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Yak_Herder

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Everything posted by Yak_Herder

  1. The BSA expended a fair amount of energy in its early years establishing themselves as "THE" Boy Scouts of America. No one "owned" the concept of Scouting and Troops were springing up spontaneously all over the place. The Scouting movement caught on in Utah with some vigor. Young Men in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (The Mormons) already had a youth organization called the "Young Men's Mutual Improvement Association" (YMMIA) that provided educational, cultural and athletic program. Scouting was added to it and "MIA Scouting" began about the same time the Boy Scouts o
  2. First, the manual is being reworked by "guys in the field". It will improve. At the very least it will be organized better. Second, Venturing cannot be fully understood without a knowledge of the conditions that stimulated the development of Sea Scouting. Furthermore, there is a need to understand the evolution from Explorer Scouting to Explorers and then Exploring. Venturing's "center" is a modern version of Explorer Scouting (high adventure outdoor program) with updated twists. There's a reason Ranger stands out like it does. The other areas are catching up. Third, Nation
  3. NOT wearing knots is a lot of fun. Like many of you, I have a knot filled unifrom that mostly stays in the closet and the plain one I wear most of the time. I really enjoy being underestimated. You either have "it" or you don't. The vast majority of Scouters I meet recognize "it" without visual clues. I find that period between first meeting and discovery to be highly enjoyable. Another thought, and please pardon the analogy if it offends... If a man ever wonders what a woman must feel like after being "scanned" when meeting a man, consider the parallel to a knot display. I
  4. Are you guys actually going to stand on the argument that no change should be made simply because it wouldn't make everybody happy? Nonsense. You do what's right because it's right.
  5. A world view is helpful in this discussion. Other souting organizations are doing exactly what the originator of this thread is suggesting. It isn't producing the desired result. The evidence suggests it was a bad move. The BSA uniform is fine. In addition to the program, the merit badges, the activities, the oath and law, the uniform is also Scouting. If wearing the uniform and being identified with the BSA and what it stands for is a turn-off, best to just keep on moving down the road to another organization. That is not to say that the uniform is perfect. Prices could be bet
  6. I wrote this proposal regarding Venture Patrols some time ago. The ideas discussed are being tested in several councils as we speak. At the risk of further muddying the distinctions between a VenturE Patrol and VenturING Crew (something that is not at all clear in this thread), I offer it to you for your benefit. The Venture Patrol The Venture Patrol is a little known but highly effective option for Scouters wishing to better address the needs and interests of the older Scouts within the Troop. With so many Senior Scouting options available, why would you want to consider imple
  7. I once heard someone say there is only one article of official uniforming that is no longer acceptable to wear: the red beret. The claim that was made went like this: The red beret was deemed a safety issue because of the possible confusion with the Guardian Angels. Anyone have anything in writing that would support that?
  8. I was a Scout when the red beret was introduced. At first I thought it was cool, then reality set in. One problem was the badge placement in the front. Even at my young age I knew that the badge should be off center and the beret sloped. The BSA designed theirs with the badge on center. It bugged me. Wearing the beret "even", rather than spilled off to one side just looked dorky. Another thing was the badge. Why didn't they make an allowance for rank pins to be worn up there rather than that gold flor de lis? Finally, that terrible band around the edge. Mine cracked short
  9. So, what are you saying, a study of history has no value? That's a tough position to defend. Or do you mean that today's Scouting program is full and complete, that it is the be-all-end-all, the very paragon of Scouting perfection? That would be a tough one, was well. Some of the better aspects of today's Venturing program were gleaned from its predecessors. It's a good thing someone was aware of them. Part of knowing today's program is understanding it's roots. Being stuck in the past is no virtue, but neither is being ignorant of it.
  10. Are understanding the mistakes of the past and delivering the program today mutually exclusive propositions?
  11. I don't think the Venturers care about the history nor do they necessarily need to. The Adult Leaders, however, would benefit from knowing the background. There are a number of lessons to be learned from Senior Scouting's various iterations. Without an awareness of what has gone before, the mistakes of the past reappear. As Leaders, we should be smarter than that.
  12. Herber? LOL I don't want to dampen your spirits or stifle your efforts. I love aviation. I love Scouting. Nothing would please me more than to see Air Scouting take off once again (pun intended). But it ain't simple and as you noted, it isn't cheap. From the Guide to Safe Scouting- "Aircraft Air travel is permitted as follows: 1. On any flight scheduled by a commercial airline. 2. The BSA Flight Permit, No. 19-672 (see sample in appendix), is required for all BSA flying activities except for commercial flights. The local council reviews and approves th
  13. Two significant factors came together in the creation of Venturing. First, a lawsuit in Chicago over community funded Exploring. The BSA was going to lose. Second, good men at National like Bill Evans saw the way Exploring had drifted away from the original, more effective program and wanted to re-introduce much of what was good about it. Rather than the usual 2-year development cycle and 5-year testing, they had to move quickly. They seem to have simply done a search and replace, pasting in "Venturing" everywhere the literature said "Exploring". Much of Bill's influence can
  14. Michael Brown's site is the best I've seen on the subject. I have a "Reader's Digest Condensed Version" that I'll send to you if you are interested.
