gumbymaster

Leadership is a very interesting concept.

 

Most people have a preconceived notion of a leader (and not all the same).

 

Some leaders are take charge, here is what we are going to do, and "follow me boys" types.

 

Some leaders are great organizers and planners, but not necessarily extroverts.

 

Some leaders are hidden behind the scenes.  Empowering those under their direction to grow and succeed.  They are often missed because they don't sing their own accolades.

 

Some leaders might not work well in a large or even small groups, but they mentor and teach another person very well.

 

Some leaders are even more quiet.  They don't tell, they don't direct, but they lead by a steady example of the right thing to do.

 

It is this spectrum of leadership that is populated with many of our Eagle scouts, and many times, you may not even know.

My father used to say when he hired people that he really didn't care what their college degree was in, because he would have to retrain them anyway, but that they had the degree showed that they could commit and follow though a long term goal.

 

I am not a fan of the parlor or paper eagle scout as they are known; however even for those as @@Beavah has described above - simply meeting the camping requirements, sitting though the merit badge classes, etc.  They have still shown this commitment (even if driven by parents) to completing the Eagle award, and lets face it, there are a lot of distractions and alternate paths at that age.

 

While within the organization we have expectations for scoutcraft and nature or backcountry skills; the reality is the world around us doesn't really care about that.  They want neighbors they can trust or ask for help and get it, leaders, people who can carry out a project, they want people who can learn the skills they need for a task - this is what they see, and largely get, from the Eagles the BSA produces.  Even our paper Eagles, even if by osmosis or by the example of overly involved parents will learn more of these skills that the average American youth.  And for the Scouts who had the self motivation to get there and earn it, all the more so.

 

Even those Eagles on the list we would rather ignore - the infamous ones who apply their skills less to the moral values we try to instill in our youth than we would like - if you look below their acts, you can see the leadership, or planning and organizing skills they acquired.

 

I don't inherently think there is anything wrong with a Scout who is in it for the Eagle.  They are learning to set and achieve a goal, and will learn many more life skills along the way.

 

When many of us decry a paper Eagle Scout, myself included, usually we are focused on the lack of retention of their outdoor skills.  Or in our units, we feel cheated of our investment when the new Eagle starts to disengage from the unit after getting the award, rather than giving back and passing those skills and lessons on.  But the reality is that it really is age appropriate behavior, they reached their goal and now all the other pressures they have been putting off are able to reassert themselves on the Scout's time.  While undesirable that they did not immediately reinvest those skills, many of them do return later, when their own children are ready for Scouts, and then they do reinvest those skills, not only in their own children, but in all the other children fortunate enough to be along for the ride.

 

While it is not as selfless as we would wish, it still helps the rest of us who stick around sustain the program.

 

I know this post became a little rambling, but my short answer is if we look at the BSA as if we are an outsider, the Eagles that we produce, by and large, are worthy of the moniker - as the outsider understands it.

Thank you for taking on this great responsibility.

 

If you do not want to burn out the boys, as others have said, give up on the notion of Ranks by the Blue and Gold.  Just let it be a birthday party for the Scouting movement as intended.  Some packs might double up and run their pinewood derby at this event.

 

In our case, this year we ran a carnival (so the bears could complete a required adventure), here each den and some of the leader groups set up booth games.  It worked out wonderfully, and the Scouts did not miss that advancement did not occur then.

 

Instead, we have converted our upcoming May pack meeting to be more of a Court of Honor to present the rank awards to those that have completed them (and to re-recognize anyone who was able to complete the rank awards earlier).  Ranks should be presented when the Scout(s) complete them, and the Scouts should not have to wait until everyone else in the den (or pack) finishes to be recognized.

 

Best of luck for you and your pack.

The problem with not having zero tolerance, as our school board has tried to explain, is that when "circumstances" and "rational thought" processes are applied to the situation, statistically speaking, the punishments/consequences are racially imbalanced, with white children tending to receive lessor punishments than minority children.

 

By treating everyone the same, regardless of having a reasonable explanation, they hope to avoid the discrimination lawsuit.  And yes, we are the paranoid school district that suspends an elementary school child for a "finger gun" on the playground a recess.

