InquisitiveScouter

They will have to figure it out... And according to the doctrine, guess who is supposed to take over CM duties when the CM leaves? The CC 😋 • If the Cubmaster is unable to serve, assume active direction of the pack until a successor is recruited and registered. https://filestore.scouting.org/filestore/pdf/510-240.pdf

The ASM said they are supposed to have those management plans in order to get the logging permits, but most states don't follow up after the logging is done to see if they complied with the plan... A camp in PA we went to a few summers ago had spent (they said) almost a million bucks rehabbing the dam for their lake. Later, they logged the side of the mountain above the lake, and did significant damage to the watershed. He took me on a hike around the logging area and showed me how all the runoff areas had become severely eroded, and where did all that soil go? Right into the "new" lake. He told me if them if they didn't fix the problem soon, their dam repairs will have been money thrown down the drain. Camp Director (a council professional) said "Thanks, we will look into it. That was the ASM's first summer camp, and he asked me, seriously, "I thought the BSA were supposed to be stewards of the environment?" Last summer, the camp we went to had logged several hundred acres...nearly clear-cut and also watershed damage. When he asked the ranger about it, he said it was all done to stop emerald ash borer. He shook his head...told me later that someone, somewhere wasn't being honest. He had walked through the area...most of the species harvested were not ash, and that logging wasn't a way to stop EAB... Most logging of ash is being done to get the trees (and therefore, the cash) before EAB kills the trees and makes them unusable. Our own camp had similar issues...storm damage and EAB...was supposed to be a type of salvage logging operation with re-planting...took many trees that were neither downed, nor ash ... near clear cut, and no replanting. Council called on Scouts to come and replant...and two years on, it ain't pretty

Logging to sell...raise money for council...and often with disastrous results. One of my ASM's does environmental impact plans and assessments for the state. He has been shocked at the devastation he has seen at our local camp, and at the two out of council summer camps he has been to with us since his son joined the Troop. The council I grew up in did the same...logged our remote lake camp for cash in the 80's (really trashed the place), then logged our main camp just before selling it in the 90's and moving all ops to the remote camp.

You wished for fee increases? You dirty rat!

Was thinking about transitioning over to BPSA...and starting a unit here. But, it might be seen only as a "cult of personality" thing and cause division. I think I may take a break for a few years from BSA to clear my head

Which is why we have quite a few young people who are seen as not fitting in to other groups of their peers... BSA has a long way to go here...how many of your council camps have been logged??

Agreed. This is what our council has said...follow guidance of your CO. It is one of the first common sense pronouncements I have seen from them...

I should post this one in the Pet Peeve thread 😜

BSA is experiencing the perfect storm... The mills of the gods grind slowly, but they grind fine.

You have asked a question that you might not like the answer to... BSA COVID-19 FAQ ( https://www.scouting.org/coronavirus/covid-19-faq/ ) says, in typical CYA fashion... Q: If meeting locations are open, can units meet or do other in-person activities? Councils make the determination, working closely with their council health supervisor and local health department, about when units can conduct in-person meetings and activities again. If the unit’s local council is allowing in-person activities but has restrictions in place (e.g., no more than 10, social distancing of 6 ft. etc.), the unit must meet and abide by those restrictions – even if the unit is traveling out of council/state. underlining added Good luck...

5thGen, This is also a failing of the Committee that is all-too-common (lack of succession planning and training). Most people will let someone else carry the burden as long as they will...so do not feel guilty about dropping these responsibilities. It sounds as if you have been letting them know for long enough. Thanks for making the program work! Now, when you do step down, be prepared for folks to say you have done it without warning. 😜 Just smile, correct them gently, and enjoy being a parent for a while.

Primarily used to drain sanity 😜

What does that fact alone say about the organization?

Agreed...

Our "honor campers" sleep in staff cabins and camp buildings during Ordeals. Usually only candidates and a few Elangomats sleep outdoors. Great way to set the example, huh? Our lodge fellowship weekend draw is that the youth conduct massive video game sessions well into the night. That's the only reason my son wants to go...gggrrrrr

If everyone can be "elected", then there is no bestowing of honor. Nor any incentive for a Scout to change his behavior/model others so as to be worthy of selection.

