5thGenTexan

Cub Scouts....

A lot of parents attend a Join Scout Night and listen to the spiel and sign up their kid.  Many of these parents never had an experience in Scouting, but it sounds like "something to do".  Of course you get a lot that show up to that first meeting and tap out right then and there.  The ones that stay fall into two groups of kids that actually want to be there and the other set of kids that don't care from the get go and are there because they are being told they have to.  Those kids that are being told they have to will leave soon because the parents get tired of fighting it and/or get tired of taking the time to go.  M

Now we are to the kids that wanted to be there, kinda sorta in the first place.  Many of them are going to get discouraged quickly.  All those promises of shooing BBs, archery, fishing, etc never come to fruition because the District doesn't plan enough events to fulfill the marketing.  The adventures that are the basis for rank are honestly kind of boring and as an adult, there isn't much there to build a fun meeting on.  So, going to lose some due to just don't want to go to boring meetings.  When you do get an enthusiastic adult, there is a risk they are one of those "uber" competitive people who run advancement to earn the most belt loops as possibly.  Numbers over substance.

A bigger problem I see is.,... kids have just changed.  Being outside from dusk to dawn was just how kids used to roll.  Scouts was just a continuation of what they were already doing and enjoyed.  Now, every household has multiple TVs, video game systems, tablets, phones.  Much of that of course carries over to car rides, restuarants, even at school it seems most of the day is looking at screen.  Society has shifted to a degree where putting all that away and doing community service, camping,, hiking etc just isn't something the parents or kids are really interested in.  

I don't think its Cub Scout burnout, its just lack of interest in the type of activities that Scouting provides.  I think a lot of folks that were Scouts 30+ years ago have a bias that doesnt allow them to recognize that.  Not saying the bias is bad or misguided, but it does exist.  

I guess the real challenge is how to develop a program that is attractive to the interests of youth/parents today that doesn't totally throw away the basics of Scouting, but yet is able to complement the interests and desires of those folks.

4 hours ago, PACAN said:

I was just wondering 

how many are still meeting at their old UMC churches  (FUA)

how many were able to find new sponsors

how many are sponsored by their council 

how many unfortunately folded

We moved two troops and a pack to a local American Legion Post,  New COR is an Eagle from the Troop.  Aside from getting the right people to sign the right place and get all the paper work straight x 3 it was a pretty seamless endeavor.  We own our meeting place, so the facilities use agreement with the Methodist Church is to use their sanctuary for COH a couple of times a year and they have a big gym with a kitchen we use sometimes.

17 minutes ago, PACAN said:

Any feedback on how this went or is going in your local councils?

I was told by the DE that the general liability policy from BSA was going to cover us for the facilities use agreement,.

I am CC for boy troop and girl troop.  So, as Key 3 I guess I got email from the OA Advisor that elections will be happening at the end of March.  I dont know the process and I want to make sure I know what's going on.

Eligibility requirements I was sent are...

1st Class

20 days camping with one long term in the last 2 years.

I am good with making sure Scouts are eligible as far as that is concerned.  How are the Scouts who meet the requirement chosen for the elections or do we submit everyone with the above requirements met to the OA folks?

As far as the adults.  How does that work?  I have a leader that has been around awhile in the District saying they usually nominate the parent of the Scout so they can do it together?

I think I will probably reset my password by random keystrokes, so I dont even know what it is preventing me from signing back in and posting.

46 minutes ago, Eagledad said:

Hmm, how should a troop deal with the scout who doesn’t take a turn cooking? Or cleaning?  Or tearing down camp? Or……..? Or…….? 
There is a method behind the madness. But, some youth just aren’t ready to be part team program. They eventually will figure it out, or leave. But the program shouldn’t change for the rest of the scouts.

Barry

I am not even going to try to explain the Psychology of introverts.....  Would be futile.

Singing, skits, jokes, etc make me want to pack my stuff up and go home.  So... doesnt always build team spirit.  Personally, I simply won't take part in it.  

29 minutes ago, TheGreenWizard said:

     You have to understand; a true scout should always live by the Oath and Law. That is the true point of scouting; To prepare young boys (and now girls) for becoming adults, all while making friends and having fun along the way. If they don't actually live the scout Oath and Law, then they won't be able to advance in rank, provided the adult leaders are unbiased, and thus they will not advance in life either. That is on them, we don't need a merit badge for that. Most merit badges teach us skills, leadership and board of review/ scoutmaster conference questions teach us values. I also actually did read all the requirements, and am not very fond of them at all; they are still redundant in my eyes.

     The path toward good citizenship in our society is lined with the torches of Scouting. It goes up mountains, across rivers, and follows you throughout your life. By the end you are asked one question: Was it worth it? That is the Great Scoutmaster's conference for all good scouts.

