scouter659

I should mention that we do indeed invite the parents and one of them usually go to the first one but after they get to know us they're more comfortable in letting the boy go. I should also reiterate that the encampment we do in April includes a component to have Cub parents there by design. So, yes, we do build a relationship with the parents. I was just wondering on how Troops felt about the Webelos 2 going to Boy Scout weekenders on their own.

I'm looking for a few quick opinions. For about 5 or 6 years now, we have been routinely inviting Webelos 2 Scouts to our Troop campouts. I have been under the impression that a Webelos 2 can attend without a parent. We also do an annual recruitment campout in April where we invite the Weblos 1 Scouts but a parent or guardian must accompany them. We have a relatively new (mostly by the book leader) who insists Webelos 2 cannot go without a parent, even though we average about a dozen adults on our campouts. Also, doing it this way has allowed us to get each and every Webelos 2 Scout from our Pack to join our Troop for the past several years. We have found that in the time they spend with us they get to know our boys and leaders and the Webelos-to-Scout transition is successful. Does anyone else recruit new Scout this way?

We'll be on a Troop campout to Allegany State Park in the Southern Tier of New York this weekend. I was happy to see all 13 of our Junior Leader Candidates signed up for the weekender.

On Saturday morning, we will hold a training class in an executive board room on the second floor of the parks' administration building. The building itself, a large English Tudor style mansion, had its construction completed in 1927.

On Friday night of the campout I plan on walking our candidates, in silence, to a pre-selected spot to do the following exercise:

I'll have 13 short pieces of rope, about a foot long, hold one up and ask them, "What can you do with a piece of rope like this"?

This question is usually met with fairly blank stares as they ponder the question. Not waiting too long, I'll hand each boy a piece of the rope and ask them to tie their rope to the one of the boy next to them with a square knot, and so on all the way down the line.

The lesson is an obvious one but it helps drive the point home by getting them involved. And you simply tell them, "All of you are like this small piece of rope. Now think of the things you can accomplish alone or with the help of others toward a common goal".

Yes, it does playout like a 'Scoutmaster's Minute' but also serves as a nice reflection tool to open or close one of our Junior Leader Training classes.

(If you'd like more information about our Troop's Junior Leader Training course, please visit the following web site:

www.scouter659.htmlplanet.com

"Character...is what happens when no one is looking".

I just need to butt-in again and say that I very much appreciate the comments from folks who understood what I was trying to say. Thank you.

I'm with a pretty active Troop that camps every month. We are fortunate to have a few adult leaders who write and produce a great Scout's Own service for each and every encampment. They also incorporate the help of boys who volunteer to aid in the process. The service itself runs about 20 minutes and is mainly comprised of inspirational readings (Scoutmaster's Minutes type of material etc.) and, having the benefit of a few guitar players in the Troop, an opening and closing song is usually performed. We try to use music that 'fits' and is somewhat contemporary. We've used things like "The River", "Turn Turn Turn" and John Lennon's "Imagine" for example.

Our Troop is comprised of many different faiths and, up to this point, it seems as though everyone accepts this practice which is simply blended into our program. Two of our leaders are actually developing a 'Scout's Own' web site as part of their Wood Badge ticket.

It doesn't have to be this elaborate but if you start a program like this, over time, you may find less resistance to taking a brief period out of the day to recognize the twelfth point of The Scout Law.

I wish you success in your continuing endeavors.

I couldn't agree with you more that we, as leaders, shouldn't interfere directly with parents' disciplinary decisions. Part of my feelings are just based on wishful thinking. I have actually seen it happen where the Scout doesn't come back and generally spirals into more negative than positive situations before either straightening out or not. I am only suggesting that, perhaps, parents who aren't too directly involved in Scout Leadership THINK about what the child could miss if they decide to deliver a sweeping-grounding-blow. Perhaps what we do isn't an exact science. I was just speaking from emotion...the way a parent does in an emotional moment. Remember, I'm a parent too. I'm simply saying think before you act. Isn't that what we try to teach out own kids?

