David CO

1 hour ago, Eagledad said:

Then you are doing it wrong.

Barry

Nope. It is not a matter of doing it right or wrong. Cub scouting and boy scouting are two very different activities. Most kids who like cub scouts end up not liking boy scouts. That's just the way it is.

On ‎2‎/‎18‎/‎2018 at 9:58 AM, swilliams said:

 He's in between fall and spring sports, and has Health this quarter

I gave you an up arrow for mentioning Health class.

38 minutes ago, Eagledad said:

If the boys are having fun now, they will want to continue the fun next year. 

Barry

No, most of them won't.

6 hours ago, WisconsinMomma said:

Any suggestions?  

Yes, store it in your garage.

21 minutes ago, blw2 said:

I never really thought about this...as our COR, not once in my years with the pack and troop ever showed up to a single meeting that I attended...committee or otherwise.  I never personally have ever spoken to the man.

BUT

If I were appointed COR for a unit, I'd pretty much insist on doing just one unit, and I'd tell BSA to take a hike on any such rule.  I say this because I'd like to think that as COR I'd try to attend at least a majority of the committee meetings, and at least some of the troop meetings and events....I'd recon that to be at least maybe 1-3 meetings per month.  That would be double the meetings if I were doing a troop + pack....and triple if there was also a crew.  No thanks

It is obvious that you do not understand the role of the COR. 

1 hour ago, perdidochas said:

The difference between the two models (athletics and scouting) is that there isn't a limit to the number of boy scouts we have, nor do we have a minimum skill level in Scouting to participate. There are definite limits to how many kids can be on a high school sports team, as well as a minimum standard to participate.  

We have 20 times as many participants in our sports programs than we have in scouting. 

It is true that some of our team sports have a limited roster. Other sports like track and field, tennis, golf, and wrestling are pretty much open to anyone who wishes to participate. 

My point, however, was not about recruitment. I am asking if we should be serving the boys we currently have, or only those boys we anticipate will continue on in the program.

I think we can see the problem right here on this thread. Instead of keeping the focus on the question of how to get "indoor parents" to be supportive of the outdoor program, most of the posts have been about converting the "indoor parents" into "outdoorsy" parents.

The true believers in scouting will not leave these poor people alone. Is it any wonder why the "indoor parents" avoid the unit altogether?

I am wondering if the units might actually have different CO's. My school has both cub scouts and boy scouts. The PTO is the CO of the cub scouts. The Athletic Association is the CO of the boy scouts. 

7 minutes ago, RememberSchiff said:

In school scenarios maybe,  scouting scenarios can be different.  Can't lock doors and cellphones may not work.

Yes, the training needs to be site specific. 

58 minutes ago, WisconsinMomma said:

 You gotta remember that this stuff is very rare though.  

No, it is not. The massacres are rare. The near misses occur more often than you might think.

7 hours ago, RememberSchiff said:

Police now advise/teach teachers and students to run, hide, fight. Should BSA add this training to YP?

Yes and no. Training should be done, but BSA is not the one to do the training. This can't be done with a one hour, on-line training seminar. 

We are quick to blame the schools for not being properly prepared for this kind of tragedy. Does your scout unit have a plan for such an event occurring at your meetings and events?

28 minutes ago, CalicoPenn said:

Based on past experience, there will be no changes made.  

There will probably be some changes made, but not the gun control changes you want.

School security is very difficult at the end of the day. The doors are wide open as the school prepares for mobs of students to exit the building. This is when the shooter chose to strike. I doubt that this was a coincidence. I think it was a calculated decision.

I'm sure that this incident will cause schools across the country to reevaluate their security measures to determine if there is a better way to handle security at the end of the day. 

49 minutes ago, Eagledad said:

I agree and disagree on this. The statistic Nationally is less than 50% of “Webelos IIs” join Boy Scouts. So if we added the dropouts from all the age groups, including the Tigers, the number of cubs who don’t join Boy Scouts is substantial, maybe 75%.The main cause of cub drop outs is adult leader burnout. Burned out Leaders don’t put the effort into the program to make it interesting for the boys, so they get bored and move on. I believe the overburdened Cub program is the main cause for dropping membership the 30 years. 

Barry

Thanks for the stats. That is consistent with what I have been seeing. Yes, I think we agree on the numbers, but disagree on how to interpret them. 

