Lost Scout, How?

[Eagledad]

Hi All

 

Like Beav (SR540Beaver), this tradady has weighed heavily on my mind. I can't know the horror everyone involved is going through and I pray a lot for them.

 

But, we were discussing this at the meeting the other day, and we can't see how it happens. Please understand that we are flatlanders in Oklahoma, so we don't understand how with todays technology and manpower that this boy couldn't be found. It's not that we don't have any experience in this kind of territory, our troop averages at least two trips in the deep Wilderness areas of Wyoming, Colorado, New Mexico and Canada. So we have experience in these kinds of terrains and foliages. I'm not surprised that anyone could get lost; we are just trying to understand what happens after someone gets lost and why it can be so hard to find them again. Makes me want to require a GPS for every scout.

 

 

I do not want a discussion to comment on this particular boy, how it happened or why he couldn't be found. I am sure all that could possibly be done, was done. This is more of a question of learning how a rescue like this can be so difficult. We heard that over 500 people we searching for the scout, but it's hard for us to imagine that many people couldn't find the boy.

 

AK-Eagle and anyone else with this experience, can you help us understand the dynamics of a rescue for someone lost in a wilderness and why it sometimes fails?

 

Again, this is not meant to be a discussion to critique this particular boy and he attempted rescue. We were just wanting to learn. I would have no problem with killing this thread if it turned negative.

 

Thanks everyone.

 

Barry

 

[Marlene]

I really respect the way you are not just questioning what might have happened in Garrett's case but are looking beyond that to understanding the dynamics and thinking processes of a person, especially a child, who is lost. When you start thinking like the lost person you have a much greater chance of finding them. I hope you get some really good responses from experienced people because if we understand the thinking process we can pass that information on to our boys and maybe give them some ideas on how to overcome natural but destructive tendencies. The most obvious productive behavior we want to instill is-STAY WHERE YOU ARE!

 

Another thing that happens to a lost person is the mind games that go on that drive them to make foolish decisions. Carrying a GameBoy to occupy the mind might not be a bad idea. A kid would spend hours, maybe day, hugging a tree if he had a game to play. (Just kidding!)

[scoutldr]

I agree it's very strange that a child could vanish without a trace. SOmeone in one of the other threads suggested foul play. But if the simplest rules are followed, we can avoid similar situations. Buddy system, hug-a-tree, whistles, ... any one of those would have ensured a happier outcome.

[kenk]

Per Marlene's comment in the Hug-a-Tree thread the formula for a good outcome is pretty simple:

 

ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS have kids carry a whistle, a brightly colored plastic bag or two, and the knowledge to admit that they are lost and then stay put waiting to be found.

 

By the way, I do suspect that eventually GPS's (w/ compass) will get small and cheap enough that they will become standard equipment even for kids.

 

Though I don't have data on this, I strongly suspect that the #1 killer in a lost child situation is hypothermia. The purpose of the plastic bag is to prevent that.

 

I've seen some suggest that the color of the bag isn't too important, but I would disagree. I've read stories describing how tough it is to see a child crouched/sitting in the woods. I made sure the bags I provided to my boys were bright orange.

[SR540Beaver]

This event has really driven the point of safety home with me. I've really been thinking hard about purchasing pea-less survival whistles for the troop. The whistles would not be given to the boys to take home. They would be stored at the charter and passed out in the parking lot before leaving for a campout. No vehicle rolls until the whistle is hanging from each boy's neck. Just like watching to make sure they have a buddy with them before leaving camp, we would make sure that the whistle is always hanging around their neck. That is rule number one. Rule number two is that no one EVER blows a whistle unless they are lost. Next rule would be to stay put....period. I can see how a boy gets lost. Think of all those big boys who will drive around for hours and never admit they are lost. Once you get off the beaten path, one tree or rock looks like the next one. Think about it, when you are walking over rough terrain, where are your eyes usually? On the ground in front of you. When you turnaround, nothing looks familiar because yo have not been looking at what is behind you. You start backtracking in an effort to go back where you came from.....but you don't know where you came from. Learning to look for landmarks and what is behind you is a valuable skill to learn. But more important than that is to stay where you are and quit guessing once you realize you are lost. Then start blowing. I think another wise move is to build a fire and always keep it going. Fire is our friend. It provides heat and light and keeps us from straying. Once it is hot, add green wood and leaves to make plenty of smoke. People can smell it and planes can seee it. Keep blowing. There are plenty of other survival skills to teach, but I think a whistle, fire and staying put increases your odds greatly of staying alive and being found.

[Marlene]

That skill of looking backwards really is a neglected skill. I always try to look back and pick out a distinctive landmark in the near foreground, usually a strangely shaped tree or an exposed rock slab. Compass skills are necessary but being able to follow landmarks back to camp saves time.

 

Sometimes we who are comfortable in the mountains don't realize how intimidating those scenes are to a new adventurer. Everything looks alike/different and young kids suddenly realize how far they are from what they know and panic enters in at some level, even when they know they are safe. One of our great rewards as leaders is to see the child's confidence and skills grow and a boy becomes a man. By the way, it works for girls too so lets not forget the girls. I have been delighted by the young women my sons have chosen to marry. Among their many attributes they all knew how to camp and hike. And my daughters went honeymoon camping.

 

About building a fire. Great idea as long as you don't burn down the tree you are hugging.

[mk9750]

I know I've told this story before, but it might be worthwhile to repeat.

