resqman

When I joined the troop 3 years ago, there was no official hat. Adults wore a odd assortment of headwear. I went down to the local embroadry shop and chose a ball cap with a green bill and tan top in an acid washed finish. Had "Troop NNN" and City, State embroaderied around a Flue de luis in green to match the bill. Had first inital, last name added across the back.

I got a few and gave them out to the other ASMs who routinely camped. A few other fellas asked and I had a few more made. Just picked up 3 hats last week and 5 today for the newer ASMS.

So now all the ASMs and SM have matching ball caps with troop number, city, state, and their name on the hat. There is still no offical troop hat. I guess you could consider the adults have "patrol gear".

Troop "guidelines" state an adult must serve in the troop committee for a year prior to becoming an ASM. This is to give them a chance to learn the troop culture, get trained, loose the Cub mentality, etc.

There are some who are much better suited for direct contact with the lads and being in the outdoors. There are those adults who are better suited for committee work. The SM will waive the 1 year committee work if it is obvious a better fit for the adult to be in the field. Mostly these are adults who earned Eagle as lads, have military experience, or have specific field oriented skills.

We currently have a lead ASM assigned to each patrol and at least one backup ASM for each patrol. The lead ASMs have at least a full year or more in the role. Backup ASMs are learning the ropes. All ASM's with at least a year with the troop are fully trained. Any with less than a year, are signed up for training. We also have a few ASMs with other dedicated jobs of advancement, quartermaster, Life2Eagle, etc.

Our CO does not sponser a Pack or Venture Crew. The nearest Packs in our area also have Troops sponsored by the same CO. The last several years the other troops have been in "transition" due to a variety of adult leadership changes.

As a result we have had good membership drives. 12-16 webelos joining each year for 3 years running. We also had several scouts transfer from the struggling troops to ours. The brothers of the transfers eventually wound up in our troop as well. The other troops have seemed to resolve their issues and more of the Webelos from "thier feeder" packs are choosing the troop at the same meeting loction.

We are only expecting 2 Webelos to join this year. We are still a strong and active troop with ~55 active members. We are not going to fold as a result of a poor Webelos transition but it does mean we will have to try harder over the next year to generate more potentials. During the last year we have had at least 4-6 "walk-ins" who either had no prior scouting experience or moved into the area and chose our troop.

I can see where the combination of no longer allowing flyers to go home in the school system along with the lack of a "feeder" Pack could downsize a troop to the point it struggles and folds.

Sharpie works for our family.

Shirt in the collar

Pants inside the waist band

Socks and underwear we consider expendable

Ditto

In my youth, the patrols were proud of the name and wanted to keep the name as a badge of honor. I can remember a patrol every changing its name. All the patrols had very standard patrols names chosen from the national patches.

In my current troop, the NSP is allowed to choose any name it likes as long as the standard national patches are worn. Usually after a year, they want to change the patrol name to something more exotic. The SM runs an advertising firm and has his art department make up a new graphic and the troop buys the new custom patches. The first time. After that, it comes out of the pocket of the patrol.

When I joined the troop several years ago, the patrol boxes and equipment were labeled with patrol names that did not exist. I suggested we color code & number each patrol box. Now we have Orange 1, Red 2, Blue 3, Yellow 4, Green 5, White 6, Purple 7, and Black 8. The box and every piece of equipment in the box has a piece of colored tape or spray paint on it. Non utensil items also have a stenciled number. It is amazing that at the end of every campout, the inside of each patrol box is rainbow colored. The troop quartermasters sort the gear twice a year.

What is the difference between Preparedness and Survivalist? Degree?

I think it has to do with prejudice and ignorance of the media. It is hard to be "too prepared". The media has to label everything and everyone so it can be served up in sound bites. If there is no conflict, there is no news. By labeling every activity and assigning it a value judgement of normal or extreme, it provides a platform to debate and condon.

To some, buying food in bulk at Sams or Costco is extreme hoarding of food. To others it is sensible economics of buying at a lower price now instead of a higher price later. Having food in the pantry instead of traveling to the grocery everyday saves money and reduces your carbon footprint. Hoarding can be explained as a Green Activity.

