gwd-scouter 11 Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 Younger son, Patrick, will start the work on his Eagle project this weekend. He's been planning the project since December and has spent a lot of time on the phone, on email, and in meetings with the organization for whom he's doing the work. Now it's time to get dirty. I have tried to stay out of things, being his Scoutmaster I do not want any appearance of favoritism. The thing is, I know full well that other guys' parents help them out in planning and coordinating Eagle projects. Not necessarily doing any of the work for them, but reminding them to make phone calls, advice on scheduling, etc. I've thought many times that in my efforts to treat my son as any other Scout, I've been unfair to him. Patrick sent an email to our Troop distribution list and set up a facebook group invitation to all his facebook friends about his project. A good idea I thought. When I opened the invitation link he sent to me I noticed that the times he had listed were not the same as he had announced earlier. He listed the start time on Saturday as noon rather than 9:00 am. He fixed the time and sent another email out. I also suggested to him that he stagger the times that the guys show up. Laying out the bricks for the pathway he's building will be a long hard job, but not something that 20 guys can do all at one time. That left me wondering if I overstepped. It really is the kind of advice, as Scoutmaster, I'd give and have given to any other Scout working on his Eagle project. It is also the kind of advice I imagine other parents give their sons. (This message has been edited by gwd-scouter) Link to post Share on other sites
evmori 11 Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 You aren't stepping over any lines, gwd-scouter. There is nothing wrong with advising. Good luck to your son! Link to post Share on other sites
Eagle92 110 Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 GWD, Good for you in trying to NOT get involved too much in your son's project. catching errors after receivign them IMHO is not getting involved. Think about it, if you knew Scout Smuckatella had plans to do this project and he came to you for advice, would you give it? If Smuckatella sent out an email with wrong info from his plans, wouldn't you send him somethingabout the cinfusion? Again Good for you for NOT getting to involved. You are doing OK. Link to post Share on other sites
Lisabob 13 Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 I don't think you've over-stepped the lines. Stepping across the lines is when you start previewing all of his messages or plans, when you start making the calls for him, when you announce his project - but not other Eagle projects - repeatedly to the troop, etc. Obviously I don't know your son, but for me the indicator that maybe I need to back off is when my son starts rolling his eyes at my suggestions (however good and well-intentioned). Link to post Share on other sites
gwd-scouter 11 Posted April 16, 2009 Author Share Posted April 16, 2009 Well, I do receive the eye-roll when I ask about writing to his senator as his last remaining requirement for Cit Nation. Guess he'll get around to it eventually. Link to post Share on other sites
HICO_Eagle 93 Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 Just replace "my son" with "Scout X" and ask yourself if you would have done the same thing. IMO you were right to do what you have done. If anything, you may not be offering your son the same level of service as SM that you would another scout precisely to avoid the appearance of favoritism. I've frequently seen dads be harder on their own sons than any other Scouts and it can really make things difficult for everyone. Good luck to your son! Link to post Share on other sites
Twocubdad 665 Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 There's no requirement to complete Eagle in a vacuum. Link to post Share on other sites
John-in-KC 311 Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 gwd, If you're worrying about if you've done the right thing or not, in my experience, you're probably smack on target! Good weather and good work to Patrick. It IS OK to remind him he's not to be doing the work, but facilitating everyone else. As for the eyeroll, EagleSon gave me one last night on Skype, and he's finishing his freshman year. Link to post Share on other sites
Eagledad 2779 Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 Ah the memories. Those are good times looking back. Hey, at least he is open to advise. My daughter is so much smarter than me that she would be telling me how I don't have a clue. However, I've seen her in action, she will make a square peg fit in a round hole if it kills her. Heaven help those 20 guys that worked at the same time because they WOULD get the job done. I pray for her husband (whoever it will be) everyday. Barry Link to post Share on other sites
John-in-KC 311 Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 Barry, I'd be very surprised if any of us weren't that way as older teens and twenty-somethings, especially with our parents ... Link to post Share on other sites
evmori 11 Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 The eyeroll is age appropriate! I would be disappointed if you didn't get the eyeroll! Keep up the excellent work! Link to post Share on other sites
Beavah 205 Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 When I opened the invitation link he sent to me I noticed that the times he had listed were not the same as he had announced earlier. He listed the start time on Saturday as noon rather than 9:00 am. Nuthin' wrong with sending a query about a discrepancy in something that he sent to you. I'd send it back by email, same way you got the invitation. Question is, why wouldn't his buddies send him the same query? If you expect them to, yeh might just lay off so that you're not "piling on". He fixed the time and sent another email out. I also suggested to him that he stagger the times that the guys show up. Laying out the bricks for the pathway he's building will be a long hard job, but not something that 20 guys can do all at one time. Nope, this one was a bit too far, IMO. Yeh might make that suggestion to a young First Class or Star Scout who is planning an outing or service project for the first time. A project advisor or committee reviewin' his proposal might make that comment. Otherwise, I think it treads too much on his plan. If he has too many people show up, he should have to deal with managing that. That would become a fine topic of discussion at his final review - both his ability to manage the issue and his recognition afterward of how he could have done it differently would impress his Board of Review. By steppin' in, you deprived him of that. Same as if you stepped in on any other scout in your program. A good test is to ask yourself this question: "If I assigned an adult ASM who I really trusted to do this task, would I interfere in this way?" An Eagle is a young adult in da program who often has more experience than most ASMs. Treat 'em the same way. That havin' been said, if yeh didn't get the eye roll, it was only a venial sin. Well, I do receive the eye-roll when I ask about writing to his senator as his last remaining requirement for Cit Nation. As well yeh should. This is way over da top "mom" behavior, LOL. Beavah Link to post Share on other sites
gwd-scouter 11 Posted April 16, 2009 Author Share Posted April 16, 2009 Yeah, I thought about it after I mentioned having 20 guys show up at the same time may not be a good idea. Should have left it alone and let him deal with it. I'll make a better effort to control myself. Link to post Share on other sites
OneHour 11 Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 Our Patrick, #2 son, just finished with his Eagle project. My wife and I advised (coached) him through it. We didn't think for him. We didn't do the work for him. We didn't pull it together for him. We just ask poignant questions. For example, as you pointed out that you suggest for your Patrick to stagger the times ... I would ask our Patrick "That is a great plan, but how can the plan be better to fully utilize all of your resources?" "Would it be possible for everyone to work at the same time?" etc ... Btw, these are the actual questions that I asked my son and other Life Scouts on their projects. Good luck! Link to post Share on other sites
CA_Scouter 11 Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 Doing an Eagle project is a learning experience. The scout must to be taught and/or advised on how to do things. You do your best to promote initiative and independent thinking with the scout but sometimes they just don't know how to 'do stuff'. C'mon, they are a teenager and have little life experience and/or experience in project management upon which to rely. Debatable if the comments on the work schedule is overstepping - one point to be made is that is your job as an advisor and the other is that he should have been forced to manage the 'mess' so to speak. I sometimes have a hard time with the mantra of 'you must let them fail so they learn'. We don't do that in school right? Everything is taught ahead of time, then the student is tested. We really don't do that with Eagle projects, we just kinda say 'go fer it' and hope that it works out ok. That being said I kept my mouth closed a lot more than I thought I would during my son's project. The duct tape over my lips helped.. ;-) I think your efforts at being concientious about your level of involvement is excellent and will prevent any serious meddling with the project. Link to post Share on other sites
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