Pushing vs. Encouraging

[Hunt]

I was thinking about the issue of "pushing" Life scouts to finish up their Eagle requirements. I agree that they have to want it for themselves, but I do think that there are ways adults can be helpful without usurping the scout's responsibility.

First of all, I think it's important to remember that teens don't have the long-term, big-picture view that adults do. They often have trouble with long-term planning, and with understanding the long-term impacts of short-term decisions. We can help them understand that better.

I also think that this kind of help may be more useful and effective from an adult who is not the scout's parent. If I talk to a Life scout who is not my son, I may point out to him that he still needs the First Aid MB, and that it's being offered at an upcoming event--but I'm not personally invested in what he does next--it's up to him. With my own son it's harder to keep that separate. I was reading a parenting book recently that made this point. If a kid who's not your child tells you he got a D on a test, you might say, "Well, I'll bet you'll study harder next time, right?" You might even offer to help him if you can. If you're the parent, however, you'll point out to him that this D will affect his grade for the course, which will affect his grade point average, which will affect his ability to get into the college he wants, etc, etc.

In my own family, I finally had to ask my wife to stop talking to my son about the things he needed to do for advancements--she just couldn't resist pushing him, and he responded with typical teenage resistance. Finally, she had to go cold turkey, and just leave that particular interaction to me and to other leaders in the troop. I've tried to restrain myself from pushing, and so far he's doing nicely.

So I guess what I'm trying to say is that there is a happy medium between pushing a boy too much, and just letting him hang out there on his own. I'd describe it as helping him understand long-term planning and impacts.

[OldGreyEagle]

to paraphase the man in black you have to "walk the line".

 

As a scout, my mother didnt quite push me to Eagle, although she did surreptiously mention how nice a mothers Star, Life Eagle scout pin would be for Christmas, Easter, Mothers Day, birthday. As I look at it now, I see it encouragement, as she didnt always get the next pin for the next available holiday, but she did eventually get them all. And I did it because I wanted to, and I wanted to get her the pin.

 

Somewhere between presenting the scout with a schedule to appear when for what requirments and leaving them to their own devices is where we should be. And that may change for each scout. Some scouts have inner motivation, others may need more encouragement. I look forward to others thoughts

[evmori]

I remember when my son was working on his Eagle. He had everything completed. He just had to write up his project for his BOR. I figured it was his Eagle. One day after about a month had passed since he finished his project, I asked him if he wanted to be an Eagle. He said yes. I then said "The job ain't finished till the paperwork is done." He looked at his feet and said "I know." Later that evening, he presented me with his completed Eagle Project Workbook.

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

[msnowman]

This is a battle within myself that I hope I am not losing too often, finding the line between pushing Nephew and encouraging him. I know, it shouldn't seem that you have to push or encourage a 2nd or 1st Class bound Scout, but sometimes there are personal hurdles to be overcome (in his case, swimming). I try very hard to encourage him and to support him, letting him know that IF he is ready to go back for swimming practice to feel ready for trying for 1st class, I'll drive him to the Y everyday, once a week, whatever it is HE wants (and yes, it is a big deal, that is 60 miles round trip). I am trying to give him the tools to succeed but not make the choice for him. If that was the case, he would have learned to swim 7 years ago.

 

I know that experience can be the best teacher, so I work at letting him set his own pace, decide what he is going to pack for camporee, if he is going to call XYZ MBC counselor, etc (as a compulsive planner, you have no idea how hard that is).

 

This is his time to learn. Maybe he won't get as far as I would have hoped for, but as long as he comes out a better person for taking the journey, I guess in the end that is all that matters. I can remind him, make suggestions (sometimes even waiting for a suggestion to be asked for before jumping in), but the rest is up to him.

 

Now if I could just believe all of that....knowing it and believing it are sometimes mutually exclusive concepts.

 

YiS

Michelle

 

[AvidSM]

With new scouts, it's all about encouragment. They are full of enthusiasm and spirit. With most of them, it does not take much to get them to advance.