 

5 years ago, at 14, my oldest son accompanied the Venture Patrol on a hike of the Appalachian Trail. They were just south of Smokey Mountain State Park. Almost "one foot in N.C., one foot in Tennessee". Along the way is Klingman's dome, a structure from which you can see "forever", as my son tells it.

 

The first 4 days of the trip were not pleasant for my son. He wasn't as prepared as he could have been for the physical and mental challenges of an agregate total of over 17,000 feet of ascent (the net was less than 2,000 feet, but right there, the trail is up and down and up and down).

 

Once they got to Klingman's dome, they dropped their packs, went to the top, looked around, had dinner, rested a bit, and decided to get on the trail again. Being miserable, my son lagged in getting his pack on and keeping with the group. He had been complaining for most of the four days, and I'm sure everyone in the group, including his buddy, was somewhat relieved when they weren't stuck listening to him whine. So off they went, with my son about 10 minutes behind everyone else. Klingman's dome, as I understand, is situated in a meadow with many paths leading into and out of the area. My son couldn't recognize which path he should take to get back to the trail. After checking out the first few hundred feet of a few of them and returning to the meadow, he decided to check his map. Off came the pack, out came the map. By the time he had himself comfortable with which way he had to proceed, it was getting dark quickly. They hiked during Easter break, and that year the time still hadn't changed, so it was getting dark @ 7:00. He felt comfortable that he had enough daylight to get back to the trail, so off he went.

 

Once he got to the trail, he unloaded all his food, took it 300 - 400 feet downwind,and hung a bear bag. He went back to his pack, on the trail, found his rain suit and used it as a ground cloth. He laid his sleeping bag on the rain suit in the middle of the trail, laid down, and began blowing his wistle three times every five minutes or so. He said he never was nervous. He was very confident someone would be back to find him.

 

About an hour and a half later, someone did. Two of the crew had been sent back to look for him ,and were just about ready to give up and turn back to camp, when they heard the whistle. Another 1/4 mile back down the trail, and there he is.

 

Once my wife and I heard the story, we had two very different reactions. My wife was petrified that a bear could have gotten him. I kept hearing "Dueling Banjoes" as the story came out. But regardless, as disappointed that I was that my son had been so miserable, I was extremely proud that he followed all of the instructions he had been given, and apparently with a very clear head. Doing less may have made things turn out worse. But by following all he had been taught, he has a great story to tell for the rest of his life.

 

He ended up hiking 113 miles over 9 days, never losing sight of his buddy again. Although he never went again, that trip may have been his Waterloo. He truly became a man in his own eyes on that trip.

 

I hope for such positive outcomes for anyone who finds themself lost in the wilderness. Training and some very basic equipment can go a long way to helping. but a little luck and a helping hand from the Great Scoutmaster may be the best assistance.

 

Mark

[Marlene]

Mark, that is a great story. How did your son learn those skills? Were you also involved in teaching him as a parent? What was the impetus for him having a whistle and a bear bag? Did the troop have pack checks before the trip? As tired as your boy was, the admonition to stay where you are lost was probably a no-brainer for him. You said he never went again. With his skills and confidence I hope he continues his outdoor activities so he can pass them on to his children. Being in the outdoors not only gives us a respite from the frantic world we live in but the confidence and resourcefulness that helps us succeed in many phases of life.

 

 

[mk9750]

Marlene,

 

First, welcome!!

 

Let's see...

 

The skills he displayed were practically forced into him much the same as a math teacher learns more about math by teaching it. Our Troop runs its entire program on the same model as physician's training - See one, Do one, Teach one. When Scouts first cross over, they are exposed to older Scouts who do presentations, make up games and competitions, and then test and sign off requirments for the new guys. As the new guys become more and more proficient at skills, the older Scouts do less for them and more supervision. By the time they have been in the Troop a year to two, they are pretty skilled. At that point, they become the teachers for the new guys. It is THIS work that provides the real learning, we believe. People can learn well by listening and seeing, they learn better by doing. But to truly master a skill, one should teach it. And that's what we do.

 

Although my son loves the outdoors and regular camping, hiking is just not his cup of tea. He is still active as a 19 year old ASM, and gets to as many campouts as his college schedule permits. But at least for the time being, hiking is not high on his priority list.

 

Yes, crews preparing for a major hike participate in plenty of shake down hikes before they embark on their trip. These guys left in early April, but they were doing between 5 and 12 miles every Sunday morning from mid January on. Each hike included one of them displaying his pack and others crtiquing it, practicing their meals, and reviews of wise hiking practices. Same goes if we go whitewater kayaking, rapelling, or shooting. Preparation makes for a far more successful outing.

 

Thanks for the nice message!

 

Mark

[Marlene]

Hands on training is always best, especially with motivation. I set up a compass course for some eleven year old scouts with each scout having a different end point, which included his lunch. They paid very close attention to their readings etc.

 

One time my son was leading his wife and me cross country to a lake that my dad named for me when I was born. It is a two mile trip with the last quarter mile being a very steep climb on a brush covered slope where you have to use the brush to pull yourself up. As we were making our way across the flats through huckleberry brush over our heads and no visual references the thought crossed my mind that I had taught my son his basic compass work and now not only was his safety dependent on his training but so was mine.

 

We made it into the lake, which I had never seen and I was then over 50 years old. My dad thought I was never in good enough shape to make it so my son took me.