Camping Merit Badge Question

[SR540Beaver]

My son took the Camping MB last week at summer camp. I have a couple of questions regarding this MB. The camp counselor accepted the word of the SM concerning requirment 9a for camping 20 days and 20 nights. One SM friend I've talked to said that their troop starts counting the days and nights from the time a scout expresses a desire to take the MB instead of counting camping done before the MB. How have you guys handled this one? My son had it checked off by his MB counselor on the word of the SM.

 

My other question is with requirment 9b. The scout has to do 2 items out of a list of 5 while on one of the campouts from 9a. 9b2 says backpack for at least four miles. A few months ago we did a 6 mile day hike with daypacks. Would that qualify? It is the "backpack" term that is throwing me. I tend to seperate backpacking from hiking in my mind as different things. Backpacking obviously involves wearing a backpack and camping. Hiking can be with or without a pack and doesn't necessarily involve camping. We camped, just not on the trail and we did all have day packs. Would you count that as meeting the requirement?

[nldscout]

If you only count the days after a scout says I want to do Camping then very few would get it. If you use any of the automated tracking programs, like Troopmaster, it counts camping days from the day he joins the troop.

 

And I would not count a day hike as Backpacking.

[EagleInKY]

These are really questions for the MB counselor. But, imho, the scout should get credit for all days camped since he joined scouting. I haven't read the other requirement in enough detail to give you a fair answer.

[SR540Beaver]

Eagle,

 

This was a summer camp situation. The MB counselor is not available after the fact. If you plan on getting a "complete" while at camp, you have a list of pre-requisites to complete. If those are not completed prior to going to camp, you get a partial on the MB and then it is up to the SM to verify the rest of the requirements are completed at a later date. I know our SM was fine with my son's 20 days and nights of scout camping since he has 32 nights of camping since joining in February of last year. The real question is about whether the SM will consider hiking 6 miles with a day pack the same as backpacking a minimum of 4 miles. The requirement doesn't mention camping or cooking on the trail, just the miles. The main difference would be the weight of a daypack as opposed to a backpack in my mind. But it is his call and not mine. In a summer camp environment, the items I have in question can not be completed in camp and rely on the SM's verification.

[John-in-KC]

Here is my read:

 

A 6 mile day hike, that does not involve setting a base camp, does not qualify.

 

Look at the literal language:

On any of these camping experiences, you must do TWO of the following, only with proper preparation and under qualified supervision:

 

Backpack for at least four miles.

 

To me, "neither adding to nor taking from" for this requirement means:

 

a. Camp is already set when the hike begins. The hiker is under a shouldered burden vice a belted burden.

 

b. Camp will be set at the end of the hike, using the gear the Scout is carrying on his back.

 

c. The Scout is moving some of his gear, on his back, to the site, but some gear will be accessed from the troop trailer at the site.

 

Out from the house in the morning, back to the house in the evening does not meet the base of 9b.

 

Now, if the Scout is in LT camp, and there is a 6 mile day hike under pack from camp? To me, it qualifies.

 

My two cents.

[SR540Beaver]

John,

 

The hike with daypacks was part of a two night campout where the boys did set up camp. Came in on Friday night and set up camp. Hiked saturday with a trail lunch from their packs along with map and compass work and back to camp for Saturday night. They carried food, water, flashlights, compasses, rain gear, first aid kits, etc. Just not extra clothes, stoves or tents. That was all back in camp.

[OldGreyEagle]

Wow, just like mouths, everyone will have an opinion on this. To me, and I venture to guess many other people, when someone says I am going "backpacking", an image of the person carrying all the gear needed for at least a one nights stay is conjured up. When I hear "I am going backpacking", I dont think of someone going out 5 miles, eating some food and comming back to the camp where he started. Actually even if it was 20-50 miles, its quite a hike, but not backpacking.

 

I am going backpacking in Yellowstone next week, quick, what image do you get? Me staying in a hotel making day hikes or me hauling my gear over the trails?

