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sec338

mb without counselor

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Can A scout earn a merit badge without having a counselor for that badge? ie. if they get red cross certified for first aid and cpr can that be used as fitting their requirements, if they show they really understood what they learned? And what about the badges that they earn at camp as they have no card signed off on? Any help is great as I am filling in for our SM temporarily but looks like permanetly and am new to all of the rules.

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Simple answer: NO! The rules are that they have to meet the requirements for the merit badge as established through BSA. No more and no less. The First Aid MB requirements do NOT state "meet these requirements OR participate in a Red Cross course". And who would verify that they know the stuff if not a MB counselor? And how could they earn a badge at camp without a blue card? I've been to a lot of camps and they all required blue cards. Which one did you go to that didn't?

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If they completed a merit badge at camp, there should be a signed off card for that badge. In answer to your question about first aid, they need to see a counselor to get signed off. The counselor may elect to accept the certification for meeting some of the requirements but is not required to.

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A correction.

 

"Blue cards," as they are commonly known, are NOT required to complete merit badges. They may be the method in your unit or council, but they're not a universal thing.

 

Some summer camps print out advancement reports rather than using blue cards, showing which requirements the Scout completed. Some units don't use blue cards at all.

 

A Scout can certainly complete requirements without the counselor "teaching" him. There's nothing stopping anyone from taking a first aid course. However, he must then demonstrate those skills to the counselor's satisfaction.

 

If you're going to be the new Scoutmaster, you need to get yourself to training and a few Roundtables ASAP. That'll help you understand how things are done in your council.

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Concur with others

 

1) you must have a regsitered MBC sign off to award a MB and

 

2) Blue cards are not mandatory. Neither one of the two camps I worked used stem. Instead we used a preprinted form with all the requirements lsited and checked off as compelted.

 

Now depending upon the MBC, they may accept the certification, or they may ask for a skills demo. I was lucky, my Lifesaving MBC accepted my YMCA lifweguard certification. But he also knew my instructor.

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Sounds like a call to your District Advancement Chair is in order. He/she can give you some answers right now to how things are handled in your district and council. Then, as others have advised, training and Roundtable are great resources.

 

This forum is wonderful, but a district and council is a very specific tribe which very often has rules/traditions that may or may not march in lockstep with the manual. The advice you get here is definitely of the Your Mileage May Vary (YMMV) variety.

 

Vicki

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In addition to what was said before, you should be able to confirm with the camp what requirements of badges were completed if the question is a difference between what the boys have signed and what they claimed they earned.

 

We invariably end up with a kid who comes up two months after summer camp wanting to know when he is going to receive some badge we do not have a signed card for. Sometimes we find he really did earn it and the camp lost the card in the sorting process on Friday evening. Sometimes we find he only thought he finished it, but really earned a partial.

 

Contact the council that runs the camp you attended for summer camp records checks.

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We of course are in the business of helping Scouts.

We should try and avoid placing obstacles in their way.

If a Lad came to me with something like his signed Red Cross card and I knew that what he'd done met the requirements of the MB.

I'd call the District Advancement Chair. Give him the full story and ask if the card was acceptable?

He might ask that the person who signed the card to fill out a MBC application, he might give it the green light and say that everything is fie and dandy or of course he might just say "No way"!

There is no harm in asking, just don't make any promises that you might not be able to keep.

Badges at camp? Can be hard to find out about. All to often after the camp is over the staff departs and seem to enter a big black hole.

Again check with the Camp Director and see what help he can be. Talk with the District Advancement Chair. See what he comes up with.

A lot might depend on which MB?

I really can't see anyone making a fuss about Finger Printing, but Lifesaving might be very different.

Talking with the Scout about what he did, never hurts.

It is important to remember that if we want the Scouts we serve to be trustworthy we need to trust them.

Good Luck with this.

Eamonn.

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It's worth noting that taking a Red Cross first aid course won't satisfy all the requirements for First Aid Merit Badge. Even if all the skills are demonstrated properly, there's still the requirements to build a first aid kit for your home and to teach another Scout a skill.

 

If I were a First Aid counselor, and a Scout came to me with an ARC certification card, I'd say, "Great! We ought to be able to knock off these requirements in a quarter of the time, because you know your stuff. Now, what does triage mean?"

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Thank you to everyone for your input. I have been to roundtables for our district for almost a year now. But sometimes the specifics about such things are not mentioned. Just so you understand. We were a brand new troop and pack as of last year. I have been the troop and pack secretary since we started the committee and have learned a lot in the last year. Since our SM is now working nights and can't make meetings I have filled in for him which looks like its going to be for a long time. We only have 4 active Boy scouts and no MB counselers that I know of. I have scheduled training for myself to learn all I can but I don't want the boys to suffer for my inexperience. So thanks again for all your help I will sure call everybody I know including you all for help!

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Your troop doesn't need to have any counselors - that's the district advancement team's role. Contact the DAC for a list of counselors and your Scouts should be set.

 

Best of luck!

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sec338,

 

These remarks caught my attention...

 

Since our SM is now working nights and can't make meetings I have filled in for him which looks like its going to be for a long time.

 

We only have 4 active Boy scouts and no MB counselers that I know of.

 

Let me take the two in the second sentence first.

 

4 Boys: Unless your Troop is chartered by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, your Troop is below minimum youth membership to recharter. I do not know what your charter cycle is, but this is a risk: The kids can lose their Troop unless a fifth boy becomes part of the mix.

 

No MB Counselors: Don't worry!!! Yes, many Troops have in-house MB Counselors, but many of us think that the Adult Association Method of Scouting is better reinforced when the boys have to go to someone they've not met. For now, you need to contact your District Advancement Chairman (or your friendly Unit Commissioner) and ask for the District Merit Badge Counselor roster. Get to know those folks. Many are Scouters wearing the MBC hat in addition to what they do for a unit, the District, or the Council.

 

Now, to the first: I hate to say this, but the relationship of a Scoutmaster to a Troop (well in this case, a Patrol) is that of mentor. If he is going to have to be out of the loop for a long time because of employment, it's time to re-look leadership. I cannot recommend strongly enough that your Scoutmaster have a quiet office session with your Committee Chair and your COR. Is he short-serving the youth by having to delegate his work to someone else? Has he become a patch-holder? Leadership and training of these young men is why we adults put on the uniform. The right thing may be that he's an ASM without portfolio, and someone else steps up to the plate.

 

I wish you well. Please do keep us informed.

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"Unless your Troop is chartered by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, your Troop is below minimum youth membership to recharter."

 

I'm not familiar with this exception. Where can I find it?

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if memory serves, the LDS clause is in the district membership book. B/C LDS use scouting as their official youth program and have integrated Scouting fully into their religious instruction, they must have a scout troop despite numbers.

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thanks for the info about the number of boys. We have 4 active that meet each week. 1 that shows up when he can which is about once a month. And I have 2 Weeblos that will be advancing this summer. I will check with my DC to make sure we have enough at the end of this year.

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