There are number of survivalist websites, forums and vendors who offer a variety of low tech and old tech to revert to the pre 1900's way of living.

One of my jobs was as a Disaster Recovery Planner for major corporations during Y2K. The goal was to provide enough planning and infrastructure so the business could continue until services and manpower were available to return to pre-disaster status. Sometimes this means relocating outside the effected area on the presumtion that disasters are localized.

Emergency Prep merit badge introduces the concepts of planning as well as requiring the creation of a family 72 hour kit. Other merit badges provide the fundamentals for Scouts to develop skills to guide their familes through short term disasters. Wilderness Survival, Cooking, First Aid, Personal Management, etc.

Boy Scouts is not a wilderness or survivalist training school. The outdoors is a means to get lads out of their normal routine and force them to deal with small challenges to develop independence and leadership. Along the way a broad spectrum of skills are taught. The scout who stays in the program does not emerge an expert survivalist, he emerges an indepent leader with a set of skills and experiences he can draw upon to face new challenges with confidence.

Before the 1980's when Survivialist became a negavtive term applied to gun toting extremists, putting a few extra cans of food away in the basement or pantry was known as self sufficency, pragmatic, sensible, and common place. Survivalists have taken the Be Prepared motto as far as they can.

Today's scouts are surrounded by technology driven by electricity. Constant and immediate communication with anyone, anywhere, anytime has overshadowed the fact that behind it all is electricity. Loss of electricity stops the modern world. Gas pumps don't work so trucks can't deliver food and goods. Cash registers seldom take cash anymore and stores won't allow you to buy items because their computer based inventory system will be out of sync if they lose electricity.

A favorite quote of many survivalists is:

A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly.

Robert Heinlein quotes (American science-fiction writer,1907-1988)

5 Acres and Independence; A Handbook for Small Farm Management is a book written in the early 1900's on how to set up a self-sufficent farm on 5 acres. Orchards, crops, livestock, timber for lumber, heating, & climate control, barns, tools, skills, and all kinds of other matters. Book is still available for less than $10.

Whew! That is a lot of words with no focus. I would answer any skill that does not require electricity is something a Scout needs.

I was a certified Emergency Rescue Technician for the state of North Carolina. I completed the states High Angle Rescue certification while an active member of the technical rescue squad for over 10 years. I enjoy ropes and knots.

While the knot arrangement seems adequate to act as a belay station, I am curious why it is so elaborate. Why not just tie the rope into a loop via grapevine knots and use a biner to attach the belay device to the loop? Fewer knots, easier and less likley to be tied incorrectly? I am not sure of the advantage of the proposed setup.

Our troop uses permission slips as a form of committment. The scouts must have the signed permission slip in a week before the campout so that enough drivers are available to transport. It also helps the person reserving the campsite to arrange sites of proper size and space.

We use a top/bottom slip. The top lists the location, date, activities, packing list, items to leave behind. The bottom portion lists boys name, parents signature and if the parent wants to drive or not along with vehicle information for planning purposes.

We have a 3-ring binder with copies of all the medical forms of all scouts and registered adults in the troop. Goes on every outing. The permission slip is not used as a medical waiver.

Tour permit from council is a completely seperate activity.

It seems to me that you enjoy casting stones when the real Chief Scout would rather write in the dirt. And what would he write?

Thou shalt not alter thy uniform without permission from the national office?

No problem. No patches on my uniforms that are out of position or not earned. While the troop promotes the adults wearing a custom patrol patch for the adults, I do not not wear a patrol patch.

Thou shall have a uniform that reflects your current state in situation?

Full trained for my current position. All patches and insignia reflect my current status and training.

Thou shalt wear approved BSA socks before choosing rocks to cast at other Scouters who are out of uniform?

Last count I have at least 5 pairs of scout socks. If in uniform, I have on scout socks.

Thou shall not wear long undergarments with a short-sleeved shirt?

I have both long sleeve and short sleeved uniform shirts. If it is cold enough to wear under garments for warmth, I wear my long sleeved uniform. I wear short sleeved under shirts with my short sleeved uniform shirt to reduce sweat stains. If a troop meeting, it may be a white undershirt. If an outdoor event, it will be a troop T or scout logoed T since we may remove uniform shirts. Since I always wear a neckerchief with my uniform shirt, the T-shirts are not visible.