 

I'm not saying it is right.  In fact, I know it to be wrong, but they seem incapable of figuring out a fair way to be reasonable to the circumstances.

My years on summer camp staff, even the year I worked dishes in the kitchen, are some of my favorite and most fond memories.

If the sign out front of my business says "Canoe Rental" why would it be assumed that I rent kayaks or row boats?  Maybe if one is looking to rent kayaks or Row Boats, they need to find a business that has a sign out front that says "Kayak Rental" or "Row Boat Rental", or better yet, the store sign that says "Watercraft Rental" and maybe then one could even rent a paddle board there.  Go figure.

 

Doesn't really help the conversation @@Stosh, but we do rent Kayaks from the Canoe Outfitters here.

 

Used to be a "Bee Keeping " MB .   I am told by one who should know, that this was discontinued because  (1)  Not too many given out and  (2)  Irving did not want to consider  legal issues from Scouts getting stung and (3) That is why no hives at several  Scout Camps/reservations, despite possible apiarists on staff. 

 

There is an option for a bee keeping (or at least the skill there of) component in the Gardening Merit Badge

There is no legal liability against anyone who does nothing.  Only those that do try and in that case prove negligence.  Of course one could be sued for not doing anything as much as they can be sued for doing something.  It's a frivolous lawsuit either way.  Good Samaritan laws protect the by-stander, but it does not absolve them from paying a ton of legal fees to protect oneself.  It's called being in the wrong place at the wrong time and there's nothing one can do about it.

 

@@Stosh,

 

This is not true everywhere.  Several states have (or at least when it applied to me did have) a "duty to respond" exception to the Good Samaritan laws.  When they do, medical professionals (including off duty EMTs) often fall under this category.

@Krampus:   you mention adults wearing patrol patches...I concur, they didn't do that in the past.

 

I haven't read the current uniform guide on this specifically; but my thoughts are that this is not necessarily a bad thing.  I know some adults wear their woodbadge patrol patch there - that's not what I am talking about.

 

When I was a youth (80's), in a fairly large, boy run troop, there were always too many adults around.  So the Scoutmaster organized them into a patrol - complete with patch.  They had their own tents, chuck box, cooking gear, etc., just like any other patrol in the troop.  They cooked their own meals, and setup their own campsite (probably not 300' away, but not right with the other patrols either).

In essence, it was a lead by example - they modeled the behavior expected of the Scouts, but did not get in their face about it.  It seemed to be a pretty effective system at the time.

 

Their meals were definitely above typical camp grade (no tube steaks), and did encourage the Leadership Corps (also organized as their own patrol) to up their game in friendly competition, which in turn encouraged the other patrols to up their game as well.

 

As to the original topic, as other have said, the sash is appropriate at any time the scout is in a full uniform, if worn properly.  Adults do not wear the sash.

The only advice I can offer that wasn't included in @@Sentinel947's is leading by example.

 

As an ASM, offer to be "in charge" of one of the events, camping is a good choice, but others can work as well.

Once you are in charge, make a challenge to the Scouts to take part in it - things like which patrol can put together the best menu, etc.

And then once there, maybe patrol cooking competitions to get more into patrol rather than troop cooking.

 

For an Adult looking down, You are still the Adult in charge, they are doing their activities according to your plan.

For the Scouts, they have been given an opportunity to come up with some of their own ideas.

 

It's a baby step, but it may be the best you can get away with initially, then take a larger step the next time.

 

Good luck.

 

Maybe there is an  unacceptable risk to this activity, and maybe there isn't.  

 

No one here is providing any data to demonstrate that it isn't risky, they're just making assertions.

 

The real problem is that National also isn't providing us any data.  There's this wonderful thing called the internet and hyperlinks.  Surely there's a white paper of some sort that shows what the data is and what they based their decision on, or maybe there isn't and the decision is based on the same emotional basis and unsupported assertions being laid out here for the notion that it's safe.

