Rythos

Watch me pull a moderator out of my hat Rocky

Ry(This message has been edited by rythos)

Sorry about that. It should say billion but I was too late in getting back to edit it.

As an unofficial spokesperson for those people paying our bills on time, I would love for this housing market to swing back around. I've had a house on the market for over two years after we moved across the state. My wife and I both work and we are barely able to tread water (not without serious budget cut backs) but you begin to wonder how long you should keep putting 1300.00 a month into a house that I owe 87,000.00, have put 10,000.00 in improvements into it for the last 8-9 years, and I can't get someone to buy for 49,000.00.

We were excited to be told we could short sell use our mortgage insurance and end with no house and a 22,000.00 bank loan to pay back (which should give you some idea of how sick things are) However with so many banks failing and credit restrictions tightened down, the buyers financing offer (The only offer we have had in two years) was retracted and the sale fell through.

I'm a little tired of hearing about how we have to rush to save more banks who are paying dividends to share holders and exorbitant CEO compensation with government infused capital. There seems to be no end of these stories, while the number of forecloses in my area continues to drive the market prices down to the point where no one is interested in looking at a house that is listed at nearly half of what I paid when I bought it (our first house ) 9 years ago.

Some days I feel like Im the idiot because I was raised to take care of my obligations. After all at some point it would probably make more sense to just dump everything into bankruptcy and start saving my cash every month towards rebuilding things.

But I guess that would just make one more foreclosure on the market for someone else to deal with

Ry

Who has a little 3 bedroom piece of the American dream to offer you at a bargain basement price

http://money.cnn.com/2008/11/12/news/economy/paulson/index.htm?postversion=2008111218

This as CNN reports that over 85,000 homes went into foreclosure in October alone, and a total of 936,439 homes have been lost to foreclosure since the housing crisis hit in August 2007.

Silly liberal media and their focusing on nearly a million people loosing their houses.

Lets keep the focus of the 700 million on keeping the banks liquid, that way we can avoid being classified as Secret Socialists or Dirty Wealth Re-Distributors!

Well, maybe not.....

Ry

The level of bitterness regarding Obama's victory continues to astound me. That people are actually convinced he will be worse that four more years of what we have now seems incredible to me.

My wallet has had all the Republican Presidents it can handle for a while...

Ry

Welcome to the site!

Woah! Slow down DanKroh! Everyone knows that letting gay people get married would ruin the sanctity of marriage if we straight people hadn't already got around to taking care of that.

Maybe we can come to some reasonable compromise our founders would approve of? Maybe we can count the same sex couples who are already married as 3/5ths of a married couple!

Ry

I fail to see how being uniformed properly (the book still indicates that an older uniform is always consider official does it not?) in any post in scouting is a problem. If an adult leader is properly uniformed it would appear to me that this sets an example for the boys and other leaders in their unit to be properly uniformed.

This older uniform may be a talking point for a few individuals, however I can't see this as something that would significantly take away from the point of the Round Table for those leaders who attend.

This is one case where I can see almost no reasonable objection to why anyone would not take the 100% chapter and verse answer and use it, and somehow I find myself on the opposite side of the argument with the leading supporter of the "Always run the program exactly as its written" school of thought

Rythos

(Who attends Roundtable each month for whatever it's worth

How about service to others? Scouting in my area makes this a point of emphasis and I assume the same is true elsewhere.

The bible says (depending on your translation of course)

"For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith--and this not from

youselves, it is the gift of God--not by works, so that no one can boast."

The next sentence which most people don't mention is

"For we are God's workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do " (Eph. 2:8,9)

While service does not equal salvation it would appear to be an important part of what God has in mind for those who follow him.

Ry

Stuff like the inappropriate Anit-Palin shirt and the Guy with the monkey with the Obama bumper sticker on his head (http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2008/10/11/politics/fromtheroad/entry4515246.shtml) make me wonder where are all the normal people at.

I miss individuals who can have an exchange of differing ideas without resorting to garbage of this nature. I clearly support Obama more than McCain, but I cannot imagine going to an Obama rally with a sign/stuffed animal/t-shirt carrying an attack of this nature, or yelling something crazy about McCain's time in a prison camp.

How did we get to the point where one candidate actually has to stand in front of a crowd of his supporters and get booed for reminding them to have some basic standard of respect for others?

This last two weeks has reminded me that there are these people out there on both extremes of the political spectrum, and I can't wait until the election is done so I don't have to see them for another three years.

Ry

"Otherwise, he remains scary and is not fit to be president"

It could just be me but I'm a bit more scared of the guy who refers to Americans as "My fellow prisoners" than I am of Obama. I am concerned about his health at 73, especially given his running mate, and comments like that one do not reassure me that he is mentally/physically fit to handle the rigors of governing.