I completely understand that.  I also know that in my observation its NOT happening.  It appears to me that Scout Law and Scout Oath are a tick box marked off as a requirement for Scout rank and never though about again.  It is not taken seriously by Scouts or adults.  The selfishness and ugly things I hear at district campouts as well as summer camp are disturbing.  

This sort of thing might already be covered in the Law and Oath, but in my observations those points are not sticking with the Scouts... (and many adults).  Reciting it and the start of meetings and living it are not the same, and I don't see many living it.  I have a great deal of what adults think is included in the requirements for Cit in Society and its obvious they really havent looked at what is really there.  

So, no... its not redundant and honestly I can think of a lot of adults in my own Unit who could benefit from the exercises.

I am a CC for our boys troop and girls troop.  In 2020 I began working on starting a Troop for girls in our community.  I had my daughter who as soon as it was allowed, I signed up in Cub Scouts and we pretty much ran through Webelos and AOL at the same time alone, at home.  As soon as she was finished with AOL I started promoting the potential Troop for girls and got absolutely nothing.  I was posting on FB in our community, on District FB, on Council FB and even was able to get an article in a real life newspaper.  I was able to get a few interested girls here and there, but when I got 4 and almost 5, two would lose interest.  So, never able to get 5 at one time to start things officially.  A year later, we tried again and with a couple of girls who were kids of leaders in the boy troop but had absolutely no interest in Scouts, we made our 5 even if a couple were just on paper.  I am rechartering with I think 9 Scouts this time.

There are no AOL girls about to cross over but there are 3 in the Webelos Den and as I understand it only 2 might want to be in the Troop when the time comes.  

My point here, girls have only been allowed to be in Cub Scouts since 2019.  We are about to start the 5th year of this nationally.  There hasnt even been the potential for a girl who joined as a Lion or Tiger to go through the entire program yet and see if they want to cross over to a Troop.  As with boy troops we have the challenges of sports, and I am talking these high dollar baseball and soccer leagues people put their kids in thinking they will be professionals one day.  Then there are normal sports in school, band, etc.  There are not enough hours in a week for everything that is offered now days.  

So, I am not sure how it can get "resolved soon".  The ambition and desires of youth today are not what they were in the past.  Not every kid is going to join Scouts, especially if 3/4 of their peer group is involved in something else and the parents of those kids are all friends as well, and going to those sporting events is their social activity.

I would love for more youth to be interested in Scouting.  I would love for National to allow us to have co-ed Troops.  But for every family that joins, you could lose two because one gender or the other is going to be hanging around at the same time.  Just from my experience in being involved in our two committees, outside of program, and as far as our community and really District as a whole.  There are NO easy answers to any of this.  There are challenges coming from 10 different directions all the time just trying to keep what we have going.

My thinking was...  anything document or agreement that is with the UMC automatically becomes null and void if a particular church leaves the UMC.  What one groups believes or not doesnt come into. 

If a Unit has a facility use agreement or affiliation agreement with a UMC affiliated church, those agreements become meaningless the moment that church is no longer a UMC church.    

I guess this will make any facilities use agreements null?  Affiliation agreements as well.  Will whatever new group these churches fall under decide to charter Units?  So many questions that come up daily.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/hundreds-of-texas-churches-seek-approval-to-leave-the-united-methodist-church-saturday/ar-AA14P6If

3 hours ago, InquisitiveScouter said:

What does your son's patrol want to do?  Get another adult, and take them camping, if that's what the Scouts want.  Does not have to be the SM on every trip.

Your guess is as good as mine.  They have a patrol name, but beyond that I am not sure there is anything remotely patrol related.

5 minutes ago, fred8033 said:

You can provide friendly views to the SM, but at some point, you have to salute that the SM is the SM.

At some point my kid is going to get fed up and then a new CC will have to be selected. 

1 minute ago, KublaiKen said:

Ah, then I would say which weekend to go camping might be the secondary issue: that should be planned by the Scouts in the PLC at an annual planning meeting, not by old men on a message board. Youth-led is on the same level as outdoors in the hierarchy of Scouting, both are methods, right? Solve the problems by solving them together: dump the calendar dilemma on the PLC and let them solve it.

I am just a CC trying to walk a fine line between having a program and not making the SM mad and quitting.  we have different ides on how the Troop should operate.  I would be happy as a clam if we had an active PLC, but I can't get that through.  We are very "Lord of the Flies".  Even if there was plan, this ILST course is a newly announced thing.  I pulled the newly elected SPL aside on Tuesday and explained about 3 different tasks that needed to be taken care of that night at the meeting,  He looked at me like I was from Mars.  Not a single Scout who holds a leadership positions knows what it means.  They just know they got to vote for people for some stuff.  As far as I can tell, they believe it means they get to tell people what to do, and thats it.