 

Richard B, you out there anywhere?  Can you give us some actual facts that could help us understand why this is being done.  When you don't trust people with data, they'll assume yours is no better than theirs, and they're as likely to go with their own gut despite your best wishes.  That's the unintended consequence of not trusting your own members.

 

I don't see this as likely.  Even if they had a great study and other data to support their assertion, they wouldn't want all of us to reinterpret the data or question the findings (they are not scientists after all).  So it really comes down to "this is our decision, end of story".

There are Aviation Explorer posts.

 

I was an aviation explorer, Post 767.

 

Most of us in the post went on to do ground school at the local community college (16 years old, still in high school).

Learned a lot of great things.

 

My most vivid memory, even more than taking the controls and flying the Cessna, was the donut I did on the runway as I over compensated while pulling off the taxiway.

With my reputation, I kinda figured it would have been obvious.  With all the kind comments being made I actually started feeling guilty about it.  That's why I ended with a Happy April 1st, I kinda felt the fool on this one.  Well, I have a whole year to get over it. 

 

My statements still stand, but I have always been a pretty literal (and gullible) person.

 

Besides, after the exit of Bad Wolf's account last year - I could have/did believe it.

@@Stosh,

 

I hope you haven't left yet, or that you otherwise may still visit as a lurker, but in any case...

 

You and I have not always agreed on our positions, and on some others we seemed to be of one mind; but I have always respected your opinions either way, and have greatly valued the contributions you have made to this forum.

 

While I might not do it the way you do, yours is the constant voice in the back of my head that makes me ask, could I/we be doing an even better job of "boy led" or trusting the Scouts with the implementation of the BSA program.

@@Stosh, with the current anti-religious environment this country is in, we may be moving in that direction.

 

For better or worse, the School District here doesn't technically have the those holidays because they are religious, they have them because the lack of student attendance at school on those days is/will be significant enough to disrupt the teaching plans, so they give in to it.  Thus, our winter break, days that correspond to many other christian and Jewish holidays, etc.  While I don't think it happened yet, there was discussion about Halloween (as many of the Hispanic students in our schools do not attend on that day), and the Chinese New Year as well.

 

I don't claim the process is fair, or would truly pass constitutional muster, just that it is practical.

Unfortunately, the forum doesn't have a good mechanism for an attachment, so this will be long, but this is what I put together for my pack and for a cub scout roundtable on the subject.  These are organized by activity type not by adventures - thus easier for a pack leader to see what could be covered for different types of pack events.

 

Pack and Den Coordination for the New Cub Scout Adventure Program

 

Below are a list of Adventure Requirements that could or must be accomplished at pack events and that the Pack may wish to consider for coordinating between the Dens and the Packs.

Campout / Campfire

Tiger: “Tigers in the Wild†(required)

• 5:    Participate in an outdoor pack meeting or pack campout campfire. Sing a song and act out a skit with your Tiger den as part of the program.

Wolf: “Call of the Wild†(required)

• 1:    While a Wolf Scout, attend a pack or family campout.
• 6:    On the campout, participate with your family or den in a campfire show. Prepare a skit or song based on one of your family’s favorite things to do outside, and then present it at the campfire for everyone else.

Wolf: “Howling at the Moon†(required)

• 4:    Practice and perform your role for a pack campfire program.

Bear: “Bear Necessities†(required)

• 1:    While working on your Bear badge, camp overnight with your pack. If your chartered organization does not permit Cub Scout camping, you may substitute a family campout or daylong outdoor activity with your den or pack.
• 2:    Attend a campfire show, and participate by performing a song or skit with your den.
• 5:    With your den, plan a cooked lunch or dinner that is nutritious and balanced. Make a shopping list, and help shop for the food. On a campout or at another outdoor event, help cook the meal and help clean up afterward.
• 6:    Help your leader or another adult cook a different meal from the one you helped prepare for requirement 5. Cook this meal outdoors.
• 7:    Help set up a tent. Pick a good spot for the tent, and explain to your den leader why you picked it.

Bear: “Bear Picnic Basket†(Elective)

• 2b:  With the help of an adult, select one food item, and follow a recipe to prepare it outdoors for your family or den. Once you have eaten, ask everyone what they liked or didn’t like. Explain what you would do differently next time. Make notes on your recipe of changes you want to make so you will remember them the next time you cook. Clean up after the preparation and cooking.