 

With older scouts, I try a combination of pushing with some encouragement. I guess the pushing is more like prodding. I'll say, "Hey, how's that eagle project coming along?" or "What do you still need, Envi Sci or Family Life?

 

The older boys know where I'm coming from. They have to want to make eagle. No one else can want it for them.

 

[kenk]

This topic is often on my mind. My son will be crossing over from Webelos to Boy Scouts next February, and I find myself thinking ahead, wondering how much I should emphasize rank achievement vs. just enjoying the experience.

 

I figure that the "non-merit-badge" ranks will come on their own, with the help of the troop, but I really wonder about merit badges. When I was a kid (Life scout) It seems I only got those that came to me (camping, those that were done at summer camp, etc...). I don't ever recall working on one on my own. Was I lazy or just didn't understand how the system worked? Maybe some of both.

 

Now that we are looking at troops, the question of merit badge councelor availability comes up and I wonder how hard it will be for my son to work on the merit badges.

[Venividi]

My advise for when you are debating with yourself as to whether you are "pushing" or "encouraging" is to take a deep breath and think for a while about the aims. You need to self assess if your interest is one of seeing the scout earn a patch or a pin that he can wear, and that he (and perhaps secretly you) can show others as a visible sign of his (and therefore your) success? Or is it one of seeing him develop the character and citizenship, whether or not he is given a patch or pin?

 

If you are unsure if you are pushing or encouraging, then I suspect it likely that the line is being neared or crossed.

 

Personally, I would push scouts to fulfill the duties of their leadership position. I think that the experience of actually leading others is scary to scouts, and once done successfully (with a few failures along the way), development of character & citizenship takes a big jump.

Pushing to complete merit badges required to reach Eagle may temporarily boost self esteem, but I don't see the payoff that service to others through leadership has.

 

Never having been a scout as a youth, it is likely that I am missing something. I know several fathers that had been scouts as youth and never wore the eagle pin. They therefore pushed their sons to complete requirements for Eagle, because they had not.

I never did understand this, because these were men of good character, and I didn't see how having the pin would have made them any better. I thought they were confusing the award with the character it is supposed to represent.

 

Kenk,

Since you are thinking through what you want for your son from scouting and reflect on your own life scout rank, if you don't mind, perhaps you can share: do you think that you got out of scouting what you wanted for yourself? Do you believe you are a better person for it? Do you believe you would have become a better person had you completed sufficient merit badges for Eagle?

I suspect that the answer is that you didn't need Eagle to turn into the type of quality person that would donate his time as an adult scouter. If your experience is like mine, you have run into parents that are Eagle, but turn down requests to help. I would rather have a bunch of scouts that all turned out like you (and others that post here) than any random group of Eagles.

 

 

[kenk]

The biggest "walk-aways" from my Scouting experience came from the fun, the skills and the experiences (memories) and not any ranks, though I was far more aware of wanting to make First Class than worrying about making Eagle. As I mentioned, most of my merit badges came "free" with the experiences I was enjoying.

 

Right now that is how I approach things with my son. If it is fun and new, he enjoys most anything. I'm pretty sure he'll let me know if he's boarded or uninterested.

[AvidSM]

We are trying to teach these boys about leadership. And, when you are pushing a scout, you are doing the leading, not them.

 

Not all boys in the troop are going to be good leaders. Some are not mature enough and others just don't have the drive.

 

If you push an immature boy before he is ready, you are probably doing more harm than good. If this boy is your son, you should be able to recognize this immaturity better than any one else.

 

If the boy is not driven to advance, try pushing him a little to see if he moves forward. If he won't budge, youv'e done all you can.

 

I agree that if the troop has a good program, advancement and merit badges should come as a matter of course. If you're a parent, and your not sure whether your son is advancing at the right pace, talk to a troop leader that's been around a while. They have seen enough boys go through the program to make a better assessment.