Stealing. A Cautionary Tale.

[AnnLaurelB 10]

About 5 years ago, our Pack was deactivated; the attrition rate had outpaced registration. The CO didn't do a very good job of tying up the loose ends on the situation. (If you've read my other posts, NO SURPRISE there!)

 

Well, 3 years ago, the church (CO) decided they wanted to get their Charter back, so they started that process with someone from the local Council. As they went through the steps (basically almost like a new Charter), the subject of a checking acount came up. "Oh, we HAVE a checking account! It's still active; it should have well over $3,000 in it."

 

(Why so much? I guess someone left the Children's Dept a big chunk o'cash, and they split it between Sunday School, Youth Group, Scouts, etc...but I digress.)

 

The statements, though, evidently were still being forwarded to THE EX-CUBMASTER from 5 years ago. He hadn't had anything to do with the church or the Cub Scouts since the deactivation. The reactivating CC and the new CM (whom I eventually replaced) both called the guy over and over and over, to get the checkbook, the records, etc... but he wouldn't return their calls. HMMMMMN...I WONDER WHY.

 

The CORep went to the local bank, and explained that they'd been neglectful for 2 years or so, and would the bank help get everything back where it should be? The bank said, "Of course," and they printed statements, changed names/addresses, ordered new checks, etc... They were very helpful! When the CORep took the stuff back to the Committee, they got to looking at the statements. Can you guess what I'm going to tell you? (Ok, the topic title gives it away.)

 

Yep! The former CM (not the one whom I replaced--the guy before HIM) had made numerous withdrawals from the account ... AFTER THE PACK HAD BEEN DEACTIVATED. Someone had trusted him with a debit card to the thing!

 

So there happens to be a lawyer on the Committee. He got ahold of the guy somehow and "requested" that he attend a meeting at the church to give the checkbook back, etc... And when he got there, he played dumb. But the records from the Council show that the Charter was closed on a certain date.

 

There were a few withdrawals around that date, and the former CM said they'd gone camping and some other things right around then. The Committee said, "Sure. There could have been some last-time-before-we-fold outings or something." They could see that as a possibility.

 

But the statements show that the withdrawals CONTINUED, to the tune of like $2,900 over 18 months. Now, it's the CO's fault in a way, for not demanding the checkbook/debit card back at decharter, but then again, if you hold a Pack's checkbook, and it folds, wouldn't you JUST GO GIVE IT BACK? Well, I would.

 

Anyway, the Committee (with the lawyer on it) looked at this guy and said, "What are you going to do about this?" He stammered and stuttered and finally agreed to pay $2,500 back to us in monthly installments of $200. It was strongly insinuated that they'd take legal action if he didn't agree.

 

We got 4 payments.

 

When the guy missed his 3rd payment, the lawyer tried to call him, and sent him certified mail (which WAS delivered), so we know he was notified, but we got no answer. The lawyer sicced the local Magistrate Server on him, only to find out that the guy had moved out of the county.

 

I mean c'mon! If you're having trouble paying (um...stolen money in the FIRST place?!?), then you need to CALL AND MAKE ARRANGEMENTS. You can't just skip town!

 

Well, Mr.C our lawyer knows EVERYONE, and he called up a friend in THAT county seat, and arranged to have the guy picked up.

 

The lawyer called me yesterday; the guy was arrested, and notified that his payments will now be garnished out of his wages by the County.

 

Can you IMAGINE having an arrest record for stealing from CHILDREN, and having to tell your employer's secretary/human resources person that you have a legal garnishment payable to a CUB SCOUT PACK?!?

 

I can't stop shaking my head.

[CCbytrickery 10]

A treasurer here in FL was arrested for stealing $1,400 or so from his BS troop.

 

http://www.news4jax.com/news/28336782/detail.html

 

I really don't understand people sometimes.

[shortridge 184]

Wow, just wow ... about both the thief's gall and the CO's negligence.

[AnnLaurelB 10]

Right?

 

But I just cracked up when the lawyer called to tell me the guy had been arrested and was pleading to make a payment deal. The lawyer was ... gleeful.

 

So funny.

[moosetracker 132]

AnnLaurelB - interesting story, but I have heard of people stealing for cub scouts before.. I was more surprise that on your paper committee, you had someone on it, that actually was actively persueing something.. Maybe it was just the lawer thing and it was up his alley of interest.

 

I was also surprise at how easy it was to garnish someones pay, with an intial arrest. I thought something like that would take lengthy court time..

 

Also I am surprised the guy was withdrawing a little at a time, rather then waited a year, then reached it a grabbed the full 5,000, then taken to the hills..

 

At first when I read it I read the word "Country" not "county".. I was like "he fled the country over 2,500?? Then I hit the part about the county-seat, and figured out it was not Country..

