carebear3895

2 hours ago, NJCubScouter said:

And now they have made the burnout problem even worse by adding Lions.

Been saying this since the very beginning. I cringe every time I see national say what a resounding success it's been. 

On 7/6/2018 at 9:14 PM, Eagledad said:

I have been watching National bailing water for over 25 years. I believe they never looked at declining numbers all that seriously because they believed the other program changes they implemented would out perform their program problems. I think they still believe that. Adding girls will save them.

Barry

Nail on the head. National never really freaked out about membership that seriously because they always had the LDS safety net. 

Good for them. Looks like they are starting to realize that STEM is, IMO, a waste of time for an "outdoor character and leadership building organization"...

Ironically, BSA allowing girls in was probably the best thing to ever happen to GSUSA programming. I think the last few months are the first time I've ever seen them promote something outside of cookies. 

Boy would I!

BSA is doing the ole "trying to please everybody, but end up pleasing nobody" tactic. 

Coming from a rural council, where most troop can barely keep 5 boys as is, I can guarantee linked troops won't work. Maybe in the suburbs/cities where ALL of the national execs come from it will work, but for us country folk it never had a chance of working the way it was designed. 

On 5/28/2018 at 5:15 PM, Eagle94-A1 said:

I worked with some professionals, who did some un-Scoutlike things. Some of them got promoted to regional and national staff.

*cough* Scoutreach *cough*

but boy isn't that the sad truth...We lose a lot of morally straight pros because of this. It's the never ending cycle 

14 hours ago, The Latin Scot said:

 And what of the new Scouting Museum? That place just barely opened, and now it's going to be all but devoid of visitors for almost two months ... it's like the BSA has been cursed! 

Never should've moved from Dallas in the first place. I get the idea of putting it by Philmont, I really do....but why move it from one the largest growing cities in america to Cimarron, New Mexico.

If they really wanted to move it that badly, should've gone to the summit. Lord Knows they need more attention. 

I fully support girls in scouting. I think allowing youth females in the Order of the Arrow has been very long overdue. I disagree with the Lion program. I'm not really sad to see the LDS leave scouting. The summit was doomed to fail from the beginning. 

 I think national has dropped the ball on pretty much every decision that has to do with allowing females in. Their lack of transparency and "secrets" has really, in my opinion, been a huge driving force in why people are against this decision. I think whoever came up with the idea for the skorts needs to be fired immediately.

Background: I spend my whole life in scouting, Tigers through venturing. I am an Eagle Scout and Vigil member of the OA. I spend five summers on Summer Camp staff. Volunteered for a little while as an ASM and chapter adviser. Then I crossed over to the Scouting dark side and I am currently a District Executive.  Have you turned in your FoS pledge card yet?

12 hours ago, Eagle1993 said:

Now time to beg for FOS donations... 😀

BAH GOD...That's carebear3895's  music!!

3 hours ago, desertrat77 said:

Point taken.  Instead of CSE, let's offer Mike Rowe the Chief Scout title.  I may have the exact wording of the title wrong, but it's a public/good will/ambassadorial type of job.  It's hasn't been filled by the BSA in years, if memory serves from prior threads.  Either way, I don't think the BSA would offer him the job for the same reason I mentioned in my previous post. 

So pretty much do what Scouts UK did. They awarded the title "Chief Scout" to Bear Grylls. Doesn't make any key decisions, but acts as the ceremonial head to the organization. 

National will never go for it. They love their key 3 setup too much

5 hours ago, FormerProfessional said:

I’m not a Surbaugh fan or hater. In his picture he wears 3 knots on his uniform. Eagle Scout, District Award of Merit, and the professional Darth Vader knot.  I know professionals with a DAM but they were awarded before they became a professional. I have never heard or met a professional with a DAM that was awarded it for being a professional.

The unofficial rule for professionals is one row of knots. Its super super super extremely mega rare, but a professional scouter can earn the DAM, but only while simultaneously being a volunteer. My guess is Surbaugh joined up with a pack or troop back in the day. 

2 minutes ago, gblotter said:

BSA National can declare that council-owned camp properties do not meet standards, but they cannot force a sale, can they?

you'd be surprised...National, Region, and Area executives can't force a sale, but they can be very "persuasive" to Scout Executives and exec boards

2 hours ago, Gwaihir said:

how we can get a petition started to voice no confidence in Michael Surbaugh and petition National to elect Mike Rowe as Chief Scout Exec?  