I call it the "self-licking ice cream cone" SLICC Our lodge does zero service projects, other than for council. And nothing for units outside of elections. They conduct inductions/ceremonies, go to conclave and NOAC, use captive labor at Ordeals to set up tents and flies/ do general maintenance for Summer Camp. Members (adult and youth) our lodge repeatedly use the phrase "sash and dash", which I decry. An Arrowman's first duty is to his unit. For our last election, they actually sent this guidance out to unit leaders..."The question of how the Scout will deal with membership should be considered before approving them for eligibility." and "Will the Scout do their Ordeal and then never be involved with OA again (i.e. the "sash and dash")?" [Copied and pasted directly from the Lodge email.] Here was our Troop reply: "As a long-time member of the Order of the Arrow, I want to ask you (and, through you as Chapter Adviser, all lodge members) to reconsider using phrases like "sash and dash", or asking unit leaders to evaluate whether members will become involved with the lodge in order for unit leaders to approve candidates. Those are not, nor ever have been, considerations for election. If a lodge or chapter election team instructs the Scouts of our Troop to consider these as criteria for selection, I will stop the election immediately. The questions and inappropriate additional criteria show a misunderstanding of the mission and purpose of the Order. https://oa-bsa.org/about/mission-purpose Youth membership in the Order is an honor bestowed by the youth members of the unit onto one of their own. The lodge has absolutely no say in it, nor can any lodge add criteria for selection. If an eligible Scout does not wish to be considered for election, that is fine. Whether an elected Scout chooses to undertake the Ordeal is irrelevant. His election is an honor in and of itself. If the Scout does complete the Ordeal, he is a member of the Order of the Arrow for as long as he maintains a membership in the BSA. Whether a Scout chooses to maintain membership in the lodge after his induction is irrelevant. Order of the Arrow membership does not depend on lodge membership. An Arrowman's primary duty is to his unit, not the lodge. That this ideal is not prevalent in our lodge is troubling."

Amen to that!

Yikes

"The Peter Principle is based on the logical idea that competent employees will continue to be promoted, but at some point will be promoted into positions for which they are incompetent, and they will then remain in those positions because of the fact that they do not demonstrate any further competence that would get them recognized for additional promotion. According to the Peter Principle, every position in a given hierarchy will eventually be filled by employees who are incompetent to fulfill the job duties of their respective positions."

Most of the really good, conscientious, dedicated-to-the-movement professionals (DE's) I have met over the years, got disillusioned or burned out, then left. I understand this is a common thing, but have no data to back it up. What is the turnover rate for DE's?? Most (not all) of the professionals I have become acquainted with, who have advanced further, were there for themselves or the hope of future big money as an SE or some position at region/national. I think this mentality has finally borne its fruit. Two exchanges really stick in my head... My first SE, in the council I grew up in, tried to recruit me as a DE when I was graduating college. I told him "Thanks, but I am going to be a pilot in the Air Force!" He replied, "Now there's a waste of a good education." I never spoke to him again. (And was an officer and pilot for 26 years 😜 ) When I retired, and came to this council, looking to get involved, the current SE tried to recruit me as a DE (and later as full time Camp Director). I asked him what was his biggest headache in the council... He said, "Volunteers who put on the uniform and think they are equal to me." I chose neither to befriend him, nor work for him in any hired capacity.

Concur... I've often thought there should be a lower age limit for Eagle Scout. And there are many things for the 16 yo to do...High Adventure, Hornadays, National Medal for Outdoor Achievement, Supernova Awards (Scouts and Venturing...5 total), Congressional Award for Youth (up to Gold Medal) (although not a Scouting program), Summit, Religious Awards for particular faith...

And the second pic above is a special forces unit...SEAL, Delta, Green Beret???...average age for those groups is in the 30's

Eagle94, I agree that our young military personnel are having experiences which make them grow up much faster. However, after 26 years on active duty, I can tell you the 18-25 year olds do need "adult" supervision. As a squadron commander (normal first level in Air Force that has UCMJ authority) I spent a great deal of time handling legal and readiness issues for this age cohort. Drugs/DUI/crimes/security violations/domestic issues/financial problems/mental health, etc. Most "kids" entering the military are quite unprepared for the military culture. Something that would be a minor offense in the civilian world (or no offense at all) can have serious consequences in the military. The research is becoming clear that our brains are not fully formed until we are between 25 - 30...specifically some areas of the frontal cortex. This area is the seat of executive function, responsible for processing what our actions should be in Situations that involve planning or decision making Situations that involve error correction or trouble shooting Situations where responses are not well-rehearsed or contain novel sequences of actions Dangerous or technically difficult situations Situations that require overcoming strong habitual response or resisting temptation ^^^^^Sounds like Scouting to me... Although I have not seen empirical evidence for this, I claim that Scouting is a "rehearsal" for those areas, and that, through having experiences in these areas at a younger age makes a young adult much more suited making good decisions in situations above. This is why people want to hire Eagle Scouts, why they are given higher rank when entering the military, and why, in later life, they are usually more "productive" citizens. Remember all the crazy stuff you did at this age? It's a wonder I survived, even as an Eagle Scout This is why I am involve in Scouting. I want young people to have experiences in a relatively well-controlled environment which will help them develop before they hit those critical 18-25 years, where their decisions will have more significant consequences. If you have the time, here is a good read https://www.rainbowrehab.com/executive-functioning/