Ry

As I have remarked on several occasions recently, no matter how much knowledge or experience you have (and I'm forced to take people on an internet forum at their word about their experience) if you communicate with people in what is perceived as a hostile or adversarial way you are more likely to turn people off of scouting rather than teach them anything.

Just because you have a high post count, experience, and a stack of BSA manuals doesn't mean you actually know how to talk to people, or lead for that matter.

Sorry to see you go Doc, but I expect that you are not the first, nor the last one to leave after receiving the four star treatment some members of the Scouter.com community are so skilled and experienced passing along to the other users.

Ry

The plan should be do what your grandparents/parents did. Pay cash for things. We need to work towards spending less than what we make, and stop worrying about what your neighabors are driving, wearing, living in. Dave Ramsey (A christian fiscal responsibility counciler) says it pretty well when he tells people to stop trying to keep up with the Jones's because while no one realizes it the Jones's are up the their eyeballs in debt

Cars are a great example. If you have a car payment from the time your 25 through out the rest of your life you will spend over 5 million on car payments. Many people have over a 400.00 car payment per month and talk about how they don't have any money. If you got rid of your car and bought a 1000.00 car and drove it for a year while putting 400.00 in the bank each month by the end of the year you would have 4800.00. Sell the 1000.00 junker for whatever you could get and buy yourself a 5000.00-5500.00 cash car.

Keep saving your 400.00 per month for another year or two years and repeat. Over the course of 6 years you'll have gone from paying 400.00 every month for the rest of your life to driving paid off 15,000.00 quality used cars that you can trade in every 2-3 years if you want. This doesn't even factor in the cost savings due to the new 18,000.00 car people run out and finance ends up costing you more like 25,000.00 or more in the end.

The point at which we can get people to go back to asking How much does it cost, instead of how much per month, for how many months, at what interest rate, we will be on the right track again. This will help us to put ourselves on credible footing when we try and teach our kids how to handle money as well.

All easier said then done of course

Ry

We do a "healthier" trail mix with cinnamon life, kix, crasins (could use rasins instead) banana chips, sunflower seeds and goldfish

Ry

"I'm Kathy. Girl Scout leader for Senior Troop and SUM for them as well. Boy Scouts I'm a merit badge councilor for several badges and just a general all around helper where ever they need me"

Sounds like they put the other duties as assigned clause on the Girl Scout application just like on the BSA one.

Ry

Shortridge (or anyone else) if you have a scanner I'd love to see a picture of this pack. Depending on what it looks like It could prove to be an interesting do it your project.

Ry

I don't remember too many Republicans saying, "I couldn't figure out how to vote."

I seem to remember one who can't remember how many houses he owns though.....

In the spirit of fairness these people are giving speeches or having conversations where making a mistake can cost you everything you've worked for your entire adult life career wise. People are going to make mistakes under that kind of pressure and scrutiny, its bound to happen. There are no perfect people (unless your Catholic and then you get to count the Pope on matters of faith)

However, there is a difference between lying and misspeaking, which is something that I think some of our politicians (once again both parties) would do well to remember.

Ry

I've been kicking around the idea of going down there for one day to visit the Jamboree with a family vacation thrown in with scout who will be a bear at that time, but I wasn't sure if he would get enough out of it to make it worth the trip (about 700 miles)

People who have taken Cubs, was it worth it? Did you have enough fun and learn enough to make the trip a good experience?

I'm on the fence due to the fact that he'll only be a bear. If he was a W1 or W2 I'd probably start the planning now, but as it stands I'm just not sure.

Ry

"Real long-term vision comes from an interested and (lightly) involved CO."

I'll second Beavah in regards to the lightly portion of his statement. I am a Den leader in a Pack that has a heavily involved COR who is a lot like my father in that he fails to understand that Kids cannot be expected to act like adults all the time. He gave a five minute speach at our first pack meeting of the year about how he was disapointed at the way the kids talked too much, were not sitting up straight in the pack meeting, and that some of the scouts uniform shirts had become untucked. In my opinion the scouts had done nothing overly wrong. Kids locked up in what turned out to be a more informational than a hands on engaging meeting are going to have a hard time sitting still.

The COR's participation in this meeting essentially killed any desire that I'd had for possibly taking over as Cub Master in a few years. With the mass defection of leadership and an issue with a specific leader last year the mostly inactive COR has decided to go to the other extreme. The program is supposed to be fun and starting out the year (and scouting for all the new Tigers) with a speech on he's disapointed in the kids for being kids is telling to me about how the rest of the relationship between the Pack and the CO is going to be.