[packsaddle]

You DOG! I am soooo envious! Are you really going to Yellowstone next week? I guess I'll be there, let's see, first or second week of July. What trails do you plan to be on? Oops, maybe this should be on a different thread, couldn't help myself.

 

Edited part: Oops again, I forgot...we count every legitimate night of camping after they become scouts, at least that's our interpretation (the interpretation we serve?). And as for the backpacking requirement, the boys have ample opportunities to complete that easily within their first six months to a year in the troop.(This message has been edited by packsaddle)

[SR540Beaver]

OK guys! Geez! Part of what threw me was that all the requirement concerned itself with was the milage, nothing else. You'd think if it was so concerned with "backpacking" it would say to pack all the gear you'd need for an overnight stay, set up camp and cook a meal. All it says is backpack "4 miles". That could be interpreted as hike four miles with a loaded backpack and technically be correct. It is kind of like requirement 9b4 that says "Plan and carry out a float trip of at least four hours." Nowhere does it say you have to float in a canoe although that is the way most would interpret it. Heck, the most fun float trip I ever took was about 8 hours in an innertube down the Brazos River in Texas. Boy did I get sunburned!

[evmori]

These questions are up to the MB counselor.

 

I would count the days since the Scout has been in the Troop for camping since there is no wording to restrict it. As for 9b, as long as the trip you took with day packs was counted as part of 9a, then I would count it.

 

But then again, these are my interpretations. It is up to the MB counselor the Scout is being counseled by.

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

[Hunt]

I agree that the 20 days should be since becoming a Scout. On the backpacking part, here's the requirement:

"On any of these camping experiences, you must do TWO of the following, only with proper preparation and under qualified supervision:

Hike up a mountain, gaining at least 2,000 vertical feet.

Backpack for at least four miles.

Take a bike trip of at least 15 miles or at least four hours.

Plan and carry out a float trip of at least four hours.

Rappel down a rappel route of 30 feet or more."

 

I think the "backpack" requirement is a bit vague, and MB counselors could reasonably take different positions on it. Didn't this requirement formerly include an option for a longer "hike?"

 

[SR540Beaver]

Hunt,

 

www.usscouts.org shows changes made to merit badges. This used to be included in requirement 9b. "On one of these camping trips, hike 1.5 miles or more each way to and from your campsite. Pack your own gear plus your share of patrol gear and food." This was required while you still had to do 2 out of 5 in the same list. I think it was probably changed because it was rather redundant with the "backpack for at least 4 miles."

[EagleInKY]

I think Beav nailed the spirit of the rule when looking at the old requirement. I think the idea is to have the scout hike, set up a campsite, then hike out the next day. The wording allows for some wiggle room, perhaps he could hike at least 4 miles, set up camp, and then have vehicles to take them out.

[Lynda J]

When boy cross over into our troop one of the first things they get is a Camping Merit Badge Blue Card. They are going to be camping with the troop so it might as well count. THere are 3 adults in the troop that counsel Camping.

As far as taking the SM's work at camp. I think that happens a lot more that we as leaders would like.

 

On #9b. Our new scouts to a first year camper program. During that program they do an overnight as their group. They hike to an area that is about 3 miles from the actual camp and spend the night under the stars. They don't take tents. Just bedrolls,flashlight, water bottle, and their personal first aid kit. Our boys had a ball this year. Seems a racoon came into their camp for a visit. One boy had taken fruit role ups. He lost them to Rickie Racoon.

[SR540Beaver]

Here is an update on my question about counting our 6 mile hike with daypacks (including trail lunch) counting for the requirement of "backpack for at least four miles" in the Camping MB. My son asked the SM last night at the troop meeting if it counted. Surprisingly (based on the answers given here), he said yes. In addition to being the SM, he is the district training chair, a WB staffer, an Eagle Scout and is usually pretty strict in his interpretations of any and all requirements. Go figure.