Thou shall not be glutinous, but conform to the new BSA health standards so you can go back-country camping with your unit?

While I am on the high end of the range, I am with in the range for my height. I will be attending a BSA high adventure base this coming summer and plan on losing a few lbs between now and them to ensure that at weigh in there is no chance I will be left at base camp.

"only one was in his scout shirt (half uniform)"

Arrrgh. There is no such thing as Half Uniform. There is only UNIform. Anything else is not a uniform. Stop making excuses and celebrating improper uniforming. It is an All or Nothing proposition.

"The day the BSA fields a rugged uniform that is designed for camporees, and is something a scout would be proud to wear in public, that's when we'll achieve voluntary full uniforming...till then, parents and scouters will keep sending their kids to camporees in blue jeans and other clothes that can take the abuse of dirt, soot, a spilt mess kit, and running thru the woods...."

The current uniform works. My son is always the one knee deep in muck, spilling food, running thru stuff, etc. He brings it home, throws it in the washing machine with some soap and he is ready to go to the next troop meeting. I have had the same pair of pants for 6 years. 3 years of Cub Scouts and 3 years of Boy Scouts. Wear them on campouts, hiking, rock climbing, and COH. No problems. Son has no problems. The shirt is beginning to be a bit grimmy after 3 years of constant use but it is also getting a bit tight and ready for the next size. Anything you wear 6 times a month for 3 years is going to be a bit grimmy and showing wear around the edges. None of the street clothes we bought 3 years ago are still in his closet. Stop making excuses. The uniform performs as well or better in the field than blue jeans.

Belonging to any organization makes you a target for discrimination. But oddly enough, the discrimination often starts from within the organiation. Most groups and organizations expect the members to meet certain criteria to join, regularly attend gatherings, and uphold certain belief systems.

Sports teams require members to regularly attend gatherings where they discuss internal policies about how to operate. They require members to wear uniforms. They outline how members will interact with other members during gatherings. They even employ referees to enforce these rules.

If you are not a member of the team, you cannot attend their practices, wear their uniform, or particiapte in their games. Anyone not on the team is considered less worthy than those on the team. The discrimination starts within the organization and then is reflected back on the team.

Same is true of the Spanish club, the Corvette Owners club, XYZ Church, etc. If you are not part of the club, certains things are not open to you. This creates varying amounts of discomfort from those outside the club.

Boy Scouts are widely known to be Good Deed Doers. Initially this was applauded by the public but has become a point to show how out of touch Scouts is with current society. The ME generation changed the culture to one of self centeredness. The quaint idea of helping others has became something to put down. If they only knew that Scouts promotes self alligence and advancing in rank based on individual achievement rather than helping others they might change their minds.

Those who earn the rank of Eagle have suffered through the constant barrage of discrimination long enough to reach the pinncale of sucess that is recognized outside the organization. They can stand up and say I did it. They know at that point that any discrimination is based on jealousy and ignorance.

We are a fully uniformed troop. The troop maintains a uniform closet. Scouts are expected to wear a full uniform at every troop meeting, SM conference, BOR, traveling to and from every campout, at flag ceremonies, summer camp, etc. All troop members have a full uniform. Adults typically wear a full uniform the entire time during campouts. From when we leave the parking lot on Friday afternoon until we return Sunday afternoon. Not sure what they sleep in, but from when they leave the tent in the morning until they return to their tents in the evening, they are in uniform. All activities with the exception of water activities. Most of the scouts wear their scout pants most of the campout.

As a lad in the 70's, I was a member of a troop. There was never any discussion about not wearing the uniform. It was worn at all scout events with the troop neckerchief. We also wore the red beret and socks with garters.

Stop finding excuses not to wear the uniform. Stop trying to weasal out of it and just put on the uniform. The only uniform is the full uniform. Any thing less is not a uniform, it is a polyform.

As adults, lead by example. Wear the uniform every chance you can in front of the scouts. Remove the excuse it can't tolerate outdoor activities and still function as a dress uniform. Show that it functions in both arenas.

