Eagle Project May be Too Big

[Thomas54]

 

My 15 year old Life scout son hooked up with a local State park that needs some trail bridges replaced. He goes down the list and finds the biggest one and says "that's the one I want to do". We have done two visits out there as well as spoken to the ranger. The ranger has been very good always speaking directly to my son.

 

As an engineer I have dropped hints that what he has is a small civil engineering project. The "bridge" actually spans two flood spills one spanning 48' and the other 17'. The old bridge will need to be taken down and hauled away.

 

I told my son that if he wants me to, I will design it but he will need to be the project manager. That suites him well. I am a little uncomfortable as it is a very technical to get everything precisely installed. I have told him how we would work that at the site he will need to take charge of the crew and I will only act as a technical advisor.

 

I look at this and I go (good grief what is he getting us into) and I see major design work as well as careful and controlled field work to get alignments and foundation set properly. Plus materials will run 2,500 - 3,000 which mean a lot fundraising.

 

 

I have dropped hints that this is a significant civil engineering endeavour. Maybe he should look at something else. However, this has had the opposite effect on him. The bigger and more complex I tell him the project is the more he likes it. He wants to have the Eagle project to beat his buddies.

 

I am worried that technically he is in over his. And that he will rely on me too much.

I think he sees it as him and dad building something really cool together with some buddies jumping for support.

 

 

Thoughts?

 

[Eamonn]

Does the Ranger understand how big the project might be?

Ea.

[moosetracker]

Whenever a scout talked "BIG" I would just steer him to think about other aspects..

 

The one that got some to downsize the most was thinking about being fair to other scouts that are coming after them. This only worked though if they were planning that their major workforce was those in the Troop, if they had alot of outside help Friends, family, Churchmembers it did not.

 

But, I would ask him to think about those boys who were at life, or almost at life, how many were at this stage? Then have him consider the time he would be asking of the Troop members for his project. There is a chance that by the end of his project, many will be burnt out.. But, if others in the troop were going to be asking for help at the same time as his project then their help would be split up between that many projects.. And if he alone, or he and the 2 or three projects all going at the same time, burnt out the labor force, what would happen to the 2 or three scouts who came after them and asked for help for their Eagle projects..

 

With your son make sure he thinks of the time for all the fundraising as well as the bridge building.

 

If he still wants to pursue it, get him to at least look for who else beside troop members he can use. You also, rather then being his sole Engineering advisor, do you know a few friends in the field who may also take on advisory roles. I am not an Engineer so I am unsure if you can split a project into 2 or 3 parts for different Engineers, but if you could, your son would be asking for less commitement from your associates, ans your son could benefit from other collaborations other then it being a Father/son project.

[Eagle69]

Hopefully someone at the Unit level or District level will "advise" him that he has bitten off more than he can chew. If I was the District reviewer and saw plans to build a 48 foot bridge I would turn it back. The 17 foot one would be ok. I've built about a half dozen bridges for Eagle Projects and they were all major jobs and we are talking no more than 20 feet in length.

 

As for the Ranger; most of them are happy to have the free labor and will show a boy anything on their list of projects without regard as to how big it is going to be. They don't understand.

[Engineer61]

Yeah...my first instinct would be that horrible 2 letter word.

 

To call a 48' span of of bridge a small CE project is an understatement.

 

Does the State have credential requirements for the design and construction of publicly accessible bridges like these? I would expect a CE with a PE cert would be a minimum requirement.

[moosetracker]

I know our board has looked at a project and estimated too big or too small (or just right) (reminds me of the Three little Bear story).

 

With the too small ones they find a thing or too to fatten it up a bit without loosing sight of the project, add one or two benches, throw a get together with the new ______ is christen by being used for the first time..

 

For the too big, they will discuss that it is way too big.. But I know scouts have stubbornly insisted they understand the committement and want this project, they then don't stand in their way.. A few do get them completed also..

 

I have yet to hear my husband flat out turning down a project due to it being big, I am unsure how many they have effectively redirected either. Normally I hear about the stubborn scouts, who refuse to take heed.(This message has been edited by moosetracker)

[SR540Beaver]

While I admire any boy wanting to stretch and grow, sometimes their eyes are bigger than their stomach. My personal feeling is that a boy should be able to design and carry out a project on his own. Now, that certainly doesn't mean that he can't seek out people with more knowledge than he and pick their brains and learn from them. But somewhere there needs to be a dividing line and it moves depending on the boy, his age, his abilities, his resources, etc. Putting on a first aid clinic is one thing. Deciding you want to do brain surgery is a whole different matter. As an engineer, you know what he is facing. If it concerns you, then there is probably good reason for concern. I understand you not wanting to use the NO word. Back to that eyes bigger than the stomach thing. While a project looks sexy, the actual planning and carrying out can quickly become very disheartening. Just raising the funds alone for a project of this magnitude could stop it or severly slow it's progress. Have you considered steering him to the SM or someone n the troop or even having a conversation with the ranger about having a discussion with your son about the scope?

 

Our district is one of those that wants to see "something" built in a project. Creating a new trail isn't good enough. No, you need to construct signs of benches along the trail for it ti be a "real" project. We are fortunate in that our SM is an engineer and he deals with each Life Scout to go over their plans prior to their EBOR to get approval. WE are a large troop, he has been SM for over 10 years and he knows what the BOR's are looking for. He can look at a boy's plan and tell them that it is far to simple and needs detail added or that they are getting in way over their head. I know that with my son, he would listen to the SM before he would ever listen to me.....and I knew that his wasn't a walk in the park. It was fairly ambitious, but doable if he recruited the right people.

 

Good luck!