The SM decided that the older Scouts were going to start the E-Prep MB at meetings so they were more engaged.  It turned out he didn't have a plan for the rest of the Scouts in the Troop while the older ones were working.  So, EVERYONE started the E-Prep and 6 or 7 do not have the First Aid MB that is a requirement. 

Therefore, my January plan is to get everyone set on First Aid, and the Scouts that are old enough NEED to be at ILST.  It might not be what they want right now, but there has to be a foundation started soon.  And this is a 113 year old Troop.  There is zero excuse for this.  I have been CC for a year and did my best to stay out of program, but I am done with that and going to seriously drive some change.

1 hour ago, DeaconLance said:

I camp out a month is a goal to strive for but cannot always be met.  JTE gold is 10 in a year.  Most Troops in my district can only do 6/7 in a year due to schedules.

I was made aware on Tuesday our Council isnt doing JTE any more.  That after I had filled out the worksheet. 🙄

16 minutes ago, KublaiKen said:

What did the PLC decide?

There hasnt been a PLC meeting in over a year.

1 hour ago, fred8033 said:

There is no meaningful scouting without camping and the associated adventures.  Scouting is building character by being outside. 

You can't require camping, but why be in scouting if you don't learn to love the core activities.  It would be like being on a football team, but not wanting to be on the field.

thats great, but I can't make there be more weekends in a month.

Camping required or just at least a Troop activity?

January is coming up. 

1st weekend is before everyone returns to school, so that is iffy.

2nd weekend is open.

3rd weekend.  There is an ILST course offered that I would like to propose our Scouts 13 and older attend.  Younger Scouts I am going to suggest we run a First Aid MB class all day Saturday.

4th Weekend - Pack PWD is planned and our Scouts typically help with that event.

Well, what I was going to organize is not going to happen this time.   I ended up with at least one adult having a conflict with the date, personally I have never presented this course and not entirely comfortable doing it, nor were a few of the other adults I spoke with.  Moreso, I found there is a course being offered the next weekend nearby.  I will be encouraging our Scout to attend that event, and I am going to plan on going as well just to observe how to present the material and other logistical type things.  

We are a UMC sponsored Unit(s).  We have made the decision and are moving forward with paperwork to be chartered by the local American Legion Post, and using a facilities use agreement with church.  The packet I was sent in email from our DE still has the option to continue being chartered by the UMC.  However, the situation within the UMC is one thing that causes us concern.  Many churches are already decided to leave the UNC and be independent or whatever they are calling it.  We have decided while the option exists, its better for us to go ahead and make the change now than wait and have to figure out what to do when they finalize thier split.

I try to get the idea across to Scouts that there is a difference in a "Leader" and a "Boss".  One tells people what to do and the other identifies peoples strengths and abilities and matches those things to a particular task.

I have dealt with adult volunteers who have served in the military and try to bring that style of management to the Pack / Troop.  Doesnt work well...

On 10/25/2022 at 7:04 PM, qwazse said:

Yes. Somewhere I’ve seen posters of the scout sign, salute, handshake, attention, at ease, as well as marching formations. Many of us take it for granted because a lot of us saw our heroes in film. I had Dad, uncles, an aunt, older brothers, several cousins, in the military. There were a lot of parades. (Multiples on the same day … Mom went from street sale to street sale.) Many, many, military funerals. I’m sure some of you were immersed in that culture even more.
My kids only experienced a fraction of those events, the movies they watched rarely involves military or even marching band, and their video games skipped the flag protocol part of life.

I was in marching band in high school, so I understand attention, marching, salutes. etc.  I have always been hesitant to get too much into that.  Just leery of making Scouts too "military" I guess.  

We are in need of some changes.  Troop has existed for a little over a year.  We have a lot of the Scouts that are disregarding "Scouts Attention", Scout sign is elbow to their side, and they more their feet a lot.  The worst thing is Scouts putting their on twist on the Pledge, Oath, Law during opening.  So, that all is about to change.

Another issue, is we are sharing our meeting place with two other Units, and sometimes we have to find a place at the meeting place to hold our 1 1/2 hour meeting.  So, I want to put together a "Troop Box" that has things we might need for a meeting.

Clip boards for the Scribe to take attendance or notes.

Pencils, Pens, Paper, staplers, paper clips.

Maybe make sure there is a Troop copy of the handbook in there.

What else do we need?

AND, this is going to one of the responsibilities of the Quartermaster to take care of.

I just did this.  Texas rules, so...

We did have a bill of sale from the previous Troop and that made our transfer easy.  In Texas a trailer of this size and type has NO title.  It just had to be registered to someone.  I put it in the name of the Troop and they wanted a person on the registration as well, so... its me. 

The thing is, every state is going to be different.  Might even get different answers depending on WHO you talk to at the office.