I am constantly suprised at the number of 11 year olds that have never spent a night away from their parents. Never had a sleep over with the kid next door. Never spent a night at grandma's while the parents had a night off.

The first campout with the troop, the parents are the most nervous. The boys are excited about the adventures they think they will have. When summer camp comes around, it is mostly the parents who are nervous about what will happen to their son during a WHOLE week away. These are the parents who have forgotten their job is to prepare their children to become self sufficent adults who will run the world someday in the very near future.

As mentioned earlier, it is not where the scouts are going, it is the fact the mommy and daddy are not there. The scout must learn to rely on himself and others. This builds self confidence in his own ability to tackle the unknown, to develop plans to overcome obstacles, and to build relationships with people his own age to accomplish things he never thought he could.

Can I take my kid to the mueseum? Sure. Will it be the same experience he gets when he goes with the school or the troop? No way. Often when troops visit locations they are given behind the scenes tours. They often interact with professionals who show them special stuff or let them do, touch, or otherwise experience more than the typical visitor. The fact that Mom and Dad are not there to say No a million times also changes the experience. Instead they are interacting with the public and are are treated more like adults.

If the troop is ONLY going to visit cities, then I would be concerned. One trip a year to see a special event or special location rounds out a scouting experience.

We don't limit adults, we only take enough to drive all the scouts attending. We usually have between 20-35 scouts attend a campout so we need 5-8 adults just to shuttle all the scouts to the event. Usually all are uniformed ASMs. Occasionally we have a parent to help with driving. They most often are deciding if they want to become active ASMs and are giving it a try.

All uniformed adults are fully trained in their position so tend to be familiar with the boy led plan. Newer uniformed adults are encouraged to watch before they interact. It takes a few months to get all the training.

If the troop is 2-1, then something is wrong.

We have an ASM who is "undertall" vs. overweight. He is planning on attending Northern Tier but needs to lose 30 lbs by late summer. Feasible yes but not likely. Still waiting to see if he is going to lose weight or back out.

While Philmont is wilderness, you are never more than half a day hike from a camp with communications. Northern Tier is a bit more wilderness.

Great guy and good outdoor skills. Adds a great diminson to the overall leadership team of the troop. But I concerned that I and the scouts would have to treat for medical issues in the field due to his current diminsions.

Seems to me that the collarless shirts in the 70's were only available as long sleeve shirts. I worked as camp staff in 76 and had to buy long sleeve shirts and have the sleeves cut off to have collar on shirts.

The drawback to the collarless shirts is you had to wear neckers. My troop wore neckers but the camp did not require them in the South in the summer.

Some kids wore the collarless shirts without neckes and looked like their were only wearing part of the the uniform (which they were).

By the way, I have two of the blue packs shown in the photo above. Still I got mine in 74 and took it to Philmont. The other is my Dads from the same trip. Still using it today. Not all the zippers work but it is paid for.

At our Webelos invitational we run a number of stations. The station just before lunch is box oven making. The next station is to build a pizza from a tortilla, two spoons of jar pizza sause, a handfull of grated cheese, and a few toppings (pepperoini, olives, bacon, mushrooms, etc.) Place the pizza in the box oven they just made and wait a few minutes while it heats up.

Sometimes we have a third station of making a charcoal chimmeny from a #10 can and coat hangers. Punch a row of holes space about 1 inch apart all the way around the can along the first crease with a nail. Thread the coat hanger wire through in a criss cross pattern and bend the ends to keep them in place. Use a "church key" can opener to make triangle holes along bottom edge. Punch 2 more holes at top edge and bend a coat hanger into a bail wire handle.

We also had a flag station. Properly fold an American flag. Learn how to be an honor guard to raise and lower a flag. The lashing station lashes three staves into a pole about 15 tall. 4 tent stakes and some guide lines hold the flag pole up. An eye hook and some 1/8" braided nylon rope in the end of the top stave serves as a way to raise and lower the flag.

A nearby troop went through a leadership change a couple years back. The experienced leadership formed a venture crew and left the troop. Boys visited our troop telling the story that they had been in the other troop for 12-18 months and were still Tenderfoot. Half dozen scouts joined our troop.