Bear: “Roaring Laughter†(elective)

• 6:    Practice at least two run-ons with your den, and perform them at a pack meeting or campfire program.

Webelos: “Cast Iron Chef†(required)

• 4:    Prepare a balanced meal for your den or family; utilize one of the methods below for preparation of part of your meal: Camp stove, Dutch oven, Box oven, Solar oven, Open campfire or charcoal
• 5:    Demonstrate an understanding of food safety practices while preparing the meal.

AOL: “Camper†(required)

• 1:    With the help of your den leader or family, plan and conduct a campout.
• 2:    On arrival at the campout, with your den and den leader or family, determine where to set up your tent. Demonstrate knowledge of what makes a good tent site and what makes a bad one. Set up your tent without help from an adult.
• 4:    On a pack campout, work with your den leader or another adult to plan a campfire program with the other dens. Your campfire program should include an impressive opening, songs, skits, a Cubmaster’s minute, and an inspirational closing ceremony.

Webelos/AOL: “Castaway†(elective)

• 1b:  On a campout with your den or family, cook two different recipes that do not require pots and pans.

Pack Meeting

Tiger: “Curiosity, Intrigue, and Magical Mysteries†(Elective)

• 3:    With your den or with your family, put on a magic show for an audience.

Tiger: “Good Knights†(elective)

• 3:    Using recycled materials, design and build a small castle with your adult partner to display at the pack meeting.

Bear: “Grin and Bear It†(required)

• 2:    Working with the members of your den, organize a Cub Scout carnival and lead it at your pack meeting.
• 3:    Help younger Cub Scouts take part in one of the events at the Cub Scout carnival.

Bear: “Roaring Laughter†(elective)

• 6:    Practice at least two run-ons with your den, and perform them at a pack meeting or campfire program.

Webelos: “Stronger, Faster, Higher†(required)

• 5:    With adult guidance, lead younger Scouts in a fitness game or games as a gathering activity for a pack or den meeting.

Webelos/AOL: “Art Explosion†(elective)

• 4a:  Create a hard-copy or digital portfolio of your projects. Share it with your family and members of your den or pack.
• 4b:  Display your artwork in a pack, school, or community art show.

Webelos/AOL: “Castaway†(elective)

• Teach your game to the members of your pack or other Scouts.

Webelos/AOL: “Engineer†(elective)

• 2c:  Share your project with your Webelos den and your pack by displaying the project at a pack meeting.

Webelos/AOL: “Maestro!†(elective)

• 2a:  Make a musical instrument. Play it for your family, den, or pack.
• 2b:  Form a “band†with your den. Each member creates his own homemade musical instrument. Perform for your pack at a pack meeting.
• 3a:  Teach your den the words and melody of a song. Perform the song with your den at your den or pack meeting.
• 3b:  Create original words for a song. Perform it at your den or pack meeting.
• 3c:  Collaborate with your den to compose a den theme song. Perform it at your pack meeting.
• 3d:  Write a song with words and music that expresses your feelings about an issue, a person, something you are learning, a point of the Scout Law, etc. Perform it at your den or pack meeting, alone or with a group.
• 3e:  Perform a musical number by yourself or with your Webelos den in front of an audience.

Webelos/AOL: “Moviemakingâ€

• 3:    Share your movie with your family, den, or pack.

Committee Meeting

Wolf: “Council Fire†(required)

• 3a:  Attend the pack committee leaders’ meeting. Present ideas to the pack committee regarding your service project.

Hike

Tiger: “Tigers in the Wild†(Required)

• 2:    Go for a short hike with your den or family, and carry your own gear. Show you know how to get ready for this hike.
• 3c:  Apply the Outdoor Code and Leave No Trace Principles for Kids on your Tiger den and pack outings. After one outing, list the things you did to demonstrate the principles you discussed.
• 4:    While on the hike, find three different kinds of plants, animals, or signs that animals have been on the trail. List what you saw in your Tiger handbook.
• 6:    Find two different trees and two different types of plants that grow in your area. Write down their names in your Tiger handbook.

