s when my younger son would have joined the troop. After all, I want to spend time with him as his den leader.

 

I think part of the reason I was approached is that I''ll be affiliated with the troop for at least 10 more years, so I''m going to be around for awhile. I asked the committee chair how long he''s been thinking of me, and he said since I joined. I think the current Scoutmaster stepping down changed the CC''s time table as well. Another comment he made, is if I would like to wait a bit, he would find some one else for a year or two, and then move me into the position. (He''s doing some talking to others as well).

 

Our committee chair is excellent, and does his job very well. The committee is very strong, and there are many active adults helping out in many ways. I certainly wouldn''t want to change that. However, the move to boy-led is an big and important step for the troop. I think the CC feels I understand how that''s supposed to work, and that I would be committed to that process. He also believes, (and I do to), that if I took the position the adult leadership would be strong supporters.

 

I believe in the program. My main concerns are the time it would take. Like I mentioned, I have a younger son who has seen me spend 5 years in a den leader position with my older son. I want to make sure I give him the time as well. I just found out that I was given a ninth Tiger scout for the den. I have one parent who is also a registered leader, and a couple of parents who have let me know that they''ll help if I want them to.

 

Yesterday, I was leaning toward saying yes. Now I''m leaning toward waiting another year. The only problem with waiting a year, is the number of changes in Scoutmasters for the troop. I''m not sure if that would be healthy.

 

Sorry for the length, but I hope this answers some of the questions. You have definately given me some things to think about. I like Beavah''s comment about negotiating with the committee before giving an answer.

 

Thanks again,

 

Tom

C-44-06 (Fox)

[Gunny2862]

Tom, in the Scouting world I''m a newbie, March/April ''07, no prior experience as a Scout or in Cubs. Yet due to circumstances in the troops past leadership I was asked, after going to one summer camp and three monthly outings and a whole slew of training(that I had to dig to find out when, and where and what I needed), to put on the hat. I''m still trying to get IOLS, next available in Spring ''08.

 

No one else would step up, no one thought they were a better candidate. The committee was solid that I was in fact a selection and not just the only one available.

 

It doesn''t take a whole lot of time IF, you have a good committee who are doing the parts they should, IF you have an existing program that has been well run, IF you are semi-organized.

 

If I had your experience, I would base my decision on the personal aspects of how it would affect my boys, and I would ask them about it. You could actually consider taking your new Scout into the Troop with you as SM and go back with the older son to be an ACM and Den Chief(your older son will probably progress faster than you think)to be with your younger son and do both as long as the meeting times don''t overlap. The older son doesn''t have to be the younger sons Den Chief. And he wouldn''t necessarily have to stay with the pack until the younger son moved up. I''m not sure what the time frame would be - is it a five year gap? If you do choose this course consider if you are willing to give that kind of time over the long haul.

 

Good luck and PM'' me if you wish.

 

 

[Eagledad]

Hi tcherven

 

How much experience and knowledge do you have about scouting? What was your experience as a youth?

 

I also was involved with my younger sons pack while I was a SM. It worked out OK one my wife set the ground rules.

 

Personally, I dont feel Wood Badge is that big of an advantage. Understand I was on several WB staffs, so I understand the course. WB to me is excellent at understanding how to build a team and seeing your goals, but other then that I would get your CC to take the course and you guys would be a great team.

 

For a first time SM, it takes even the best adult three years to really learn and understand the position to be fully productive. If you have and understanding of Aims and Methods, and I mean a real understanding of those guidelines, goals and objectives, then I think you could handle the task because the rest is on the job training anyway. So long as you know what you want the scouts to gain in character, fitness and citizenship while they are in your troop, then youve got the hardest part out of the way.

 

The only other thing I would like to add is on average, a volunteer typically burns out in two years. Many will push themselves to three if needed, but those who perform best after that time are usually motivated by passion, which I think describes a lot of us here on this forum. Im not sure you can really know what kind of person you are until that time, but you might consider that. I have a friend who like you was an ASM in his older sons troop at the same time a CM in his younger sons pack. He was also on several training staffs. He had always planned to be a SM when his younger son joined a troop and did become one. He is doing OK in his second year of scoutmastering, but he doesnt enjoy it much anymore and would really like to step back to ASM. He has been a full time scouter for almost 15 years now and well, passion isnt even pulling him through now. You are about to eat, sleep, drink, talk, dream scouting for the next several years. Can you make it to 10 years? Can your wife?

 

Good luck and know that we are with you no matter what you decide because we love this scouting stuff and we want no less for you.