A year later one of our ASMs was teaching at Woodbadge and was accused of poaching the boys from the other troop. The other troop apparently still holds a grudge.

I know we had one scout join our troop and participate for 4-6 months. He stopped showing up after a while. I bumped into him at the hardware store. He had found a different troop that better suited his needs. I was happy he was able to find a troop that better fit his personality. No hard feelings. Just want them to stay in scouts. I feel it is the scouts obligation to inform the troop he is leaving so they can work to improve if possible.

I too wondered about the scout tent discussions. I know that the discussions in the vehicles to an event are considerably different when the scouts are 11-12 vs 15-16. Having been a teenage boy, raising two teenage boys, and a scout leader for 7 years, boys are not that different. Fart jokes are always funny. Girls have kooties until middle school. As they approach high school, getting kooties is not such a bad thing.

Car camping can encourage people to bring "too much" gear. I think we need to look at the question being asked. Is Scouts about teaching a boy how to survive in the woods or it is about exposing him to a variety of new topics and forcing him to learn self confidence and basic life skills. We use the field as a classroom to get scouts outside of their normal environment and stretch them beyond their normal skill set.

As Lisa mentioned, how many 11-15 year boys can plan a balanced meal, buy the groceries, prep the food, cook the food, serve the food, and clean up the kitchen. In any environment! Cooking on a one burner backpacking stove tends to limit people to one pot meals. Being able to cook a meal over an open fire is a skill that most people never use again. Being able to plan, prep, cook, serve and clean up a meal is an everyday skill that everyone should be able to perform. I don't really care if it is over an open fire or a propane stove.

People outside of Scouting know only a few things about Scouts.

- They wear a uniform

- They know how to tie knots

- They know First Aid

- They help old ladies across the street

- Earning the rank of Eagle is the end all of everything

If you talk to people inside of scouting it is about leadership and personal growth through fun activities. High adventure and backpacking are tools to teach leadership and develop self confidence. Councils offer high adventures trips even if the local troops do not. If the troop adult leadership is not promoting high adventure, troop or council, then that is failing of the adults but does not prevent interested scouts in participating.

Leader capabilities regarding depth of woods skills and phyiscal challenges have been discussed. BSA does not offer advanced wilderness skills classes. I do not believe they even offer basic wilderness skills classes. IOLS introduces the topics to the adults with a single opportunity to practice. They do not offer classes in planning, preparing or managing high adventure outings. The national organization is not providing the level of support GAHB is seeking.

I believe the review of troops should more acurrately reflect the goals of the program vs. what the public expects. Which troops are teaching citizenship, leadership, LNT, and promoting self confidence through introduction to new topics in a fun environoment. The goal of scouting is not to produce a crop of wilderness survival experts. It is to produce leaders.

From what little I know about homeschooling parents, they are interested in controlling the environment they raise their children. They tend to have strong religous beliefs. Scouting promotes religious beliefs. The Guide to Safe Scouting certainly limits how scouts interact with their community and each other. Scouts advance at their own pace. It seems like the perfect environment for home schoolers.

Bullying and respect of adult leaders is the same issue. Respect for other people. Troops should not tolerate bullying or disrespectful scouts. Usually asking the scout in question which of the 12 points of the scout law he is demonstrating helps them to understand which behavior they should be demonstrating.

Troops are made of up of volunteers doing the best they can and know how. Some leaders have more training. Some leaders apply the training. Troop cultures are difficult to change when you are the only one with a different vision. I have seen troops change dramatically by the installation of a SM with a strong vision of Scouting. Those who understand and agree with the vision, stay and improve the troop. Those who do not agree with the vision, move on.

We have a cooking contest every campout. The PLC chooses the theme for Saturday evening meal. Each patrol selects its own menus and buys their own food for the entire weekend already. They just choose menu items that meet the theme. Started out simply enough with ethic weekends: Mexican, Asian, Italian, etc. After about a year of that, the patrols were confident they could cook. The PLC then started down the line of methods of cooking. Must cook something in a dutch oven besides dessert, must use a box oven for at least one part of meal, untensiless cooking, open fire cooking, backpacking meals, hobo meal, etc.