Wolf: “Paws on the Path†(required)

• 6:    Go on a 1-mile hike with your den or family. Watch and record two interesting things that you’ve never seen before.

Wolf: “Finding Your Way†(elective)

• 5:    Using a map and compass, go on a hike with your den or family.

Bear: “Fur, Feathers, and Ferns†(required)

• 1:    While hiking or walking for one mile, identify six signs that any animals, birds, insects, reptiles, or plants are living nearby the place where you choose to hike.
• 4:    Observe wildlife from a distance. Describe what you saw.

Webelos: “Webelos Walkabout†(required)

• 4:    Before your hike, plan and prepare a nutritious lunch. Enjoy it on your hike, and clean up afterward.
• 6:    With your Webelos den or with a family member, hike three miles (in the country if possible).
• 8:    Perform one of the following leadership roles during your hike: trail leader, first-aid leader, lunch leader, or service project leader.

Webelos/AOL: “Earth Rocks!†(elective)

• 2:    Look for different kinds of rocks or minerals while on a rock hunt with your family or your den.

Service Project(s)

Tiger: “Earning your Stripes†(elective)

• 6:    With your adult partner and den work on a service project for your pack’s meeting place or chartered organization.

Tiger: “Good Knights†(elective)

• 5:    Participate in a Service Project

Wolf: “Council Fire†(required)

• 3b:  Work together on a community service project.

Bear: “Paws for Action†(required)

• 3b:  Do a cleanup project that benefits your community.

Webelos: “Webelos Walkabout†(required)

• 7:    Complete a service project on or near the hike location.

AOL: “Building a Better World†(required)

• 8:    With the assistance of your den leader or parent, participate in an event that would help lead others in recycling and conserving resources.

Webelos/AOL: “Aware and Care†(elective)

• 7g:  Participate in a service project that focuses on a specific disability.

Swimming

Tiger: “Floats and Boats†(Elective)

• 7:    Show how to enter the water safely, blow your breath out under the water, and do a prone glide.

Wolf: “Spirit of the Water†(Elective)

• 6:    Visit a local pool or public swimming area with your family or Wolf den. With qualified supervision, jump into water that is at least chest-high, and swim 25 feet or more.

Webelos/AOL: “Aquanaut†(Elective)

• 5:    Attempt the BSA swimmer test.
• 9:    Demonstrate how to correctly fasten a lifejacket that is the right size for you. Jump into water over your head. Show how the lifejacket keeps your head above water by swimming 25 feet. Get out of the water, remove the lifejacket and hang it where it will dry.

Other Events

Wolf: “Air of the Wolf†(Elective)

• 4:    If your den or your pack has a kite derby, space derby or rain-gutter regatta, participate in the fun. Or build a kite or rain-gutter regatta boat with your family. Explain how air helps the vehicle move.

Webelos/AOL: “Into the Wild†(Elective)

• 9a:  Visit a museum of natural history, a nature center, or a zoo with your family, Webelos den, or pack. Tell what you saw.

It isn't so much an issue of the religious badge/medal/knot, as there has been a UU Scouters Association that existed to provide that function for almost as long as the UU has been separated from the BSA. 

 

What the memorandum really means is that UU congregations would be invited to once again charter Scout units.

The UU and the stated principles of the BSA were generally in sync, The problem, at the time, revolved around the "supplemental materials" the church added to the religious award worksheets that explicitly identified the inconsistency between the principles of the UU vs. the BSA with respect to GLBT... issues where the Church was inclusive and welcoming and the Scouts, at the time, were not.

 

The back and forth on this is what eventually led to a complete separation of the organizations' support for one another.

 

I generally saw it as the BSA telling the UU that they were not allowed (were wrong) to believe what they believed (because it disagreed with the majority of BSA religious beliefs), and that never really sat well with my interpretation of how the BSA was supposed to be theologically neutral.  But by that time, I had largely separated from the UU for my own reasons, so it did not really affect me.

