Roadkill Patrol

Replying to Pack121Scouter.

According to the treasurer report, popcorn had already been paid to the council. There were no outstanding debts at the time of this last report.

As much as I could tell, the pack has not reduced the amount of any outings by paying a portion of it. This is what I would like to see happend in the future.

The pack pays for advancements and kicks in for some pack level potlucks and crafts throughout the year until the next popcorn sale. Dues offset some of this spending.

The pack does not have to pay for the meeting place.

I haven't seen the pack in financial trouble in the past few years as far as I could tell.

The campership fund has just under $300 in it. According to the details, it hasn't changed in 2 years. I forgot to mention there was a separate training fund, which will pay up to half of leader's approved training. I learned that this fund was created last year when the cubmaster decided to take Woodbadge and wanted the pack to pay for part of it. It hasn't been used much since. This was told to me by someone else, so I am not sure how it exactly works. Will have to find more about that also.

They seem to have funds set up for almost everything. The separate funds and the general fund combined total just over $12,000. That is why the general fund balance is baffling to me and why they don't do more to support the boys and help fund an outing or two.

The balance shown was post-popcorn sales. Before popcorn, the balance was $7800. They only provide neckerchiefs to new scouts and crossing over to the next level. There are only 20 boys in the pack.

Pinewood derby is a self funded activity. During each derby, the pack gets donations of items to run a Derby Cafe. The money earned from the cafe pays for the cars for next year and all of the awards. A new track and finish line with software was donated 2 years ago. The pack gives free cars to the boys and if parents or siblings want to race in a separate class, they pay $5 per car.

As far as popcorn goes, the boy's sell first, then turn in the money when the product is delivered. I haven't seen where anything is paid up-front, but I will check into that for the next meeting.

The pack does have some books on hand that were purchased before this last treasurer's report, but they don't give them out free. Parents either buy a book from the pack or from the supply store.

I just don't see where the pack is using any of the money to benefit the boys, other than a little here and a little there. They are taking in more than they spent according to the chart that was attached to the report. It keeps climbing, there were more peaks than valleys on the chart. If parents don't go to the committee meeting, they wouldn't know any of this was going on.

I am a parent of a Bear cub and I am at odds on how to approach the Cub Scout committee in regards to our pack's finances. Here is a little background information:

The annual dues for scouts is $30. This is split between the pack account for advancements and to the specific den for den activities. During registration, if a scout selects the Boy's Life, they pay for the first year and the pack pays for every year after that. Recently, the pack informed parents that the dues were going to be raised because the cost to charter went up and other things. The chartering organization usually kicks in each year to pay the re-charter and sometimes extra $$.

Now the pack participates in the popcorn sale each year and has done well. For each scout's sales, 70% goes to Council, 30% stays at the pack level. The 30% is split with 20% going to the pack and 10% going to the individual's scout account.

For any outings the pack goes on, there is a fee for attendance, based on the activity. Sometimes there are big outings, which of course costs more to participate in. Throughout the year, there are get-togethers such as potlucks, lock-ins, where everyone contributes. The pack kicks in some crafts and some of the food.

Now this may sound like a normal pack operation based on how other packs operate (I assume). It seemed to me that it was set up pretty well to "pay to play" on outings and advancements. Some costs were offset with my son's scout account. I figured everything was running pretty smooth until I found out something that disturbed me about the dues increase.

As a parent, I decided to attend a committee meeting since I found out no other parents other than committee members were attending them. I was shocked when the treasurer's report was read and learned that the pack's general fund has over $9,000 in it!! This amount is separate from the scout's accounts, special funds for equipment purchases, uniform fund, and campership fund. It seems to me that the pack is hoarding money on the backs of the parents that are paying dues, and then increasing dues when it isn't warranted. The pack is definitely not starving for cash. There is no allocation for the general fund, such as planning a big trip, or making a big purchase.

Would you as a parent be outraged that you are required to pay more dues so the pack can stock up their bank account? How would you handle approaching the committee on this. We have a month until the next meeting. I am trying to get more parents to attend the next one. Is it uncommon for packs to have this much money on hand? I would like to see the pack chip in for free admission to a day camp or two coming up this year. At most, it would cost the pack only $300 and may get more attendance, but I want to approach this carefully.

I agree with BrentAllen. As leaders, we shouldn't hover around these scouts all of the time. On various campouts, we have encourage the scouts to explore without adults as long as the SPL is there. We have set up geocaches for them to find while us adults wait at camp.

We had a new patrol on our last campout. When the patrol leader asked me when they should start breakfast, I informed him he should get his patrol together and decide. He said that xxxxx is still sleeping. I told him that he is only still sleeping because you are allowing him to keep sleeping. Since the rest of them were hungry, it didn't take long for them to get him awake!

