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So what was the consequence here? A piece of paper? The first strike, of a three strike and maybe your out policy? I have boys that might work on, but I also have boys that are going to take the second swing, just because there is no real consequence (or just another piece of paper). I bet the only way his parents will find out is if you tell them. Who cleaned up the latrine after the boy? Was his mother there to do it? Did the SPL do it? Did you do it? The boy should at least have to clean up after himself (if not everyone else for that day). I had a boy (my girlfriends son)

Everyone here has good points and ideas. I agree with most everything said here. But one thing, the fear of failing because of the group activity. We do a lot of things as a group. This particular boy has no problem doing other things and failing in front of the group. These boys are his friends and most of the time offer encouragement. But it brings up another thought. Maybe there is an underlying thing about water that none of us (including his grandmother) have detected and the boy won't admit to or even realizes himself. All he knows is that he doesn't like the water. One thing I

Yes, I agree that the advancement process cannot be circumvented without good reason(and approval). I haven't placed any unnecessary emphasis on requirements nor do I push the scout any more that I feel I should. If a boy doesn't want to advance and is having a good time, then maybe I have done my job. But when a boy says he wants to advance, but then refuses to fulfill certain requirements to meet his goals, all I can do is as I have stated, point out his dilema to him, and maybe a suggestion on how to overcome it and then allow him do as he sees fit. I can't recommend a variation on

I have lived in a river community all my life. My siblings and I were required by our parents to learn to swim at an early age and had to at least pass what the Red Cross called advanced swimming. I learned to swim when I was 4 or 5. And spent my summers at the swimming pool or in the river. I can't remember ever not being able to swim and can not imagine anyone not wanting to, or at least not learning enough to be able to save themselve. Found out later that it was because dads brither had drowned in 1946. I had no experience with people who wouldn't swim or were classified as TOW (

I agree with sctmom, too. If this boy did this not knowing it was wrong (I taught my son and my girlfriends son, that you raise the lid and the seat aim for the center the lower the seat and lid when they are finished), I would be concerned about other developmental problems showing up. If it was for any other reason, let him clean up for a day or two, he will realize quick, that it won't be tolerated. I still send the boys back in to clean up the mess (they have to clean the entire toilet if they don't raise the seat, not just the seat)or lower the lid when they "forget."

I have a similar problem with one of my 12 years old scouts excpet that he refuses to do any of the swim requirements and has for over a year. He is still a tenderfoot. He says he doesn't like the water and isnt' going to do it. When I ask him about his plan for advancement though, he tells me he wants to make eagle by the time he is 15 or 16. Then I ask him how he plans to get beyond tenderfoot when he refuses to do the swimming requirements. He doesn't have an answer. I feel he thinks that I will eventually cave in and advance him with or without the requiremnts complete.

We just had out 10 day out meeting for Camp Friedlander and it looks to be a good time. The new camp looks great, the new lake is awesome. Spoke to some of the unit leaders out there too, and their reviews were good, except for the mention of the typical first day hectics. I am looking forward to it. I will let you know of our experience on the 29th. Spork, Will you coming to Peterloon this October?

And here I thought some scotus leaders fingers were as dyslexic as mine?

SPL or PL for the leader In a one patrol troop you don't need both. I called him the PL and he acted as SPL when it came to dealing with the SM and ASM('s). To me Senior Patrol leader implies that there are other Patrol Leaders and he is the top dog. Whatever, T337SM's troop wishes to use, it is their choice, and neither is wrong.

T337SM, If you want common sense, then do what Bob White describes above. I have been doing it for a year or so now and it seems to be working fine. We are teaching the patrol method, not the troop method. If you teach them to be a patrol now, they will teach it to the new scout patrol later. Then when you have two patrols, you can teach them to be a troop. We do our recruiting from 3 small towns and the 3 surrounding townships, I really don't think I will have enough boys for two full patrols, if I ever have enough for two patrols. If we were to do this strictly "by the

Sctmom is right. These do keep everything together and helps keep things from getting forgotten. Also, if your charter organization is a church, you can put an add in thier bulletin about your needs (especially the small stuff, i.e., flatware, strainers, etc) People will clean out thier kitchens for you. Our CO is a church and we did this, the next Sunday, there were three boxes of stuff from flatware, napkins, towels, cups, cooking utinsels, coffee pots, even a teapot!

Here are the links for both. Project Cart PJC2500 http://www.suncast.com/utilitystorage/38/pjc2500/ Barbeque and Garden Cart BGC2000 http://www.suncast.com/lawnandgarden/19/bgc2000/ Took me a while to find them. They put them is what I think were odd locations on the website. Also, if you email them, they will respond promptly with pricing and where to get them in your area. Hope this helps!

Since there is no written policy or procedure for a one patrol troop, those of us that have that situation are left with using the policy and procedures that are in the BSA literature as a guide in how to establish and operate our troops until such a time we can build up to the small troop example you cited. And hopefully we will have enough to fill all the jobs. I know Bob posts the BSA policy, procedures, and literature, but I see it as a good thing.