I don't see how it helps, the only restriction on Unitarians was recognition of their church specific religion badge. We had a couple of Unitarian families in my troop. Any family that decided against scouting because of the restriction wasn't really wanting the scouting program anyway.

 

Barry

 

My experience with the UU was a little different ...

 

While not related to Scouting, the members of my congregation were very ... almost militant ... in making sure that you believed in their causes and beliefs, otherwise you were made to feel very unwelcome ...

 

So I could easily see where a UU family that wanted Scouting, might forgo it due to the peer pressure of the congregation for wanting to belong to that ... discriminatory organization.

 

Hopefully, now that won't be so much the case.

Without actually being there it is always hard to provide an informed judgement, so please take my comments with the appropriate healthy dose of salt.

 

In of itself, I do not think that going to the cubmaster instead of the person doing the task is going behind a persons back, nor do I view it as a violation of the scout oath/laws as some have suggested.  Would it be better to have gone to the ceremony leader directly - probably (although it does sound like they may already be a history where where maybe that would not be a good idea). 

 

Timing could have a lot to do with it.  Rather than interrupt the ceremony with "is that a good idea?", talking quietly with the cubmaster so as to not disturb the event might have been even more courteous and kind.

 

Or maybe it is someone ingrained with a notion of chain of command.  It would be normal to talk to a "supervisor" or a person or known responsibility for things like health and safety.  Maybe the complaint really was more of a concern raised to the CM, and the CM may have magnified the degree - we've all played telephone - we all know how this happens.

 

Personally, when I was the cubmaster - I would rather have (and would have invited) people to bring their concerns to me, so I could evaluate or reevaluate if the activity needed immediate revision, or just discussion at a later time.  I like to run interference for my leaders - in @@Stosh's words - I like to take care of my people, and if that means running interference for leaders doing an activity and then discussing it with that leader afterwards - I've got a tough skin and can take it.

I don't agree with you. I don't think extrapolating from the go-kart and ATV rules is valid in this case. With go-kars and ATV's, they are driven by the scouts, and riding them is generally a high risk activity. That is different from riding as a passenger in an SUV on a dirt road. Can off-roading in an SUV be dangerous? Yes. But so can driving the family car to the local supermarket.

 

The other problem with assuming "four-wheeling" is not allowed is, what then is the actual rule? Scouts can't ride in a four wheel drive vehicle? Can't ride in a vehicle on an unpaved road? Can't cross a ford? Can't ride in a car if snow chains are required?

 

Is a "jeep" a one, two or four wheeled cart? In which case no one under the age of 14 can ride in one?

 

Common sense aside, I'm not sure the that road into the Camp I used to staff for wouldn't be prohibited if taken to these extremes - at least after a rain storm (admittedly not often) as many passenger vehicles that were not 4x4 might have problems.  I understand the road is not significantly different today.

 

Now, when we add into the mix the staff trying to break the "beach to camp" time record to be in camp "on-time" after weekend leave ... well that can be a whole different story.

While I am sure there are others on the Forum here that are also Round Table Commissioners, I'd like to put out my take.

 

For the cub scout roundtables, most of our attendees are relatively new parents who have just been drafted into their position of responsibility and really need/want a lot of hand-holding and affirmations of what they want to do is ok.  Generally this works out well, and the topics encouraged by the National CSRT Guidebook are relevant to their needs.

 

We also do a lot of "off-book" topics of interest.  Things like local areas to camp, where to get resources, etc.

 

There are many Experienced Scouters, who I have no doubt find the Roundtables to be repetitive to what they previously learned either by experience or prior roundtables; they mostly come to get district information and the announcements.  However, the most valuable reason to encourage them to remain even for the breakouts and other topics is because their experience, when incorporated into those breakouts discussion time, make them so much better for everyone there.  The RT Commissioner does not know everything, and these events work so much better when our experienced Scouters remain to share their wisdom.

 

I totally understand that they probably don't get a lot out of it themselves, but overall, it can help so many more Scouts, by making those Scouts' leaders better at doing their jobs.

I suppose I should clarify my statement.

