ItsBrian

I never eat with the boys, I don't like Pop Tarts for breakfast, hot dogs for lunch and god-only-knows for supper.

Really? I’ve never had a simple meal on my troop, always have eggs & cheese on a bun with meat for breakfast, stews or Dutch oven and more for dinner.

I'm think the same thing.  The Venturing program does not use the patrol method.  It is designed more like the standard top down structure used by the military and business entities.  Maybe a "club" or "service organization" would be a better descriptor of a Crew.  President, VP, Sec, Treas, etc.  They focus on a certain activity, fun (local kayak club), service (Lion's, Kiwanis, etc.), but don't focus on a specific program, but something of like interest.  Under those circumstances, they are not trying to develop a knowledge of group dynamics and leadership, it is assumed those issues have already been learned along the way.  By the time youth reach the high school years (14-18) they are mature enough to theoretically handle the adult world of group organization.

I believe what you are describing is a Venturing Crew.

I personally would rather have that implemented into troops.

I’m not a adult, but here’s what I experienced and my opinion.

First, it depends on the ages. You wouldn’t send a group of Tenderfoots or so by themselves, they are still new to the troop and so on. But, like a senior patrol, Star, life, then I would say okay. I would make sure I trusted them.

I have no idea whether or not safe scouting requires you to be with them, but I think as long as you’re in the area you will be fine.

Again, my opinion.

I think my idea would work out better for smaller troops, where there’s only 2-3 small patrols won about 6-8 in each.

What you did is fine. It's represented and considered as part of the plan.

 

I tell scouts to put it under supplies as the comment right above supplies says "Supplies are things you use up, such as food and refreshments, gasoline, masking tape, tarps, safety supplies, and garbage bags".

 

As long as you show your planning, what you did is just fine.

 

I agree with mostly everything you say. Espesically about how some say “follow the chain of command†and ask your PL before anything else when they have no authority.

What if there was no PLs, instead a SPL and 1-3 ASPLs? ASPLs would have a job, such as camping, instructional, meetings, or whatever is needed by a troop.

Just a thought, don’t want to cause a arguement.

@@Stosh Wow! It’s amazing how something like that can be done without hassle. Sadly, my troop is to small for the way your troop does it.

Good luck with the rest of your project!

Thanks! Just finished today.

Eagle Scout and current Project Coach: 

 

I'd include it under "Other Needs"

 

Figured, wasn’t positive though.

Thanks!

@@Stosh Wow! That must’ve been difficult in the beginning. I doubt that in many troops they wouldn’t be able to handle it. May I ask though, was there a need to have four+ different calendars?

Question for past Eagle Scouts, advisors, coach, whatever you want to call it.

Finished the 1st day of my project... Looking over my completed Plan and thought should I include the food cost in ‘Other Needs’, put the total in the little section where it adds everything up, or don’t include it at all.

Anything helps!

I'd suggest one of two things:

1. recruit a staff cook team. You can have staff that supports the other staff.

 

I like that idea as well. Possibly with a little pay for incentive of being apart of the staff cooking team.

Personally I doubt many staff members want to be bothered with that. They will be sweaty, tired, and be in no mood to make anything.

Ditto the previous.   Scout should check with:  1) Scoutmaster.   2) other Scouts that have earned the MB. 3) District Scouters (find the RoundTable !) on the website . Merit Badge Counselors are "supposed" to be vetted /listed by the District. If no MBDean listed, ask the Advancement Chair.    4)  Council Office. Ask for the District Executive or the Council Advancement Chair.  

 

If the Scout is not in the "18 rush", he should pursue the above.   

 

If you poke around Scouter dot com enough, you will learn that many of us here abouts do not often favor MB Universties or Days or such.  Better the Scout work with a local MBC directly . Perhaps the Scout can help set up the Eprep event to help others get there !

Ditto to the last two.

Your Council should supply your scout master or advancement chair with a master sheet with all the info. Simply have your son talk to your scoutmaster, if he thinks he can handle it, he will get a blue card and a contact number or email.

I find there no reason to go to Council, even roundtables. Every Council is different though.

My main concern is boys having a tool that their hands can't grip.

My second concern is not every sheath grabs the blade smoothly or releases easily.

A third concern is that stupid happens fast, sometimes faster than webelos can think.

 

That said, you have to start somewhere.

Agreed. I personally wouldn’t trust anyone in cub scouts, I wouldn’t even trust some of the scouts in my troop... It depends on the person, and if they are trained and actually know how to use it properly.

Here comes the weekend...

But, of course with my luck, everyone I know has gotten sick and now I’m sick too! I feel horrible, but I’m going to do my project either way... and I have a lot to do today on getting some more supplies...

Going to be fun in the next couple of days...

My personal favorite solution is to go the Cub Scout camp route and offer activities rather than formal classes. On Cub camp staff, we didn't sign off on anything, as that was Akela's job. We just ran fun stuff. Boy Scout camps could do the same thing. Instead of Cooking MB class, they do sessions on various types of cooking - Dutch oven, backpacking stove, freezer bag. Instead of Kayaking and Rowing and Canoeing, there's instructional boating and open boating periods. Instead of Environmental Science, there are structured observation hikes and guided experiments on certain subjects.

The bigger question is whether anyone would go for this approach. Would units and parents pay for a camp where their Scouts learned rather than earned?

