jmenand

I apologise for all the typos in my post... Let this be a lesson to all: if you wake up and can't sleep in the middle of the night, don't go posting things on online message boards!

No one's mentioned the possible solution of removing the instution of "marriage" entirely from the functions of the government. I still wonder why the government endorses the concept at all. If you want to enter inter a legal contract with another person that has similar benifits/obligations as the current marriage has, that's fine and dandy. People who argue that there is a potential slippery slope where people will want to marry children and inanimate objects are sort of right, except that really what should be done is to leave the spiritual, emotional, and societally binding concept of

The shorts on the switchbacks are not too short. They don't hang down all baggy below the knee as some youth might prefer, but I wouldn't call them "daisy dukes" either. Unless the fabric just starts falling apart after constant use, these pants are perfect. Everyone owes it to themself to go try em on. Also I've never heard of a "no daisy dukes" rule being specifically mentioned as a troop rule! Bizarre...

Just picked up my pair today. They seem really great so far! Everyone go check em out.

Our Scoutmaster is on his 17th or 18th consecutive year with our troop.

Quote: "Kinda dispels the notion that most scouts are Republicans, doesn't it?" Unfortunately it seems to prove that eagles are incapable of winning the presidency, eh?

Talk about bad timing, Merri. Is your troop aware that the BSA is releasing official Zip-Off uniform pants later this month? They will be the same color green and everything!

Hah! They changed it. They must have sensed a disturbance in the scouting force...

Even though he's wearing the working WB necker, he's also wearing the beads. I picture this actor showing up at the photo shoot and the photographer pulling out a box of random uniform parts and slapping them together.

I would like to clarify and rephrase what I am trying to say. I do not deny that the BSA has done a lot of the 'heavy lifting.' No doubt, some people want to make alternative youth organizations and call them scouting just to emulate and "steal" some of that success. However, I feel that my comparison to religions is at least appropriate when talking about the legal classifications of different organizations as being companies for business, non-profit organizations, or religions (or anything else). Why is it that religions can take a fundamental element of another religion, and build a s

Actually, on second thought, I'm not so sure the BSA lacks a spiritual theology. After all, it does require the recognition of a duty to God. It may be different from many religions, but there are a lot of religions out there, and many have fundamentally different beliefs about who/what created the universe- yet they still all qualify as religions. I don't see why the BSA is any different, and the scouting movement in general could certainly be a religion to a lot of people.

Trevorum, there is no reason to "confuse the issue" by talking about scouting in theoretical terms. That is why I posed the question about someone starting an actual scouting religion. The BSA may lack "(3) a supernatural theology," but a new scouting religion might not. Some of the stuff in Wood Badge and the OA, for example, provides enough of a foundation for supernatural theology I'd think.

"So is having a "monopoly" on the word "scout", "scouting" etc any different than "Kleenex" or "Jello"? Both have had to defend their BRAND NAME and are now very careful to say Kleenex brand tissue and Jello brand geletin. Try selling your operating system as DOS or Windows or naming your shoes nikee and see what happens. Is it truly a monopoly or is it just copyright, trademark and patent potection? " Are you seriously asking if the scouting movement is different than facial tissue and chilled sugar water? Imagine a representative of the catholic church walking into an LDS church wi

"So, for those who complain, what is so magical about the name "Scouting" that you want to co-opt it? Create your own program, and come up with a name for it. " I'm willing to bet most people, including you, fgoodwin, already know the answer to this question. But since you asked, I will spell it out for you. All you have to do is look at religions which branch off and start their own, slightly different church. There are so many churches that are christian, and all of them have their own little differences. If one church owned the rights to say, the bible or the term "christian" or the co

I can't honestly say I know what is rattling around in the heads of the top brass in the BSA, but the optimist in me requires that I look for the good intentions in what the BSA does. For example, I have to assume that the ban on homosexuals at least partially comes from the supposedly "logical" train of thought that male adults who are attracted to men rather than women, will thus be more likely to molest boys than straight men. We have to ask ourselves: when push was coming to shove back in the highly politicized environment of the meetings to decide the way to word the policy that bans