I agree with Bob White here. I am also a "by the book" kind of guy, but take another look at the example of the small troop, it shows more than one patrol! Not the case here. Sometimes common sense must prevail and you need to take the spirit of the book into account and not the letter. If you have only one patrol, there is no PLC and you really don't have troop meetings, but patrol meetings, therefore, no need for a SPL. We did exactly as Bob White is suggesting in out troop. Also, ian_au has a good suggestion. We too have been trying to do things with other troops and the idea is c

eisely has a point. Our troop is new with young boys and we do more of what he calls car camping. We frequent places where we can get into or close to with our vehicles. We do not have a storage problem either(unless you call lots of small stuff on shelves a problem), but we do have nearly enough small equipment and goods for the three patrol boxes we plan to buy. Then most of the small stuff will be stored in there. All of the patrols equipment will be kept in the box. Even the backpack stoves, etc. We use totes too. This works for us. It might not work for others. Each will have to

Our troop found every downloadable patrol box we could find and considered all of them as a replacement for our large wooden box that the boys can not(nor do they want to)carry. We saw a troop that used Rubermaid Garden Carts for patrol boxes (modified a bit) and a table. Our boys liked these because they were lighter, smaller and much easier to handle. They said they liked them better than anything they could build. So we are going to give them a try. We are now raising the money for the (3)new boxes and tables at a cost of about $100.00 for each set. The only ones we found thou

First of all, I want to thank everyone for their advice here. I will keep it in mind for the next time a situation comes up like this. Secondly, It seems this father isn't as shallow as he seemed. When I saw him Wednesday evening, he did bring it up, but he apologized for "Going off" on me about the subject and that he realized he had no business doing so. He realized his grudge against the CC had no bearing here and that the CC really wasn't the "bad person" he said he was. He said everything is fine and his son will be staying in the troop, just don't expect him to be all "Hugs and

Yes, I think you are right. I will see him in about 2 hours and I am sure we will get it discussed then. He seems to just have a grudge because they "lost" the case. He had similat stories about his divorce atty. Can't make everyone play nice can we? I think he will perceive my taking up for the boy as taking up for the CC. Maybe it is. I defend my leaders when I feel the leader is right. Whatever the dads beef is, it doesn't belong in scouting and I will do my best to not let it in. I wonder what will happen if he decides to let the boy stay and he meets up with the CC at the

No substance that I have been made aware of, I just get the impression that he is angry over "losing" the legal thing. Blames the lawyer for the case not going thier way. This situation is also blamed for the divorce. I think there is more to it than I know, or even want to for that matter. And, of course, the CC won't discuss it (confidentiality stuff). I have asked him for a suggestion and he has taken the hands off approach, told me to let him know what happens. I am sure he knows the situation and probably knows it is no use talking to the guy. I think any issue where the CC

As I have posted elsewhere, we have a small troop, few leaders, etc. Our CC is a County Court Judge and has a private practice on the side. He is also the only leader without a boy in scouts. One of my scout fathers has brought to my attention that he has a personal problem with the CC. Seems the Father hired him before he was CC and evidently is still very displeased with the outcome of that and now despises the CC. He has threatened to pull the boy out of the troop and frankly, I think he will. I explained to him that the CC has little to do with the boys on a regular and t

I think FScouter is on the right track, but maybe you could also try having the boys do a reflection activity about the campout trip and have them produce their own checklist of things not to forget. Teach them the responsibility. The parents who went on the trip could also be involved in the reflection to guide the boys so that most things get on the list. I also agree with Bob White, let there be consequences for them taking as long as they want. On our last campout, we had to skip cracker barrel (peach cobbler) because the boys started dinner late (the fish were biting like you woul

sctmom quoted the website "in June 1943, the Supreme Court ruled that school children could not be forced to recite it (The PLedge). I would have thought that would be enough to have the lawsuit thrown out. The way I understand it, the guy doesn't want his daughter to be forced to say the pledge in school. I bet even though he doesn't say the pledge because the word GOD is in it, that he still uses the money!(This message has been edited by scoutmaster424)

When I was Cubmaster (2 years) I think the best advise I received was this: You are now 9 years old again, think like it, have fun with it (it doesn't hurt to act like it at times too). Don't be afraid to do things that the boys will laugh at (and get the other adults to do it too). The adults in our pack would do skits etc at the B & G and other 'big' meetings. It lets the adults know that it is okay to have fun, and the boys know that it is okay to laugh at the adults once in a while. Some of the most memorable times in Cub Scouting was when the adults got up in front and ma

Maybe I should also be a little less "thin skinned" Mike, but I took your comments to sm101 to be about me. As for the books and resources, I get chastised by the wife because I sit and read and read and read and that it seems I think of nothing but scouting (as if there is anything else, LOL). It's an old story from what I understand. When we first started the troop, we were "pushed" into it when we were not ready by a fairly new DE that seemed to want to use us to "get his numbers up." We were "attached" to a nearby troop that I was told had a very good program. This went on for

I have stated in other posts that mine is a new troop. All the boys in the "experienced" patrol are the same rank (tenderfoot), have pretty much the same leadership training and are all 11 to 13 years old. The new scout patrol is another matter. Everyone is a first time leader (except the SPL) so none of them have been able to show much leadership. Along with that, all of the adult leaders are also new with onlythe minimal training so far. No older scouts, No higher ranks, none with more experience, and none more mature than the others (at least not remarkably). And we are doing the