Tokala

acco40:

When I was SM the youth leaders had their PoR patch on their uniform. They may have worn their patrol medallion, but served their leadership position first.

cchoat wrote:

"Tokala, while adults may not "need" a patrol, many troops have established unofficial "patrols" among their adult leaders. Scouting is for the boys, but sometimes one has to realize that many of the adults who make the program work are imaginatve, fun loving individuals. The "Gray Eagle Patrol" (Gray from the color of our hair) in our troop allows us to channel this enthusiasm.

Sure, we're not a "real official patrol", (which is why we wear our "Patrol emblem on the right pocket rather than the sleeve) but we provide a great example in camp of how the patrol method should work, as well as a top notch program for our scouts, all the while having a good time doing it. It enhances our troops ablity to recruit, keep and motivate adult leaders by giving them additional activities and a stronger sense of belonging, as well as provides a scouts perspective to the new parent\leader who may have not had the opportuntity to be a scout in their youth. They get to experance what their son is.

Woodbadge forms it's students into patrols. Is that wrong if patrols are only for boys? I feel if an "Adult Patrol" does not distract from the mission, then more power to it."

cc:

I've managed to do all that you list to demonstrate the patrol method and set a good example. I guess I just don't need a patch to validate it. Wood Badge forms patrols to teach the patrol method and allow the adults to experience leadership and being a part of a PLC. It's not designed to teach adults to go back to their unit and form an adult patrol. My Council no longer issues patrol patches to Wood badge patricipants so that we don't get adults wearing patrol patches in their units. After all, what about the poor Cub leaders? Do Cub leaders sew on Den numerals?

I don't and won't wear a patrol patch as an adult. Patrols are for the Scouts, not the adults. Do adults really need a small round patch to remind them that they are part of a group? I see it more as demonstrating making the correct choice and following guidelines rather than "it's an insignificant thing so it really doesn't matter attitude".

I attended the ArrowCorps5 project at Goshen back in 2008. Shortly after leaving they closed that camp due to contaminated food. I noticed when I was there that the closest latrine to dining hall did not have a sink trough to wash up before meals. I thought it was strange. I think I was in the Olmstead camp.

I keep hoping that they split off into two groups: one the techie/indoor group and they can get their leadership/character/citizenship training online or through a DVd; and the other the outdoors/skills group that gets their training through planning and challenging expeditions.

There is the Lowe's Impact Grant available this year for Eagle Scout projects:

http://www.doubleknot.com/openrosters/ViewOrgPageLink.aspx?LinkKey=48181&orgkey=772

Since I have served on the District advancement level, I would never approve a project that didn't show how it was funded. I'm not sure that I would deny approval if the funds were a contribution from the Scout's parents. However, if they stipulated that it was a loan, I would encourage the Scout to use his personal income or wages from a job to reimburse them. Using fundraising afterwards just gives a bad appearance and suspicion. It also doesn't teach the Scout how to manage a project if he just gets monies from his parents.

You could do it, but I wouldn't recommend it.

It will be interesting to see how much more of the outdoors and camping they can remove from the program. Is it possible to dumb it down even more?

WE just had a DE give his 2 week notice. Check out West Central Florida Council #089.

My sympathies to all the families. These stories always remind me that it can happen to any volunteer, anywhere at anytime.

Right or wrong, I'm glad to see someone making an effort to improve the health care/insurance system in the US. Kind of difficult to judge it's conditions or merits until some time has passed.

I wonder if people had the same comments when social security and medicare/medicaid was started? I'm not old enough to have been around for those.

The Troop I joined in 1975 had us do discplinary exercises like that. I wouldn't do anything like that these days.

We have had courses with both Scouts and Venturers since they changed the syllabus to include Venturers. I am disppointed to see the patrol method wiped out due to including Venturers. I'm not sure why National didn't just elave NYLT for Scouts and do a better job developing the Kodiak syllabus.

We have both Troop leaders and Crew leaders on staff and participating. The course that starts in a few weeks has a young girl as the SPL (I'll use the term even though the syllabus has some other BS phrase).

We had to evacuate 240+ from our camp at 11pm Sunday night due to Tropical Storm Debbie. Program continued as normal Monday morning at the shelter. They will remain there tonight as well due to the potential for tornadoes. We had radar indications that 2 tornadoes touched down on our camp property.

The Scouts are having a blast and the adults are grumpy. Not any different than if they were at camp.

To explain why Lakota from Pine Ridge and Delaware from Oklahoma in West Central Florida...those were my resources that were legitimate. Saint Petersburg, Clearwater and Tampa are built out. Any Indian culture is hidden in main stream society. Most of the proclaimed "Indians" around here aren't legitimate sources. There are no reservations or centers of culture. The closest Seminole "settlement" is the Hard Rock Casino in Tampa. Before they started the big Vegas-style games, there used to be a small village of chickees and alligators, etc. I used to wander through there and talk with some of the people. We even had one of them sing with us.