The issue of the G2SS rules needs to apply as well as the issue of helping this leader with an unruly scout. When reading the story, my first thought went to youth protection before even getting to the problems of the unruly scout.

When BSA rules are not followed by the leaders (known or unknown), how can we expect our scouts to obey rules that we need to enforce? Besides, if this scout had caused serious problems, and the adults created an environment for problems to arise, BSA insurance probably would not have been in effect.

Our troop has a policy of behavior based outings. Past behavior of a scout is weighed into their ability to attend a future outing. We have had unruly scouts before, but once they find out their actions caused them to miss something fun, we saw immediate changes in their behavior. We had tried sitting out unruly scouts during an event, but what do you do when a younger scout refuses to obey and sit out. You can't physically restrain them, so it may appear that we are not in control. By not having them at the next outing, they are forced to sit out at home and think about it.(This message has been edited by Roadkill Patrol)(This message has been edited by Roadkill Patrol)

You will enjoy it.

I had just sealed my Brotherhood this past fall, in a somewhat unexpected way. At summer camp last year as an ASM for my son's first year as a boy scout (he started at Tiger), I happened to mention to our scoutmaster that I had been through Ordeal as a 13 year old scout (now 37). That's when he told me something that I was unaware of...I was still an Ordeal Member with my old lodge! I was encouraged to get my records transferred to the current lodge and attend the fall fellowship to partcipate in the Brotherhood ordeal. What an awesome experience that was and it brought back a lot of memories from my Ordeal.

Enjoy your Ordeal and embrace the experience.

I sure hope I don't see any of the questions relating to the OA Admonition!

Speaking of Cabelas, our council received a letter stating that for the 2010 Anniversary year, troops and councils will received 25% off their orders. It looks as though you have to put together a list and send the request as it is not available online or at the store. I would attach the notice our council forwarded to our troop, but I don't see that I can do that here. Check with your local council.

Sounds like fun.

When my son & I were in Cubs, the pack spent the night on the USS Silversides, a submarine docked in Muskegon, MI. The kids had a blast. There was a small tour, but then they were free to roam the boat and also a coast guard cutter docked next to it. We just had to make sure we had plenty of adults.

Plan on some board games depending on how long you will be there. Ours stay was from 6pm to noon the next day. Try to find out if there is spot on the ship where you can have the boys participate in a flag ceremony.

It sounds like there is going to be a lot to see on a bigger ship than a sub, so they should be pretty entertained just touring it (and trying to find their way back to the starting point)

Have fun!!!

It was just announced on the radio that the school board is going to change their decision and alter their zero tolerance policy for Kindergarten & 1st graders to use better judgement. So you can still be "convicted" if you are a 2nd grader.

One of my favorites (and simple) was called the "World's Scariest Scout"

You need one un-suspecting scout member like Cubmaster, Committee Chair (preferably in uniform).

Doesn't matter how many scouts you have.

You put a sheet over one of the scouts. The rest line up in front of that scout as the den leader announces the pack has the "World's Scariest Scout". The first scout in line looks under the sheet and screams, then falls to the floor (and rolls away a little). One by one, each of the scouts look under the sheet and falls to the floor in a scream.

When all of the scouts have done this, you ask your un-suspecting scout leader to look under the sheet. When the leader looks under the sheet, the scout wearing the sheet screams and falls over, having seen an even scarier scout.

I was getting into the burnout situation when my son graduated into Webelos II. For all of the years leading up to that, I was the "go-to" guy to plan the outings, being treasurer, den leader, registration leader, making flyers, etc. I paid the price for wanting the pack to have stuff planned correctly, informing parents of outings, gathering permission slips. I enjoyed it for awhile until I could tell I was just getting my skills taken advantage of since other leaders hardly did anything. I was always afraid that things would not go right if I was not directly involved and I needed to change my attitude.

So when my son went to Web II, I told everyone that this is my son's final year and I was leaving it up to him what trips, camps, outings he wanted to attend since he was basically dragged around every year with me since Tigers. It was up to everyone else to step up to plan the events and organize everything. It was a hard lesson for them to learn that they had to rely on other people than the "go to" guy. They had trips planned out, but didn't give directions or what time to meet to carpool, etc. After awhile, they finally adapted and seem to be running pretty smoothly. It made the world of difference in my family life when I told them I was taking a backseat role the last year we were in the pack.

My son crossed over to the troop last February where I became an Assistant Scoutmaster. There we have more parental involvement and since the boys are running everything, I haven't felt the burden I did in the pack.