Brewmeister

I just use a regular mesh bag and band the top to make it tight enough.

What I have found in the forums and elsewhere is general consensus on the following points:

-Hammocks without insulation systems are good to about 45 degrees.

-Sleeping bags don't provide much insulation on the bottom regardless of their temperature rating because you are compressing the bag, plus the airflow. (Plus they're hard to get into in the hammock and many people simply use a blanket.)

So, the problem is that a lot of the tent camping we would do will be in the 40s. Even our "spring" campout in May was to near freezing at night.

It's one thing to wake up stiff and sore, but it's another to not be able to sleep because you are cold, so I do have a real concern about this type of system for me.

By the time I get into buying underquilt systems or oversized pads to put inside the hammock...maybe it's not worth it.

Ok. So after much research and trying the feel of various things I'm close to pulling the trigger on a Hennessey hammock.

The only concern I have is that besides being old and creaky I am also cold. And cold is one of the things that hammocks seem to not do well, but there are various ways to insulate those. Not an issue for our canoe trip in July, but moreso in fall.

Thoughts on the Hennessey and the cold question?

Sorry twocub, I forgot the in my post...

My we're a happy bunch today. I recommend more fiber.

I have no problem with a pack using a district camp as a summer activity for the award. It may be a district camp but, at least in our district, you have to sign up and go as a unit. Regardless, the pack promotes it, collects money for it, organizes transportation for it, and does some activities and programming while there. It is still a pack activity.

It's all about getting the unit together and doing stuff over the summer and it's not a rank/advancement award. Just use your judgment.

How do we get the boys and parents to appreciate the journey when they are focused on the destination?

I don't see the big deal. Aren't boys supposed to be doing the planning? So this seems like one of those lesson-learning opportunities. Either it will work or it won't.

My philosophy is you plan events for the people who can make it, not for those who can't. Those who can come, will.

The leader may simply be too busy to notice that his son is being a knucklehead. It happens. At events where the dads are off with their boys, I've often had to run around handling details leaving my son to fend for himself. So sometimes the behavior is not noticed.

Is the boy's behavior really far out of line compared to other kids? Leaders' kids are under a microscope. I've explained this to my son--people hold the leader's kid to a higher standard. Any crummy behavior on his part is going to be magnified, it's just the way it is.

In the first case, maybe you can help by paying attention the leader's kid when he cannot.

In the second, you'll have to decide if you should say something. I always told the parents they were free to discipline my son--and they did!

This has probably been discussed before...but anyway...

I was talking to a friend of mine recently. He has gone through various leadership rolesDL, CM, troop committee. His son has been involved in scouting since he was a Tiger, and the boy is now a Life Scout entering high school.

My friend said to me, You know, I really dont understand why my son likes this scouting stuff. To me it seems pretty boring and a lot of it is like school.

My response was thats not what scouting is supposed to be about, and I spouted the party line about the outdoors and personal growth and leadership and all that good stuff.

His reply was, Yes, but whats the POINT? In other words, without what he viewed as the measurement of progress (badges and rank), the purpose wasnt there. To him the purpose of scouting is the destination, not the journey.

Its easy to think that way and I do it myself. People have a natural focus on achievement and outcomes that can be measured by grades, advancements, awards, trophies, college admissions, salaries, and so on.

We have a hard time justifying being involved in something just because its a lot of fun to do. Thats not time well spent, after all. We should be doing something more productive. So if Johnny is involved in scouting, he really should be working toward something thats going to pay dividends.

Its not just scouting. Kids dont get together to play sandlot baseball any more. Instead, parents put their kids on teams with practices, scrimmages, and games four nights a week and trips to other cities on the weekends to compete in high-pressure tournaments.

A lot has been written in these forums about what the struggles of scouting are related to, whether its the demise (or not) of the patrol method, helicopter parenting, social/religious policy, national organization structure, and so on.

Maybe its really because we as a society arent willing to let kids just have fun for the sake of fun anymore.

Go over the parents' heads to the boys.

Have a packet of "stuff" for the boys who sign up - a red vest patch, maybe an outdoorsy kit or gift of some sort. Each one assigned to the boys who sign up.

So if you show up but didn't sign up, you can still attend, but you don't get the stuff.

After a time or two they'll catch on.

Remember that High Adventure tends to attract outdoor parents who do not attend regular BSA Webelos III monthly outings.

I have no idea why you so frequently need to work in this pejorative into an otherwise-helpful response. Is this just a nervous tick or something? What does mentioning the nonexistent "Webelos III" add to the discussion AT ALL?