Sadly that now how BSA executive positions work. For any position in professional BSA, you need to start as a DE and work your way up. You can't laterally transfer to any position without "paying your dues" as a  commissioned DE first.

6 minutes ago, Jameson76 said:

I bet they said "Yes...as of right now"

Actually I was told there was no plan to change the name. And this was a couple weeks ago.

Just now, Oldscout448 said:

and they wonder why so many Scouters with decades of service are angry and disgusted.    Its not that we hate girls for Gods sake,   or even that we don't think they would be an asset to scouting,   its the simple fact that we hate being  lied to by those at the very head of our organisation.  Which by the way has as the first point of its law the word  Trustworthy.  

I actually asked someone at national the exact question "are you going to keep calling it boys life" and they told me yes. 

I feel straight up lied to by National. 

I'm actually upset with this.....

Boys Life was actually one of the only magazines I knew geared towards young boys. There was 0 need to mess with it. 

Add a "girls life" if you wanted to be inclusive. 

I think you're going to see A LOT of council mergers in the near future. For some reason, and I can't wrap my head around why, national seems to like the GSUSA "mega council" approach.  The days of small councils are going to be long gone, unfortunately. 

I also think your going to see a lot of council camps close. National has made it no secret they think the BSA owns way too much property. I predict more than half of council properties will try to be sold off. 

As for the Summit, yea that's gone. 

1 minute ago, David CO said:

Not according to Wikipedia. It says he was the first member of the board to come out against the old policy excluding gays.

ahhhhhhhh, I think I have my history backwards then. Thanks for clearing that up

On 5/23/2018 at 9:09 AM, Eagle1993 said:

 

1 minute ago, walk in the woods said:

  Sorry, no sympathy here.  

Didn't ask for it, bud. I just think some who are very negatively biased about our jobs and I'm trying to clear up some misconceptions. Thank you for your service

58 minutes ago, David CO said:

I suppose that one's opinion on that might depend on how much money they make. 

 

wow.....lets not beat around the bush anymore. You just straight up dislike the whole idea of professional scouters, no matter how much good they do

You should really check out our salary broken down hourly. 

Unfortunately, National has it's own "volunteer force" that make a lot of these decisions. Believe me when I say there is a HUGE disconnect between those in Dallas and those in the field. We all feel that, pros and volunteers alike.  There are a lot of things they do that make all of us bang our heads on our desks. 

I think Volunteers have every right to complain, the program happens with y'all, but taking it out on Unit-Serving Executives  is not the right way to do things. Believe it or not, we all want the same thing; to provide a quality program to youth. Refusing to give to FoS or sell popcorn because you're mad at National for changing the color of the shoulder loop from red to green only hurts yourself. (I use that example because that actually happened). 

It's a cop out, but I don't really have an answer because I'm still trying to figure it out myself. And for what it's worth, I went through the program as a kid and spent some time as a unit volunteer before sewing on the executive patch

2 hours ago, David CO said:

Exactly. If execs don't like this characterization, there is a quick and easy way for them to fix it. Stop paying themselves these outrageously high salaries.

 

I'm sorry but this is incredibly shortsighted and frankly insulting to a lot of good professionals out there. We work TOGETHER to provide a program FOR THE YOUTH.

Do I think National execs and some SE's make too much? Yea, i kinda do. But to think cutting their salaries is the magical fix to all the problems with the BSA, that's just silly. I try to be humble about our jobs because this truly is a volunteer driven organization, but to say we do nothing to support the units pisses me off to no end. Don't for one second think i'm doing this job to give my boss a bigger paycheck, I do it because I want to grow this program I love. 

2 hours ago, David CO said:

Not a chance. I never contribute to FoS.

I'm sure that DE's work very hard, and put in long hours, trying to raise money to pay the bloated salaries of the higher level scout execs. That's your job. You don't do anything for us. 

 

Yea because the whole point of the Boy Scouts of America is to make Scout Executives rich. DE's are slaves to SE's, we don't care about the volunteers we work alongside. Packs and Troops are just thorns in our sides in our goal to make as much money as possible.

....Give me a break...