  15. There is a big problem that has to be faced. Liability. You can have all the uniform, recognition and literature developed you want, but the thing that will stop you (and did stop it originally) are the restrictions on the ability to go DO IT! Exploring worked and Venturing works because you could actually go hiking, camping, backpacking, canoeing, rappeling, and everything else outdoors (or whatever). Likewise, Sea Scouting works because you can actually go sailing or motorboating. Having proven successful on the land and sea, why doesn't the program have an air compo
  16. "Traditional Venturing"? Interesting. I don't believe this discussion can be properly addressed without an understanding of Venturing's genealogy. The distinctions between "Explorer Scouts", "Explorers" and "Exploring" must be understood. Venturing is much more similar to Explorer Scouting and Explorers than the Spurgeon inspired Exploring. I've written a summary of the evolution of Scouting's "Senior Scouting" programs that I will e-mail to anyone that is interested. It's a bit lengthy for posting here.
  17. dana_renner, I remember them. The red, white & blue fleets were a fascinating experiment and provide us with a real learning experience. In 1949 Sea Scouts became (reluctantly?) Sea Explorers. In 1965 the Sea Explorer program became Sea Exploring with the addition of Blue, White and Red Fleets. Blue Division Sea Explorers were adherents to the traditional Sea Scouting program in every sense. They maintained the uniform, advancement and leadership patterns developed by Keane in the 20's that made Sea Scouting what it is. White Division Sea Explorers had a nautica
  18. captainron14 must have this post I made to another forum in mind: *** Bob's response about knots is right on target. Only the top awards in each program (Arrow of Light, Eagle Scout and Silver Award) are deemed worthy of an official knot. I don't think a knot will ever be developed for the Denali Award, not because of the numbers threshold, but because it is not the top award of Varsity Scouting; the Eagle Scout Award is. Nonetheless, the idea of having cloth patch versions of Venturing recognition is well taken and there are individuals agitating to have them developed. The pin
  19. I'm just guessing, but I'll take a shot at the big white patch (BWP). The Venturing Crew, unlike a Scout Troop is the basic unit. Since a rough equivalent to a patrol does not exist in Venturing, and the program "designers" seem to like it that way, they took a pro-active measure to stiffle any such development by putting a BWP over the area. The BWP inhibits the impulse of a leader with a Scouting background from forming patrols by eliminating one of the tools used to build patrol unity, the patrol patch. I haven't seen any critters in Venturing. I have seen a few custom unit pat
  20. Well, I dunno. I sent it to Brad Allen in the Venturing Division before he left the professional ranks of Scouting to teach Scouting on a University level. He seemed to like the proposal and reportee to me that he had forwarded it to the appropriate committee. He was frank in acknowledging that change in the BSA is terribly difficult to affect. I have seen no other acknowledgement. When I heard that the new religious life award that will be released next Summer was conceived of and designed by the youth participants in Venturing, I thought they might be of some help. So far I hav
  21. The proposal has been made and was well received. If I knew more about how to initiate sucha change I would pursue it further. ***** VENTURING SHOULDER LOOP PROPOSAL WHEREAS green shoulder loops on the forest green uniform shirt are barely visible, defeating any real purpose, and WHEREAS the forest green shirt and the particular shade of green chosen for the shoulder loops also look poor alongside one another, and WHEREAS with evolving uniform policy and despite clear statements to the contrary in the current uniform guide, green shoulder loops are commonly yet incorrectly
  22. The Santa Clara County Council in San Jose, California (Silicon Valley) has produced a new CSP. The new patch picks up on a "retro" look of the old R&W. It is bright red with white lettering saying "Santa Clara County Council, BSA" in an arc across the top and "Silicon Valley, CA" along the bottom. It has a large flor de lis hidden in the background stitching pattern. Production was limited to 1,000. In the future the CSP's will have a white rather than red border. Very cool.
  23. Well CRANEACE, you know full well (because I told you in this thread) that I am both LDS and a Scouter. If your inquiries are serious, I've been in Scouting in a variety of areas and over along enough span of time that I I am confident I can offer some insight. You should know how to find me online but off list. If you're just stirring it up, please don't waste my time.
  24. I really wasn't interested in your sexual orientation. As you probably realize, I was hoping you would object to the question. While against my better judgment I went ahead and asked anyway, I did so to make a point. I think the question is out of line. And, nitpicking now (because I really am a little too uptight about such things)... Girls can be members of the BSA by joining Venturing. Girls can also join Exploring, but Explorers are not members of the Boy Scouts of America on the terms as a Cub Scout, Boy Scouts, Varsity Scout, Sea Scout and Venturer. And Finally, yo
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