[AnnLaurelB 10]

I'm not sure I understand how it all works, but the guy signed a Promissory Note when he got called before the Committee and agreed to make the payments. So essentially, he's defaulted on a loan.

 

Maybe that makes a difference in processing? I don't know. And you're exactly right; our lawyer guy jumped on this like a duck on a junebug (God, I love the South!) because it IS right up his alley! :0)

[Eagledad 2781]

I think this happens a lot, but most units just let it go. We had the parents of a cub keep about $400 of popcorn money their soned earned. It was a difficult situation because the father was mildly retarded and mom only earned minimum wage. They were also getting federal assistance, so you can understand why we took the family in a year earlier as a charity. The family was very meek, so we weren't even sure they knew what they had done. Money was not a problem for our pack and we let it go.

 

Bary

[AnnLaurelB 10]

That's almost exactly the comment that we've tossed around since it started. "If it had been just $290, then we'd just let it go."

 

But $2,900? No, that's just not right! And the thing was he agreed to pay $2,600 ($300 forgiven for possible camping around the end, there), which is, if you ask me, an admission of guilt.

 

If he had called our lawyer guy and told him, "I'm having trouble. I need to re-negotiate this," then we would have worked with him. But he just decided to skip town and ignore the phone calls and letters.

 

THAT'S why lawyer guy went after him.

[The Blancmange 67]

Something is missing from this story. Someone does not get arrested for missing a payment on a note.

[AnnLaurelB 10]

No, he got arrested for admitting stealing from the Pack account. The CO *didn't* get the law involved *until* he failed to hold up his end of the bargain.

 

Not every place has a Magistrate system; when I say, "arrested," it's not the same thing as being like put behind bars, given a jumpsuit and 1 phone call.

 

The Magistrate system means we paid the Sheriff a fee to find the guy and tell him that if he doesn't pay up, the next step IS having him charged with a crime. Filing the complaint with the Magistrate Court puts it on record that he owes us the money, that he has already admitted owing us the money, and that he has no recourse.

[Oak Tree 15]

It's lucky that there was someone around who knew the account existed and knew enough to follow up on it. I'm guessing the ex-Cubmaster was just hoping no one noticed, and it seems entirely possible that he might have gotten away with it. Maybe if he had just taken all the money and closed the account right away.

 

We have lawyers on our committee too - they're happy to send a note on legal letterhead - it's an easy thing for them to do.

 

Thanks for the story. It's easy to imagine something like this happening as things gradually fall apart at the end of a unit's life-cycle.

[AnnLaurelB 10]

And of course, this time around, we made sure the checks have to have TWO signatures, and there's NO debit card.

 

As the CM, I refuse to even hold the thing, although I am a signer if they're paying someone else. But I won't sign checks to myself.

 

The guy sure might have gotten away with it. But as it is, he's going to see if he can raise the 2 grand; if he can't, the County is going to garnish his wages.

 

DON'T MESS WITH CUB SCOUTS! :0)

[Eagle92 110]

This is one reason why I hate dealing with money. Unfortunately I've seen it where even if you do everything above board and by the book, sometimes people still accuse of using unit funds to buy stuff for yourself (Nice tarp you got there, doesn't that belong to the troop).

 

In training materials, it says to make sure you get 2, stressing TWO SIGNATURES, on unti checking accounts. Don't know if this is in the books or not, but in one of the units I was with, 2 signatures were needed, but there was a list of 4 people who could sign, and none were related: IH (rarely used), COR/CC, Treasurer, and SM.

 

Like I said make sure no one is related, that also keeps accusations form happening. I know I was asked to be a signer of checks since I was the one buying advancement as I worked at the scout shop. But since the wife was treasurer, I refused.

 

Sad, sad story.

[Oak Tree 15]

I'm sorry, but maybe someone could explain the two signature thing to me. How does it help?

 

If I were going to steal money from the account, I could easily forge two signatures. I could probably even sign my own name twice. Anything will get through the system, as far as I can tell. So I really don't understand how requiring two signatures adds any security at all, but it does add a complication. Do the banks even check that there are actually two signatures on the check?

[momof2cubs 10]

Oak Tree: as an accountant and bookkeeper who regularly deals with other people's money, I can tell you that tellers hardly EVER check signatures. The only time a teller would (on occasion) be more watchful is if you walk up to the teller and want to cash a check. Then they will usually check the signature(s).

 

But go through the drive-up window, send the check in with a deposit slip to your own account? I would bet any kind of money you could sign the check "Mikey Mouse" and they will put it through.

 

So In answer to you question, the 2 signatures thing is supposed to be part of checks and balances, but it's not 100% full proof. In fact, nothing really is. A person intent on stealing, will do find a way to do it, regardless of what procedures you put in place.