 

First Class as a goal (admittedly not in official literature), at the time, was not about retention - although that too would be a worthy goal, but was that by the time a scout achieved that rank, we, as a program, will have tried our best convey what was deemed from a societal point of view, as the most important skills/lessons to our members before they get released back into the wild world around them.

 

While I will also concede that achieving rank by completing the requirements may or may not translate into actually knowing the skills or embracing the intent of those skills; we've got to do the best we can with what is available for a performance metric.

Eagle is something known and understood from those outside or movement.

They have no way of knowing if the qualify of an Eagle Scout today is comparable to one in the 60s or not.  I'm not sure I do.

 

I had always understood that a true goal of Scouting was to get the Scouts to 1st Class.  This rank represents that we as a program have taught the necessary skills of citizenship and civic responsibility (first aid, appreciation of nature, basic survival skills, etc).  Eagle became much more about leadership and personal perseverance and dedication.  As such, maybe we should be reporting the first class numbers as well, even if the public doesn't yet understand them.

 

For me, I've always focused more on retention.  When I reported to my COR last year, I could say that of all the cub scouts we bridged (which was all of them), only one or two (we couldn't verify one) out of 19 in the last three years had left the scouting program, which to me indicated that (1) we have good troops and (2) that we prepared our cubs well for boy scouts.  Separately, out of 50 or so boys, we tend to lose 3-4 a year for reasons unrelated to moving, etc.  So are we offering a program that the scouts and their parents value - to me, this is the real statistic we need, and nationwide, I don't think those numbers nationwide are currently where we should be aiming.

 

At our most recent bridging, we had a second-go-round den leader; we brought back his first den (bridged in 2012), of the 11 of the 12 of them that were there, 10 were still in Scouts and half were star or life.

  If one has something to say, say it.  If not, remember, Silence is Golden. 

 

An individual's free speech is protected and I will defend it whether I agree with it or not.  Anonymous free speech is not protected by the Constitution.

 

I'll disagree with you on this one @@Stosh. The Supreme Court has upheld that Anonymous free speech is protected.

https://www.eff.org/issues/anonymity

 

Without anonymous speech, our founding fathers would have been tried and hung for treason, long before the country could be formed.

 

Now, all that being said, is really that the speech is protected from infringement from the Government.  For better or worse, there is no such prohibition on private individuals, societies, etc. from infringing on that speech - thus why activists take to attacking and shaming the supporters (boycotting advertisers, social media protests, etc) of the unpopular speech, since the Government won't/can't stop it - which admittedly is their free speech right to do.  And round and round we go.

 

Leaving all of this, and returning to the topic at hand ...

 

My point was really that we just don't know what is behind the original request without talking with the person who made the complaint.  Maybe they really are a know-it-all seasoned scouter who may or may not be up to date with the current guidelines, maybe they are just a mom who's been trying to talk her child out of wanting a really cool sword to hang in their room, or maybe it is someone who lost a loved one in an ISIS beheading and swords are beyond their coping mechanism.

 

The fact that they complain, even anonymously, does not by itself make them a bully, nor even a political correctness junkie.  As a leader we should address the concerns of the adults and parents of our units - that doesn't make them right, we don't have to accept their concern as forcing us to change our plans - but it would still deserve consideration.

Well, since we've left the realm of turning the other cheek ... respectfully understanding what the objection may have been ( we think it is obvious, but maybe there is something else at play here ) ... and all else ...

 

I say go for the rage quit - like many multi-hat scouters, I have the velcro badge of office, that makes it real easy to rip off the badge, hand it to the complainer and say "ok, all yours" and walk off.

 

In reality no, but in practice

My last read of the guide to safe scouting was surprisingly silent on this issue.  As others have said, ask them to please show you where this activity is prohibited, and you will gladly stop and apologize, otherwise (1) They can participate in the event planning and voice their concern before the event, or (2) they can shut up.

 

Now, all that said, and to play the devils advocate, we do have some crazy leaders in our movement, and not all of them are so attentive to safety concerns.  You may know the sword was no more effective than a baseball bat, but they may not have known that and was honestly trying to look out for the safety of the Scouts.  I wasn't there, I don;t know the parties involved, so now, I'll just shut up.