cyclops

I sorta see Stosh's point. That bitter taste is going to remain for a long time after the satisfaction of attaining rank wears off. OTOH, that bitter taste is also a valuable incentive to avoid something like that in the future by being better prepared. Hey, that would make a great motto: "Be Prepared". Some youth organization ought to adopt that as their motto.

I'm personally glad to see the Scouting 'presence' in the cabinet, but not all that surprised. My only observation after the grotesque spectacle of the campaign, and especially the things Trump said regarding women, he would find opposition to a leadership position in this unit. And if by some means he managed to attain such position anyway, I'd advise the women to consider wearing cups.

Tyke, Joe would be welcome here too. Looks like BSA hasn't noticed what happened in NC. If they really want to be true to some ill-defined principle, they need to require a karyotype for all members who might be disqualified because of gender.

For Cubscouting in particular, it seems that being a woman is just fine after the age of 18 and in a leadership/role model capacity. But NOT if age 8? Right.

Yes, as a society and with the help of technology we're finding previously unknown situations faster than some people can accept. But BSA is in a position of resistance to one more 'local option' chink in their 'tradition'. Like I said, Joe (or someone like Joe) will be welcome here.

But I suppose BSA can stand at the bathroom door with Sheriff Arpaio and demand the long-form birth certificate...if that's really what they want.

Edited to add: Quote from Effie Delimarkos, the communications director for the Boy Scouts of America, "Gender identity isn’t related to sexual orientation."

ROTFLMAO!

I mean, like, FAR OUT!!...man.

And the purpose of a policy that allows him to 'have' the patch but not to wear it is...?

The BoR is the date he is an Eagle, but he can't officially wear the patch until your Council gets the paperwork back from National. There is no requirement to have a CoH, and I would doubt anyone would raise an eyebrow if he were to start wearing the Eagle patch the day after the BoR

 

8.0.3.0.11  - from the GTA: The Eagle Scout medal or patch must not be sold or otherwise provided to any unit or to the Scout, nor should the court of honor be scheduled until after the certificate is received at the council service center from the National Advancement Team.

I'm curious to know how many times has a boy passed the EBOR but was denied the rank by National Advancement Team?

Yeah I agree with WAKWIB. It depends. If you want to move fast, it takes time to break camp, at least for our guys. We've done it that way plenty of times but on occasion, if the trip limit puts us in an urban area, we've stopped at a motel with a swimming pool as well. My favorite is heading to the Keys and stopping at the springs areas and other great parks in Florida. The travel becomes part of the overall adventure experience. But if time is tight, OTOH......

That's an absurd statement.

The people who ask questions like this are the ones who I want to lead my youth on the designated weekend.

 

Not knowing the stream's location, we have no way of knowing if it even is carrying high water. Thanks to internet guages, we sometimes can look it up, but even so, we have no way of knowing its high-water properties on a given day.

Furthermore, even knowing the stream, one would have no way of predicting if it will even have high water 4 days out.

 

But gathering data and learning what to ask for from rangers and outfitters on the go/no-go day (usually 36 hours in advance of launch, but sometimes right up to that morning) enables an accurate assessment. Props to @@mashmaster for wanting to learn what to look for.

 

Nowadays, cancelling a trip on what would be an otherwise good day puts a youth at risk of getting injured severely while playing PoGo.

 

So Mash, keep an open mind, but have a plan B (maybe even a plan C) ready for the boys in case that funny feeling you're having does match the hydrology.

Actually, I think Richard has good instincts. The flow rate is relevant mostly if one also takes into account the cross-section, gradient, roughness, and a good personal knowledge of the stream combined with good judgment is what is needed, not some arbitrary discharge number. I have watched several near disasters after the trip took bad advice from people who are not familiar with the stream. No one should take lightly the power of moving water, no matter what, and if there is any hesitation on the part of the leader, it might be time to seek one of those other plans.

@@Beavah you are a vile human being. The things you have not only assumed but publically stated have literally made me sick to my stomach! You sir have given me the very same feeling that I get while thinking of what the parents thought as soon as they got this letter. How damaging.

Wow, ad hominem attack extraodinaire! No hint of scout spirit around this post! I have (taking vumbi's advice for once) restrained myself from attempting to enter this 'conversation' and if there had been any doubt about it before, the above post confirmed it. To me it is clear that there is a problem. The above post is a good indicator of where to look to define it.

Agree with TAHAWK. I think of experience as information that can't be communicated any other way. The two,  information and experience, compliment each other and can be applied in either direction, information first or knowledge through experience.

I sometimes wear two knots. I have earned many. I don't care much for the 'Russian general' approach so I don't employ it. If parents tend to base their opinions on something that superficial, then so be it.

If they charge this to adult volunteers as well, they can kiss their membership goodbye. What a ridiculous idea.

Yep, deathwish.

One drawback that I've noticed for the retired volunteers I've observed is that while the council places no value at all on volunteers whom they don't pay, it is the retirees among the overall volunteer group who seem most freely to decide when or where they feel like volunteering. I can't blame them really. The closest camp to us does not 'employ' retirees at all for summer camp, or really even any volunteers during summer camp other than unit leaders, as it should be.

Had a conversation with Vumbi. He asked me to do a favor and thank everyone in this thread for (I'll paraphrase here) providing another example in support of his (ahem, low) opinion of I&P as a forum. I think I'll leave out the rest of the details.

Favor done.

I'm beginning to like Mrs. Stosh...maybe Sainthood for her for that matter...considering....

Really Stosh, are you going to try to argue that you must be right, based on a Google search?

John-in-KC, lol, at first I read your 'apologetics' as 'apoplectics'. Somehow my version seems to work better.

To NJCubScouter,

Thank you.

LOL, Stosh, they don't HAVE to go into politics....

Acco40, I like to ask them what evidence or observations would it take for them to change their minds? Usually that's the end of the discussion because they think they know what they know 'absolutely'.

Seems like summer staff isn't exactly part of a mature career...more of a way to get a little experience and maybe 'test the waters'. When I was a camp counselor I was paid $5 per week. I had a bed, got fed, had electricity, etc. And I made $5 in addition to the experience and even some elements of education.

Based on that personal experience, I doubt that staff like me would be considered in this whole issue. I sure know I wouldn't expect 'overtime' pay, whatever that is. I freely decided to apply as a counselor knowing what the pay was and that was that. If I was in it for big bucks I would have done something else.

LOL, gumbymaster, I think vumbi had the 'short answer'.

Mine isn't much longer. He should live by the scout oath and law, especially in the tough times when the temptation is to engage in destructive behavior. He's competent in the woods and is an all-round good citizen.

We don't. Checks only. We tend to like the paper trail.

This looks like an appropriate thread topic for this. I got a PM from a member/moderator and after thinking about his message, I think he's right and I should not have left just because of some jerks who do not live by the scout law. I should have taken them to task. I apologize for leaving. It wasn't for the best of reasons.

I sent a message to NJCubscouter explaining my decision. I'll be going now.

double post. How does this happen?