 

Barry

 

[AvidSM]

When I started to get involved, a long-time Scouter gave me some good advice, "when it''s no longer fun, stop doing it". You must project yourself into the position, look at the people you will be dealing with and ask yourself, will I enjoy this? Will I get some satisfaction out of my efforts? You are going to have to put up with parents and scouts who will sometimes drive you nuts. And, at times, it will seem like you are the only person who cares.

 

I cannot say how many hours a week you will give. It will depend on the support from others and how far you need to go to get to "boy run". I''ll I can say for sure is that no one will be giving up more time to the troop than you and it will take away from your "family time".

 

You will learn mostly by doing, which means you will make mistakes. It should take two to three years, as Eagledad mentions. The funny thing is, you will probably be the only person who will know about the mistakes you''ll make. I would hope that you will last longer in the position than the time it takes for you to get good at it.

[Hunt]

There are lots of pros and cons, but think of it this way: you have an opportunity to do something that will be a benefit to both of your sons, as well as a host of other boys, for 10 years, or maybe even longer.

[tcherven]

I knew I came to the right place.

 

My Wood Badge patrol mates had some things for me to think about, as does everyone here.

 

When I look back to my cubmaster days, I was starting to feel burned out in my fourth year. I think now that it was because our parent volunteer base was small, and I picked up the missing pieces. I was the den leader, cubmaster, popcorn kernal, advancement chair, webmaster, and the push behind the committee chair.

 

Not the case with this troop or pack. (The troop and affiliated pack - new for us - is at our church. The old pack was at a school). There is plenty of parent volunteers.

 

I stopped at the scout shop yesterday and bought the Scoutmaster''s Handbook and the Fieldbook. And since Monday, I''ve been putting together a list of pros and cons, both personal and for the troop. I''ve also been making notes about possible improvements and involving the scouts in the planning to move to a Boy Led environment. And I''ve been referencing some of my Wood Badge materials that would help in the leadership piece.

 

The troop has excellent resources and leaders with a lot of the practical applications (campcraft, skills, merit badges, etc) - the areas where I don''t have as much experience. I think the Committee Chair is looking at me more to help get the leadership piece moving - mentoring, guiding, and occasionally pushing the boys into becoming leaders.

 

Today, I''m leaning toward saying yes, but with a caveat (part of the bargaining ahead of time - thanks Beavah). I''d be the registered scoutmaster, but in practice it would be a co-scoutmastership for a year or two. (It would give me time with my younger son)

 

During this time, I wouldn''t be attending all the campouts and I would still need to make most Pack committee meetings. The pack committee meets from 7 to 8 once a month - the troop meetings go 7 to 8:30 - so I''d be at the troop meeting for the beginning and end.

 

I have a feeling that''s what will happen. (Remember - I''ve purchased the handbook, been making notes, and planning). Do you think a co-scoutmastership would work?

[John-in-KC]

Slightly confused...

 

Co-Scoutmaster with who?

 

I share duties in another task in a different part of the world. We spent quite a bit of time sharing vision, goals and tasks before we actually stepped up to the plate. One ironclad rule: If one says it, the other must endorse it. You cannot allow members to run around Mr Smith to get you to overturn a decision.

[Gunny2862]

I agree with John but would like to add in that splitting duties works you can''t split resposibility, it just lends itself to confusion. One of the two of you has to be the final authority.

 

I don''t know that I would approach it as a co-SM position rather that of leaning on one particular ASM who has agreed to the situation in advance.

 

Is the other person in the Committees/COR''s line of sight for SM selction also? And are they reluctant for some reason to take on the whole thing? If that is the case then this could work well.

 

But above all this would have to be someone who will openly, proactively and timely communicate good and bad with you, and you need to be able to do the same. If it''s not going to work I think it would be because of some form of communication gap.

 

 

[Eagledad]

I''m not in favor of a Co-Scoutmaster thing because there will be times that you agree to disagree. I think you can still do everything as you explained, but everyone in the troop needs to know who is responsible for the boys side of the troop program and vision.

 

My best friend and I built our troop together. He was SM first then I took over after four years. We were of the same mind and you would have thought that we had a mental connection when it came boy scouting. But people are different and there were times when we did disagree on things. That is when the the SM at the time had the 51% vote. It will save you on friendships and cut down time on debates. True, this is a team effort, but there has to be a leader with one vision to keep the team on track.

 

As for good readings, The SM Handbook is a great start. Get the SPL Handbook and PL Handbook to complement your other readings. Those books are really the core of the boys side of the program and that is where you need to start your focus. The are a fast read and I think you will find they basically highlight the SM HB.

 

Barry