You didn’t sign off on requirements? I had worked this summer at a camp and we had signed off on requirements for them, but it was only to show the parents we did this, now review it.

I first did YPT at age 14, working on summer camp staff. Why not encourage youth leaders to take it? In modern form, it's a half-hour of common sense.

Had to take it this year, 15, for summer camp staff. It is honestly basically half hour of common sense

You won't (and didn't) know this before you signed up for the class so there is little that can be done to stop that. They larger issue is whether or not you signed up for that camp based on the MBs it offered. If you did, then that is the topic the OP is trying to address. If camps continue to offer MBs then there would be little Nationals can do (absent auditing every single class and program) to ensure that they are run according to standards.

We did not signup just for the merit badge (most camps have cooking anyway), but large classes can be prevented by having a limit on how many can be on one class.

The article isn't clear on exactly when the meeting is, but it does say there will be a protest at council hq on Sept. 18 at 6 p.m., which is about 10 minutes from now, and is about 10 minutes from where I sit at the moment.  (But I'm not going.) I guess that implies that the council executive board meeting is at the same time.

It’s probably only ten people anyway.

Follow-up:  At last week's troop meeting I spoke with the Scouter I mentioned above, who has actually been to Sabattis, unlike every other active adult (or Scout) in the troop.  He doesn't think there is much chance of that property being developed. He said it is located in the middle of a state park and that there is really no "infrastructure" that would support any kind of development.  He said it is "in the middle of nowhere", which I guess is a relative term, but as I said, he is my best available source of information about the camp.

 

He also said that rumors about closing Sabattis come up every 3-5 years and this is probably more of the same.

@@NJCubScouter

Another follow up from me as well, I went to Allamuchy for a hike this weekend and the reservation director said (who was just at sabattis recently)that it’s a beautiful camp and that’s it’s a shame that it may be closed... aren’t they voting today?

As a current scout, I’ll share my present opinion as I experience this yearly.

I agree and disagree with your reasonings. Not all summer camps are “MB assemnlylinesâ€, some actually coach, teach, whatever you want to call it.

What I think you should emphasize on as well is the SIZE of classes, you only talk about that a little bit. Example, I was in a cooking class with at least 30 people (5+ picnic tables filled). We did not actually cook food, we boiled frozen chicken tenders. I think you should also include how the QUALITY of the classes can be ruined by the size and inexperienced instructor(s). I went to the bathroom once with a buddy during the class and they didn’t even notice I came back! I probably could’ve never came back and still got the requirements done for that day.

Good question. Of the merit badges my son has started or finished:

 

Whether or not the MB requires some form of contact of an adult (and likely) stranger:

 

Citizen in the Nation - yes

Climbing - no

Collecting - no

Cooking - no (a bit of a surprise)

Dog Care - yes

Family Life - no

First Aid - no

Gardening - no - requires a visit to a location but no required interaction.

Home Repair - no (and the requirements of this one needs to be fixed otherwise there is virtually no way this is completed correctly unless the counselor is a parent).

Leatherwork - no, must visit a place of business but no required interaction.

Music - no

Physical Fitness - no, requires a doc visit but no interview.

Reptiles and Amphibians - no

Salesmanship - yes

Scholarship - yes

Skating - no

 

Not a lot of professions on that list so this isn't likely representative but still only 4 solid yes' out a list of 16. I would guess that less than half of all merit badges have a requirement to speak to a stranger. Probably quite a few that require learning about a profession or visiting the place of business without actually requiring the scout to speak to someone working in that profession (e.g. Gardening and Leatherwork)

For the climbing, cooking, and first aid merit badges, they should require adult interaction.

Can parents? Absolutely. Should parents? Perhaps.

 

@@ItsBrian, you state you would prefer your mom to counsel you in the Cycling Merit Badge to make your life easier and to avoid a stranger for requirement 7c. In my neck of the woods, we encourage (enforce is a little too strong of a word) Merit Badge Counselors to counsel Scouts inside and outside the Troop they are registered with. To @@John-in-KC's point of adult association, were your Mom to counsel you, you would loose out on that method. Your posts indicate someone who can articulate his thoughts well and communicate with adults with apparent ease, so a little less adult association via a Cycling Merit Badge isn't the end of the world. Just step out of that comfort zone from time to time. An encourage your Mom to counsel all Scouts interested in Cycling.

 

 

Now I'm wondering what percentage of Merit Badges have this requirement.

@@Chadamus

Sorry for the confusion!

She’s not only doing my me, she’s also registering for other merit badges.

My councils application says would you want to do your troop only, or the whole council. She checked off the whole Council. It’s also not only because of a stranger, but the counselors around me (from what I heard) don’t actually do the ride with you. They just wait at the end.

Something to try, thanks! 

 

Does anyone do boy talks in the classroom?

I’ve never heard personally of boy talks in classrooms. Honestly, it’s mostly the parents who decide to sign up their childen for cub scouts. I would recommend do advertising in public (e.g. yard signs) and try to have the fantastic events you do published in the newspaper and then put contact info for joining! If parents like what is done, they will sign their child up. Same goes for Boy Scouts, when we did a recruitment night, we got maybe one scout because we did not advertise well enough. But, by using all the ideas listed above, we had gained 5 members.

Also, children talk! Try to convince them to convince their friend to join. Same for parents.