For the most part, kids want to dance pow wow styles because that allows them to participate in a lot of events. Deciding to do Seminole stomp dancing really limits your opportunities to participate at a pow wow. The Lodge uses Seminole clothing for ceremonies because it is the local cultural influence. Can you imagine the uproar if they wanted to use Timucua clothing for ceremonies?

The youth in Timuquan originally started singing Ponca and Kiowa songs because we had resources to teach them. The youth discovered Lakota music and decided that they really wanted to sing that type of music. We found credible, legitimate sources for them.

As for the Delaware, I was assigned to ensure that Curtis was at all of his appointments at 2 NOACs. He and I talked about tribal politics and their annual dances, but I never started to learn their music. He had an interview with the University radio station at Indiana University in 1996 and it was the funniest thing that I ever saw and heard. The woman interviewing him asked how he was elected chief. He described how he was tied to another guy in the tribve and they had a knife fight to the the death and he survived and won the job. The woman took the story hook, line and sinker.

I find it odd that BSA24 whitewashes all OA-related events that involve American Indian culture as "fake". I taught our sing team in Florida Lakota songs. They went to Pine Ridge in 1995 and sang for a week and the elderly Lakotas were tape recording them because they knew the music and language better than the kids on the reservation.

At a couple of NOACs I was the "chief of staff" for Curtis Zunigha, the elected chief of the Delaware tribe in Oklahoma, he was very impressed with the efforts and work that the OA members put into making accurate clothes.

None of it's "fake". It's just different levels of skill and instruction.

West Central Florida may have an opening in a week or two....I hope.

I'm not sure what the fix is, but maybe allowing folks to hold back Scouts after a BoR or SM conference rather than passing them along to be spared the wrath of a parent.

I just spent this past weekend at our camp with the OA lodge. It's the weekend we set camp for summer camp. I had about 16 First Class Scouts with me to set up wall tents. We were replacing all of the ropes. Before starting I asked everyone who knew how to tie a bowline and tautline to raise their hand. One Scout raised his hand. That illustrated the issue with advancing kids without making them learn the skill. I think culturally we have trained kids to study for a test and not to actually absorb klnowledge.

Bobwhite89: As hard as it is to believe, not one dime that is raised in FOS or even a percentage is sent off to the National Office. Local Councils simply have a charter fee, which is actually pretty small.

Those two sentences are contradictory. FOS goals are higher to raise the funds to pay the National charter fees.

I could go for some Timbits and Tim Horton's coffee right now. Sometimes I regret living in the southeast.

Luckily I don't see this practice in my Council. I have seen attempts to sell one of our camps 2-3 times in the last 30 years. My staff adviser snuck me into a Board meeting when I was Lodge Chief so I could see what was happening. We still have that property and continue to make improvements.

Our adult volunteer pool is shrinking as fast as the youth membership. No way I try to extort FOS from people. As VP or Program, I need bodies for lifeguards, rangemasters, climbing instructors, camp directors, etc. I make sure the people that I recruit are trained/knowledgeable about their responsibilities, have the support that they need/deserve, and are thanked for their efforts.

I hear my SE gripe about the $100K it takes to keep the power and water on at the camps. He holds program responsible for meeting that need. We do our best. Since I stepped up as Program, all programs are running in the black. I have started to drop hints that I can raise that $100K annually very simply....use the SE's salary!

I like the JTE criteria better than Quality Lodge. It gives us measurements and benchmarks to see how things are working. I know that one year we might chase membership and another it will be Brotherhood conversion. My job as the Lodge Adviser is to help the youth determine where they need emphasis. Timuquan's retention stays around 80% annually. Positive growth is fairly easy to maintain, but we've had hiccups. This year it is currently down to about 55%. This was discivered at our LLDC and the Chief realized he has a huge task ahead of him and his officers. They stand a good chance of missing the mandatory requirement of positive growth if they don't get busy. So, I will remain that voice in his reminding him to keep working on getting members to pay their dues.

The easiest way to grow is to retain your members. Keep the old ones and get the newly inducted ones active. Once people realize that it can be a rewarding and fun activity, they'll stick around. I doubt Lodges will qualify for JTE every year. We always had years that membership dropped and we missed Quality Lodge. It's just natural cycles and not something to get too disturbed about.

We had a unit that had some issues with the adult leaders and following youth protection. The Ditrict Key 3 met with the unit at first to explain the corrective actions. The unit continued making the same poor decisions. The District Key 3 then met with the chartering organization and they did not renew the charter.

They have to fund Mazzucca's golden parachute somehow?