Parents who Ground a Child from Scouting Activities

Having reached the approximate twelve-year level as an adult leader and Scout volunteer I have seen this many times. Whatever the kid has done at home or in school causes one or both parents to say the words which sends chills down the spine of any normal active boy. "You're Grounded"!

I am also a parent and, like others, have used this disciplinary tool as wisely as possible over the years. But in my experience as a Scout Leader, this is also what I have seen happen. What of the boy who has been in Scouts for a year or two and his interest may be waning? Experienced leaders know that many boys go through this. Some you lose and you feel sad for a while but have to keep pushing on. Some go through phases, re-energize and they become some of the best Scouts and Junior Leaders as they age.

So you've just grounded your son. No computer or TV. No music or friends. No Scouts for a week, a month or longer. Just do your homework and go to your room.

No matter what the deed was for him to end up in this situation, this is what happens to that 'profile' boy I just talked about.

"and no Scouts for two weeks and you're not going to the next campout"!

Now, if his interest IS waning he's thinking, not only is that not punishment but "I don't really care". Unfortunately, aside from all of the other grounding, which does hurt, he was grounded from going to the one place which is all about teaching good citizenship, character building and teamwork skills. He might miss the meeting where a local judge or politician may have been there to talk about our freedoms and constitutional responsibilities. He might miss the meeting where the subject and focus of first aid for that evening could have taught him a practical skill, which he may have used in real life. He was just grounded from the campout, which would have afforded him his first opportunity at real leadership. The list goes on and on.

Parents, please think about grounding more creatively. Try to think about what the child really enjoys because, after all, in grounding, you're attempting to punish by temporarily taking away the things he most enjoys. I understand that freedom is the key but it would be great that, if in all of that anger at the moment, you would be able to think about the cause and effect of removing him from one thing in his life which may actually serve to improve him as a human being.

I guess I'm bringing this up because, as a dedicated Scout Leader, I'm a little selfish. I personally just don't like it when I show up at a meeting and a certain boy isn't there who I may have taken an interest in helping. And come to find out that he has been grounded.

Food for thought. What do you think?

Parents who Ground a Child from Scouting Activities

Having reached the approximate twelve-year level as an adult leader and Scout volunteer I have seen this many times. Whatever the kid has done at home or in school causes one or both parents to say the words which sends chills down the spine of any normal active boy. "You're Grounded"!

I am also a parent and, like others, have used this disciplinary tool as wisely as possible over the years. But in my experience as a Scout Leader, this is also what I have seen happen. What of the boy who has been in Scouts for a year or two and his interest may be waning? Experienced leaders know that many boys go through this. Some you lose and you feel sad for a while but have to keep pushing on. Some go through phases, re-energize and they become some of the best Scouts and Junior Leaders as they age.

So you've just grounded your son. No computer or TV. No music or friends. No Scouts for a week, a month or longer. Just do your homework and go to your room.

No matter what the deed was for him to end up in this situation, this is what happens to that 'profile' boy I just talked about.

"and no Scouts for two weeks and you're not going to the next campout"!

Now, if his interest IS waning he's thinking, not only is that not punishment but "I don't really care". Unfortunately, aside from all of the other grounding, which does hurt, he was grounded from going to the one place which is all about teaching good citizenship, character building and teamwork skills. He might miss the meeting where a local judge or politician may have been there to talk about our freedoms and constitutional responsibilities. He might miss the meeting where the subject and focus of first aid for that evening could have taught him a practical skill, which he may have used in real life. He was just grounded from the campout, which would have afforded him his first opportunity at real leadership. The list goes on and on.

Parents, please think about grounding more creatively. Try to think about what the child really enjoys because, after all, in grounding, you're attempting to punish by temporarily taking away the things he most enjoys. I understand that freedom is the key but it would be great that, if in all of that anger at the moment, you would be able to think about the cause and effect of removing him from one thing in his life which may actually serve to improve him as a human being.

I guess I'm bringing this up because, as a dedicated Scout Leader, I'm a little selfish. I personally just don't like it when I show up at a meeting and a certain boy isn't there who I may have taken an interest in helping. And come to find out that he has been grounded.

Food for thought. What do you think?