Oldsm- after talking to a couple people and referencing the previous post, I speculate that what you say is true: the pants your son saw were probably not from BSA Supply. I can only speculate this because I have not seen the BSA pants in person yet. However, everyone I have talked to "in the know" says that a lot of effort was made to match the color of these new pants to the old color. If the pants your son saw were a slightly different color, and because the entire troop was outfitted in them, I am thinking they were not the BSA pants. That said, they might have been the real McCoy. It

The spark issue is one I'm willing to live with for the many apparent benefits of these pants. I have nylon pants with tiny spark-melted holes on them (especially around the calf/ankle area). Of course nobody wants holes in their pants, but if supplex is anything like my normal nylon pants, the holes will at least be nicely fused! And while I'm waiting for the holes to develop, I will be able to enjoy a pair of uniform pants which function well as both hiking pants AND shorts. Tiny, cleanly fused spark holes are a small price to pay. As for supplex shirts, I didn't think about the patch i

Great! Now how about a supplex field shirt, too? Maybe a full shirt re-design with a more classic cut and no epaulets while you're at it?... I guess I shouldn't look a gift horse in the mouth...

Anyone know of a good site that shows pictures of old uniform styles? Specifically the changes to the shirt over the years. If pictures aren't possible, a good site with written descriptions is OK too. I'm having a hard time finding a clear timeline. Thanks in advance.

I don't care much for the current collar style, but I do like collars generally speaking. I don't care that some think the uniform looks like military uniforms. I think that the addition of the world crest as a standard piece of insignia goes a long way to help identify the shirts as scout uniforms- and in the 21st century the neckerchief looks rather silly, especially on adults. The current collar is too big. It reeks of 80's fashion. Going back to a more classic, timeless collar cut as well as cotton/wool material would be nice. As I said, having the world crest on the front of every un

Setting aside for a moment what the BSA has a legal right to do, there is a possible difference between a traditional corporation and something like the BSA. The BSA is, in my eyes and the eyes of many others, a steward of an idea called the scouting movement. Over the years and even from the beginning the BSA has had to balance that stewardship with the real world demands of a functional corporation. I am simply arguing (nay, suggesting) that despite the BSA's *right* to exercise it's legal rights, it should do so while being conscientious of the principals of the scouting movement it claims

Based solely on the way it is presented here, the scout's lawyer must be out of his mind. I hope that the lawyer is acting, as lawyers often do, the way they *believe* is in their client's best interest. If the lawyer is acting under direction from the council then they're all insane.

Maybe some people would complain even if the uniforms were free, but most people I know would be very grateful for even a 10% reduction in price. A scout is thrifty, after all. And in response to the "people seem to care about price over quality" remark: As I said the scout shop had both USA made uniform shirts and Dom. Republic shirts. I compared them side by side and the stitching and construction seems better on the DR shirt. Who knows how they will hold up over time, but since the USA shirts hold up pretty poorly IMHO, there's no where to go but up.

Not to start an argument about whether this is right or not, but I've noticed that new uniforms are no longer being made in USA, but it either Dom. Republic or Honduras I believe. Hopefully prices fall (or at least do not rise) as a result of this. Only time will tell, but comparing the stitching on the "Boy Scouts of America" on the front of the shirt to the USA shirts, the quality actually appears to be improved!

Anarchist- you say "find another game"- that would be a lot easier to do if the BSA would stop trying to monopolize the scouting "movement" in the US. It's easy to say to find another organization, but it's not easy to do that. What, Boys and Girls club? Indian Guides? Hardly the same thing as scouting, to put it kindly. I read an interesting analogy by Bob White in an older thread where Bob described the BSA system as a franchise. He compared it to McDonalds. If you don't like working under McDonalds rules, start a Burger King francise. But this is a false analogy, because for Burger Ki