4 hours ago, ParkMan said:

In my mind, it's a continuum.  Just as boys go from Wolf to Bear and Bear to Webelos, so too do they take the step from AOL to Boy Scout. 

That may be the way you would wish it to be, but is that reality?  In my neck of the woods, less than half of all cub scouts go on to join boy scouts. Some cub scouts quit during their second year of webelos because they have already decided not to cross over.

Perhaps there should be a non-webelos den for cub scouts who just want to be cub scouts.

8 hours ago, HelpfulTracks said:

But the level of negativity on this board by so many toward Scouting is astounding.

I lost both of my parents when I was a teenager. Had my Scout leaders been as negative as many on this board, I wouldn't have stuck with scouting 

I wouldn't assume that scouters who are negative on this board, or grumpy at committee meetings, are acting the same way while they are interacting with the boys. The kids often have a way of bringing out the best in some people.

6 hours ago, The Latin Scot said:

But any Webelos Leader worth his salt will have Boy Scout preparation foremost in his mind as he prepares his activities and works with the boys under his care. This is the last year they get to enjoy to Cub program, so it should be geared towards the transition they are going to face when they move on to the boy-led programs coming up.

We have the same type of discussions in our sports programs. Only 30% of grade school/junior high athletes will continue to play in high school. Should we focus our attention on being a good feeder program for the high school, or should we put more of our efforts on making the games more enjoyable for the 70% of kids who will, in all likelihood, never advance to a high school team?

The same is true of scouting. Boy scouting and cub scouting are two very different activities. Many boys who enjoy cub scouts will not join boy scouts. By making the last two years of cub scouts into a feeder program for the troops, are we doing a disservice to those boys who aren't going to carry over to boy scouts?

1 hour ago, Tampa Turtle said:

Nothing new (I knew about that one BTW) but what would the historic pattern per 1,000 student population be? 

As with all statistics, it all depends on how you calculate the numbers. Some people only count gun related incidents. Others count all criminal acts that result in fatalities.

Including the Our Lady of the Angels fire (1958), which was caused by arson, would really skew the numbers.

It is very sad. Unfortunately, it is nothing new.  I think the Bath School Massacre (1927) is still considered by many to be the worst school attack in U.S. history.

20 minutes ago, MattR said:

Is it that you see competition go so far that it takes over and replaces the scout oath and law? That I'd understand. 

Oh no. Nothing like that.

I don't mind scouts playing games and having skill competitions at meetings and events. That's fun.

It's only when people start ranking the scouts, and claiming that someone is a better scout than the other boys, that I get upset. If a boy is behaving himself and having fun at scouting, he is a good scout.

Scouting is about self-improvement and having fun. It is not about outperforming the other scouts. 

2 hours ago, Eagledad said:

Aren’t you the adult who doesn’t allow OA in your troop?

Barry

You must mean my CO's troop. 

Yes, my CO's unit has never participated in OA.

7 minutes ago, Col. Flagg said:

Fixed your post. 

Thank you. I totally agree.

2 hours ago, Eagledad said:

Todays adults prefer mediocrity so that nobody feels bad being the below average scout. 

Scouting isn't a competition. I don't think there is any such thing as a below average scout. 

Scouting is about having fun with your friends. It is not supposed to be like school or sports. Scouting doesn't have grades or class ranking. There is no above average or below average. There is no best of the best. There are no championships. There are no all-stars. There are no winners and losers. 

I am often annoyed by people who try to take the competition out of sports, but I am even more irritated by people who try to put competition into scouting. Not in my unit.

Quote

* Do you have those little lemon shaped bottles of lemon juice in the states? We did pancakes at Explorers last week, luckily I took some proper lemons as I don't know how old this bottle we had was, but the juice had turned brown and refused to come out of the little hole in the top. I guess it may have been past its best before date.

Yes, we do. The most common brand in my area is ReaLemon.

I do like a few sausage links with my pancakes/maple syrup. Was that sausage? I thought they were over-cooked hockey pucks.

If sausage makes you shudder, you best not ask what they try to pass off as butter.

1 minute ago, Sentinel947 said:

That's really unfortunate if that's how things are in your area. 

It is not only that way in my area, it is that way on this forum.