Here's kind of a new Troop tradition we started 4 years ago at our first JLT graduation campout. If you're just looking for ideas, you can use this for any ocassion but doing it in camp is really neat.---Upon arrival into our JLT Camp the boys enter one at a time & recite the Scout Law. They stand in the middle of a 3-flame configuration (buddy burner stoves provide the flames) and are given a JLT totem which is worn around their necks. It is a small 1/2" diameter & 2" long piece of wood on a twine-type string which they are told to wear throughout the weekend. At the graduation ceremoney Saturday night, they receive a letter which explains;

Every time they do something to perform a point of the Scout Law they may ask any adult leader to carve a notch in the totem and can get a 13th for doing a 'good turn'. They can only get one notch per day so that the concept is like a personal goal to which they should aspire to. It's interesting to see how excited they get when they finally receive that totem after seeing other boys who have completed the course wearing it. Then it's even more interesting to see their reaction when they have to wait another 24 hours until they can fully realize its meaning.

If you do a course in your Troop, try this and you'll see how, over time, some of the boys have the true meaning of the law 'sink-in' to their heads.

Hello All: I just wanted to take an opportunity to promote a web site I've been working on for the past 3 or 4 weeks. The site is all about our Troop's Junior Leader Training program and we are very proud that Scouter.com added it as a link via their site/Training category. Our Troop conducts a very elaborate JLT Course which lasts throughout the year and it has been very effective for us. I invite you to take a look. Thank you & Good Scouting!

www.scouter659.htmlplanet.com

Your comments are appreciated!

I posted a message a few months ago when this topic came up which talked about how excited I was to FINALLY take Wood Badge. Look, I've been in Scouting now for over 10 years and for the folks who reject the idea of the "New" Wood Badge let me tell you something; I am finding Wood Badge for the 21st. Century to be completely inspiring in an atmosphere which is friendly and conducive to learning. If you're going to be involved in Boy Scouting, you must make it your business to learn outdoor skills & techniques. If you want to be the best leader you can be and hope to ignite others, especially the youth in our Troop, then this Wood Badge course IS THE GOODS! I love the traditions...I love my Patrol (I'm a Bobwhite by the way) and my course is NE 111-151. Incidentally, the Staff is awesome! I don't feel like I've missed a thing but rather am experiencing a first-class course in adult Scouting leadership. I'll be back for part two at the end of the month. Meanwhile, I'll be off to "work my ticket if I can".

I work with 2 other leaders in our Troop & established a Junior Leader Training course that we're very proud of. I'm always looking for new and innovative "Team Building" excersises that we can do in our classes. I have all of the Wood's Wisdom and stuff from USSCOUTS.ORG but if anyone happens to know of a site with more of this stuff, kindly let me know. There are many companies out there who specialize in "Team Building" but the websites are more of a commercial nature. Always looking for a site with descriptions of actual games etc. THANKS 7 GOOD SCOUTING, ALL!

External-Jansport "Ranier"...roughly $99. Perfect size/perfect wieght for me and I see a few boys in the Troop with them too!

We're planning on a trip with out Troop to Gettysburg in early July. We're estimating about 40 boys and about 12 adults. We're going to be tening at a campground in nearby Maryland and spending one-full-day in the park. We don't want to "HAMMER" them with history but to have fun as well. Have any of you done this trip and do you have any specific suggestions of how we should spend our day? We're taking along a friend who is a Civil War Re-enactor & history teacher as a guide. We just don't want to bore the boys to death. They range in age from 11 through 15. Any ideas?

I'd just like to say that I am planning and very much looking forward to the experience. I have been a very active leader in this great movement my son got me into 11 years ago. Guess it's about time I do this too! I've been very inspired by it all and am experiencing the benefit of some great leaders in our Troop. It's a great moment in time for us all and has also inspired me to run a very elaborate Junior Leader Training course in our Troop which has become a very important part of our program. Can't wait for Woodbadge in Aug/Sept 2001...for me, the icing on the cake.

In an out-of-print paperback called BP's Outlook (which is incredible by the way) there are many references by him in direct quotes and writings where he refers to the movement as a 'Game'. This IS well documented.