CO's own the program for sure, and COR represent the CO's obviously, but at the end of the day I think they should be a bridge between the CO and the Adult Leaders communicating what the CO wants the program results to be, not taking center stage at the Pack Meeting and telling the boys how disapointed he is.

It would appear that too active can be just as bad as inactive,

Ry

"SO, what other councils are having the same problem? CHECK IT OUT. There's probably a lot more "data" being lost than merely the Adult Leader Training dates. How about "Privacy Act of 1974" stuff, background checks, etc.? I cringe at the thought.... "

Given the fact that it has the potential to damage kids (hopefully this is more important) and cost BSA quite a bit of money, I'm sure they take the background checks more seriously than they do completeness of training records. With the exception of Youth Protection and Safety related trainings, lost records do not have the same potential to cause financial losses to councils.

We are expected to handle paperwork correctly and they should be as well. You know they would not accept the situation if we only submitted recharting paperwork or tour permits with the same ratio of success.

I supose one can argue that the OP has exceeded the amount of frustration allowed under the Scout Law, or that his suggestion to make it a public issue at a roundtable is not appropriate. I guess I would have to respond that if no one strongly expresses discontent, and there are no other negative repercussions that result from their inability to perform part of their duties why would they change how they do business? Aparently wasting time/money misfiling documents and sending out letters (again wasted money)adivising you are not properly trained yet appears to be working for them.

Ry

(This message has been edited by rythos)

By these two guys asking the Unit to cover the costs of thieir damage reminds me once again that gone are the days of personal responsibility.

Ry

One thing you can do is get their menu and see what you can/cannot work around. For example if they are having sliced ham, scalloped potatoes, a roll, and green beans you can ask them to check on the ham and scalloped potatoes with Sysco and once this information comes back you can make the items (or their replacements) on your own and bring them in.

Of course they can always tell you your diet is too difficult to accommodate, but if you don't talk to them you'll never know

I ran a Gluten Free camp for twenty kids who also had various other allergies last month for 25 kids while we had several other groups at our camp and we were able to make it work. It can be done but they have to be willing to work with you. One way to convince them is to suggest that any information they gather regarding gluten free menu items for you can be utilized to help them throughout the rest of the year for any other celiac campers they might have.

Ry

"LisaBob absolutely suggested that a leader who tries to learn a little more about a topic is in some some way doing a slapdash job with the topic and that is unsupportable as a general statement of fact that she presented it to be."

I think what was attempting to be communicated is anyone who learns only a LITTLE more about a topic and takes the stance of an expert is misrepresenting themselves. Even individuals who possess an extremely large base of knowledge gathered over time but present it in a manner which comes across as a self proclaimed expert can turn people off more than educating them. It is a danger that we all run into from time to time.

"If the scouts in your community have poor outdoor skills then say that. But to transfer the characteristics or failing of the few local leaders you know to all the leaders in the nation or even to most the leaders in the nation, based on such minimal evidence is a sloppy generalization at best"

I suppose that we could require all posts to be work cited and any numerical references should be exact out to the 10th decimal place with math shown, but I'm not sure it would have us all checking this message board on a monthly, let alone daily basis.

In many cases we can assume that generalizations are used because exact statistics are not readily available. I think if one reads the posts they can glean that no one is claiming all or most leaders in the nation are poorly educated regarding outdoor skills. The original poster seems to be stating that what she "sees in a lot of troops and packs, is that the parents decide that they'll just bone up on things by reading a page or two ahead in the scout handbook or downloading something off the web real quick, and off they go as the nascent "expert." "

These are her observations, and I don't think that they were intended to pass muster as a certified representative sampling of the entire BSA membership. This appears to be just as a statement from her that she has encountered several instances of this, and feels like it is more common than it should be. It appears that the OP feels individuals with limited knowledge should not attempt to appear to be the Expert, but rather acknowledge that they may not know everything, but would be happy to help the boys find the answers for any questions they (the leader) might not have the answers for.

No one person, no matter how experienced or well informed can know everything after all,

Ry

Wallyn thanks for the inspiration. I set one up yesterday using yours as a guide and I think its going to workout great

Raise the issue with the SE if your that offended and whatever happens happens. We all make choices and their choice was to disregard the rules. Every choice has a consequence and he will have earned his. If the program suffers due to the loss of an active professional Scouter you will have realized the consequence of your choice.

Ry

(edited to inset a missed word)(This message has been edited by Rythos)

But one must consider that there is a big difference between arrested and rumors flying around.

Ry(This message has been edited by rythos)