At the semi-annual YLT training the troop holds, we divide the attendees into patrols. Each patrol is given the same or similar ingredients, recipies, and time to cook. For instance each patrol was given fresh fish fillets, potatoes, onions, a bread product fixings(cornbread, hush puppies, biscuit fixings) and seasonings. One patrol was given a box oven, one was given a turkey fryer, and one a propane cook top. The attendees did not know the ingredients or the recipes before they were handed to them at cooking time. They can either follow the recipe or come up with something on their own. Each patrol ate what they fixed but was also able to sample the other patrols fare.

The scouts have been very creative. The food quality is excellent. Initally the adult leaders would waunder by and get a sample from each patrol. Now each patrol prepares a presentation platter for judging delivered to the adult area. There are no formal judging rules. The adults sample and discuss the pros and cons. SM makes final decision and awards token prizes to the winning patrol.

If your scouts are not used to cooking, I would recommend hosting a few demonstrations during troop meetings leading up to the weekend. A simple meal that is hard to do wrong is breakfast. A dozen eggs, a pound of bacon or sausage, a stick of butter, cheese, loaf of bread, box of bisquik, syrup, spice cabinet, and some milk. Lots of ways to make these ingredients into tasty fare. French Toast, omelettes, boil-in-bag eggs, bullseye toast, etc. Bisquick can become biscuits, pancakes, cinmmamon rolls, or all manner of other bread options.

Not quite sure how you create one when it does not exist. When an Adult wants to become an ASM, he is told he must complete the 4 modules within a year. We expect him to complete YPT before he can attend a campout. We usually can tell him when the next courses will be offered since some of the troop leaders are trainers and suggest he review the council website for training opportunities.

The SM is woodbadge trained. At least 4 other uniformed leaders are woodbadgers. Of those 4, at least three are wood badge trainers. The last IOLS course, half the staff was from our troop. We also had 3-4 troop adults taking the course.

I guess it starts soon as the prospective adult asks how to become a leader in the troop. 1. fill out application, 2. buy complete uniform, 3. Attend training

If all the other adults are trained and constantly making references to the training, then naturally you would want to attend training to be like the rest of the gang.

Our troop also runs its own YLT course every six months. We hold troop elections every 6 months. With 6 patrols and troop positions, we usually have about 12-15 scouts attending. Actually YLT is a prerequiste of putting your name on the ballot. Scouts are told that they cannot run for office if they cannot attend YLT weekend two weeks after elections.

We have been building plastic totes with gear for each of the 6 training areas we have designed for the Troop Instructors.

Totin'Chip/Knife&Axe: All the tools and stuff you need to teach Totin' chip and set up an axe yard. Couple of worn pocket knifes, sharpening stone & oil, hand or scout axe, file, gloves, safety glasses, bow saw, rope to delineate yard. Place all in plastic tote.

Rope, Knots and Lashing: A tub with dozen or so 6' lengths of rope to practice knot tying. A couple of stubby candles for fusing the end of rope. Twine or floss for whipping rope. We also have the lashing boxes. 4 nested boxes with notches cut in the sides that hold staves in position so a lashing can be tied. Dozen of the scout staves for basic lashing. Several lengths of rope about 15-20 feet for lashing.

Fire: Plastic tote with several ziptop backs of tinder (birch bark, cedar bark, cattails, steel wool, cotton balls & vasoline, pitch pine/fatwood/lighterwood) A few spark generators like the BSA Hot Match, Gerber Strike Force, etc. A 12" metal BBQ pan so fires can be built above ground and now worry about burning other surfaces.

You get the idea. We have a tote for each area to be taught, First Aid, Fire, Totin'Chip, Ropes & Knots, Orienteering, etc.

That way the troop always has all the materials for any scout to teach or complete the necessary task.

I remember wearing my cub uniform to elementary school in the late 60's early 70's. But it definitely was not considered cool to be a Boy Scout in High School in the 70's.

My son had a birthday party last spring. Invited 3 buddies to go indoor skydiving. All of them happened to be Boy Scouts in different troops but none knew the others were Scouts. Never came up between the friends until they saw the scout logo on my custom leather cellphone belt pouch.