I never considered not going as an option.

At the Pack level, our practice was always, "we are having XYZ event, you are responsible for getting your scout there. If you want to carpool you have to make your own arrangements with others who are going."

I am finding on the troop level the practice is, "We are having XYZ event, we need X number of seats/drivers."

Even though the troop should be boy led, adults must often be recruited to drive scouts to the venues of various activities.

What are some of the ways you have found to be effective to get the adults you need to support the transportation (and other adult needs) of the program?

SP, is the reason for your method cost? Otherwise it seems like a lot of work on your end versus buying the box kits.

Yes. Need to do this outside. Be sure to paint the boats (or they will suck up water). Put the masts in and have the boys hold the masts while they spray paint them. Clip them to a line to dry while you go do another activity. Come back when they are dry and put the keel and rudder on. Use a hot glue gun to hold them in place.

There sure are a lot of things that aren't good enough in Scouting. Certainly not as good as they used to be back in the day, that's for sure.

The Eagle ain't what it used to be...paper Eagles and parlor scouts, that's what they are I tell ya, and more of 'em sneaking it in just under age 18 than ever before. First class, what a joke, boys get it in one year now, can you believe it? They can't navigate their way out of a paper bag for goodness sake. Wood badge? Oh good grief don't even get me started, nobody who goes though the program nowadays goes through what WE went through. Posers and pantywaists, all of them.

I guess I am just assuming there is no TG b/c I haven't seen anyone acting in that capacity and nobody is listed as such on the youth leader roster, but neither I nor my son have asked.

Either way, the learning curve has been very steep considering that I have a greater knowledge of the program than your average parent. I am finding myself doing more than I thought I would or should.

Thanks for starting this thread.

Maybe I'm just an old fashioned guy but IMO if it says do it in the book you should do it. A run doesn't count unless you cross the base, or if you decide to leave out a few measures in the solo you are performing at ensemble you're not going to get a good judges score.

When I was a scout we were the Blue Fox patrol and I know we had a flag for sure.

My son is assigned to a NSP. However the guidance of this patrol has not been real strong. There is no TG and the expectation is that they sort of find their own way in the world. Which they should, but right now they don't know the way.

I feel that the NSP should be getting more guidance and meeting occasionally to orient themselves to the program and perhaps work on stuff like a flag and yell, yes to do the requirement as written, but who knows, it might spark something.

What would you do?

I don't think this link was posted here anywhere. I'm sure this will get some interesting responses. http://abcnews.go.com/m/story?id=16408357

Speaking from 20 years of experience in the insurance industry, the signs that say "Our insurance company prohibits us from..." in any business are about the most meaningless signs around.

They're kind of like the fake "Security Company" placards designed to deter thieves.

With that said, it's not a reason to engage in activity that is disallowed by the organization. I'm just speaking to the insurance question. For instance, I've occasionaly heard people comment about tour plans that if you don't get the tour plan filed, there's no insurance, and that's simply not the case.(This message has been edited by brewmeister)

That sounds like a good idea. I need to know what I am talking about before I talk about it.

The good news is that I know several of the boys and dads are already outdoorsmen and hunters. I know that three of the boys for sure, along with my son, went turkey hunting in spring, which is actually how I got to meet one of the dads.

So I figure that any boys that are willing to get up at 4 am in the dark and cold and rain and trudge into the woods to go hunting are probably up for more adventure as well.

Actually he done good.

I thought I would circle back on this one at this point.

My son put together a training plan that involved conditioning and strength and I printed him off some calendar pages so he could keep track of his schedule.

When he started, he could not run a mile straight through without stopping or do a pullup. By about the 8th week he ran a mile straight through and cut over two minutes off his time and can get his nose to the pullup bar. Every other category improved as well.

Because his running was going so well I asked him if he wanted to do a local 5k race. I ran it with him. His average mile time was faster than his fastest mile had been, and his fastest split mile in the race was also a new personal record.

He has a couple weeks to go but he's looking forward to turning in his completed training log to his MBC...along with his race bib...

That helps with the logistics and how-to assuming the decision has been made that this is what the unit wants to do.

My question is how to get the unit to want to do it. Talk to the SM? The PLC? I have no clue. I am just a dad in this program, not a leader.

Perhaps the best thing to do is to get acclimated to the troop program (it's only been a few months). At this point my son is quite happy with the camping the troop does, and he's on the ground floor of the program so everything is brand new. I don't know if I know enough to even suggest any changes at this point, if that makes sense.