Your question reads, "...as a Scouter". In that regard I'd have to say I'm grateful for the privilege of having the opportunity to do my part in teaching boys to make good decisions, to survive in the outdoors and use good common sense, to teach leadership skills and to, one day, be remembered by some of them as someone who helped form them into decent and productive men. This is what it is.

We're planning on re-configuring our Patrols, again, next month. I do like what the Old Grey Eagle says about the young ones having older ones to follow & learn from. We try very hard to establish a balance and, in a Troop of approaching 50, it's a tricky task. The one thing we also strive for is that we have 1 or 2 Junior Leader Training Candidates in each Patrol. The PL's & Youth Staff are already JLT Trained. We subscribe to a very elaborate process of Training and now that it's in its 3rd year we're beginning to see excellent results. No matter what you decide to do, keep in mind that creating the fabric of a good solid Troop is a process that doesn't happen overnight. Don't be afraid to experiment a little bit. If one system doesn't work exactly too well, try another. God Bless "The Patrol Method", but---remember---as in most rules, it's a guideline. Just try to get as close as you can and you'll eventually get good results. Sorry about the broken record thing but, TRAINING IS THE KEY.

Wow! I read your statement and I feel bad for you. Look, I'm an active Assistant Scoutmaster. I'm not a politician or a lawyer or anything like that. But the Council underwhich our Troop operates is just great! A few years ago when we needed recruitment advice and had about 7 boys left, they gave us some pretty good tips whic helped our Troop grow to almost 50 now. Last year, our Troop agreed to host the Klondike Camp-o-Ree and it turned out to be one of the best experiences we ever had. One of the best Scouting experiences I ever had as well. We do favors for each other and, although I'm sure fund-raising is important to them, I know they share a common interest in their Troops in our Council. I believe wit all my heart that they subscribe to the old cliche' "If it's not for the boys it's for the birds". I wish I could help you in some way and I hope that, in time, things and attitudes change. It's my job to remain positive.....I'm a Scout.

All of the above are good suggestions...here's another. Remember, the next step for Webelos is Boy Scouting. Try to hook-up w/a Troop which welcomes Webelos-2 Scouts to campouts. The Troop should encourage some of the parents to come along (some of them will anyway to keep an eye on the young ones). Once they take a look at the 'near future' of where the boys will be going, this can sometimes spur enthusiasm and, before you know it, you'll have parents who are a little more excited and willing to participate a bit more.

It's probably still out of print, right? I was able to get one on, let's say, a VERY popular auction site. I was fortunate to pay about $30 for it but it was well worth it. I wish you the best in your quest!

Please don't misunderstand this response. This is just a general feeling I have at this point. This whole issue has become way too distracting. One guy in New Jersey takes the Scouts to the Supreme Court of the land and loses. That's it already. Individual Units will do what they want to do. That's it. Time to get back to the business of 'playing the game'. Instill citizenship, physical fitness and "good moral" values into as many youth as possible by way of a time proven & tested outdoor program. There's no loss of focus here. Tell your Senior Scouts to get up in the morning and while looking at themselves in the mirror they should say to themselves, "Today I will not hurt anyone intentionally and try my best to make good decisions". That's what we're supposed to teach, right? So let's get out there and continue to do it. Am I skirting an issue? No, I'm just tired of this one.

Hello & congratulations on the Cubmastership! Hey, public apeaking isn't everyone's bag. A long time ago, I was a radio announcer for 10 years & that certainly helped me communicate, not only one-on-one but to groups as well. Really, I think as time goes on and you become more comfortable in the position, speaking to the group will get easier and easier. As you get to know all of the boys and leaders and in the process of working with them, I'm sure you'll do just fine. Just like volunteering, this whole thing is a process and, in time, you'll be speaking to them all at Pack nights confidentally.

Another suggestion for you would be to contact your Unit Commissioner and explain the problem to him/her. They are an objective 'tool' for you who may be able to mediate some kind of solution. If you don't know who your Unit Commissioner is (sometimes they don't visit units the way they should) contact your local Council Service Center and they'll help you out.