Jeffrey H

WDL Mom,

First of all, thank you for your work in Scouting. You sound like your very talented and people take notice. I understand your problem as I am currently holding two positions as a Bear Den Leader and Assistant Cubmaster and I'm busy enough at those two jobs.

What do you do best at Scouting? Program or Administration? What do you enjoy the most? Focus on those and say "NO" to the others.

Assuming you enjoy working directly with boys, I would focus my work on being a stong WDL. Your boys deserve your undivided attention to them with no distractions involving District work. I personally believe that Packs are successful when leaders are fully committed to them. As you probably know, boys quit scouting when leaders neglect duties at the unit-level. The boys don't care what we do for the District.

Keep in mind that people may ask you to volunteer simply because they see you as an easy target and are too lazy to try to find someone else. You may be the wrong person for the job and you need to tell them that.

You have to say "NO" to some positions for three reasons:

1) If you do too much, you will grow tired, become burned-out, and actually grow to dislike Scouting.

2) Saying "NO" will give an opportunity for someone else to step up and do it as good or better than you.

3) It will help your marriage and your family life.

Yes, definitely get basic leader training. New Leader Essentials and Tiger Den Leader Specific. It will help you structure your program and the meet the challenges of your Tiger Den.

I agree with ScoutNut. I would like to add that his suggestions could also apply to Wolves, Bears, and even Webelos. In my Bear Den, there are occasional issues regarding younger children. When those issues arise, we try to have a structured activity for them or we just let them join in on the boys activities. We often do the latter because it works out so well and everyone has fun.

In the Circle Ten Council (North Texas), the Mom N Me/Dad N Lad campouts will only allow registered Cub Scouts. Siblings are not allowed. I don't know the reason for this policy, but I will say that it has severely affected families in our Pack from attending this event. Some our our families have backed-out because if they all could not go then no one goes.

What does the camp application say about non-Scouts?

The BSA gives the right to a CO to approve its own leadership provided it does not violate BSA policy. Its a good policy. The CO owns the unit, is responsible for the unit, and needs to be reasonably involved in the selection of new leaders. A CO that questions an application is simply doing their job.

My Packs CO is a Baptist church of which Im a member. The CO does not require that our leaders be a member of the church or be Christian, but they have expressed that they are more comfortable if the Cubmaster or ACM is an active member of the church.

Our church uses Cub Scouting as a positive values-based outreach program to the community. With that in mind, they are interested in the quality and character of the leaders that deliver the program. A CO that rubber-stamps leadership applications is lazy and foolish.

Thanks for the responses. Our DE is nice, energetic fellow but seems a little frazzled at times. I suspect he has a tough job and would require someone who really enjoys Scouting to stay with it for an extended period of time. I also suspect it's hard for a professional to motivate a bunch of veteran Scouters who already "know everything that needs to be known."

Is it reasonable to expect a DE to show up for District Meetings in full uniform? Our DE never wears a full uniform, just a uniform shirt. I would think a professional would need to set an example regarding the uniform.

I'm sure this has been hashed out before, but humor this "inexperienced" Scouter a little bit.

What are the resposibilities of the District Executive?

We have a new DE in our district and I have no idea what he does. He does show up for District Roundtable and talk about popcorn, talk about membership numbers, recruiting, "signing the boys" up, but that's all I know about him.

I concur with the others. If he is already eleven and sixth grade, he has aged out and it's time for him to move on to Boy Scouts. There are consequences when we "quit" something and this will be a good lesson for him. Boy Scouts are more fun anyway and they will have more age appropriate activities for him.

Parents are a big factor in determining whether the boys are in Scouts because they see it as an additional burden on their time and money. Peer-to-peer is the most effective recruiting. Parents will consider Scouts if their sons friends are involved with it.

Kids will go to youth functions if they are invited by their friends. They dont like walking into a room filled with strangers. Scouting is no different.

The best method for recruiting is the oldest method: Invite your friends.

As the fundraising chairman for my Pack, I'm starting to see the "politics" concerning POPCORN. In our council, there is a quiet but strong message to units that says "you will sell popcorn or else."

The requirement to sell popcorn in order to receive "Quality Unit" is stupid and illogical. It runs counter to Scout Values. Will the QC patch say "100% Popcorn" along with the phrase "100% Boy's Life"? The QC award is over-rated to begin with and this just makes it worse.

Sorry but this sounds like an excuse to me. I think this because the Girl Scouts are made up of volunteers as welll and they seem to be able to handle the massive distribution of cookie units to customers.

The GS organization in the aggregate can handle massive distribution, but they are not going to sell their cookies at a few cents above cost.   

Wal-Mart is a poor comparison to argue for lower fundraiser prices.  The business model and purpose of Wal-Mart are entirely different than the purpose of a fundraiser.

Price point is always important, but I don't think $15 for a box of 15 bags of microwave popcorn is outrageous for a fundraiser.  Yes, it cost alot more than the grocery store, but it's a "fundraiser".  If the customer says no, go to the next. 

How often do you schedule campouts for your Webelos? Whats an acceptable number of camping trips and how much is too much? I will most likely be a Webelos Den Leader next year and I appreciate your thoughts.

Who collects forms at JSN? 

Any adult leader present and then forwards to our Cubmaster. 

Who checks them for accuracy and chases down parents who haven't paid when district is breathing down your neck to have them in?

Cubmaster or ACM

Who hands them into council?

Cubmaster or ACM

Who keeps the unit copy of the form?

Cubmaster

Who handles any new scouts that come in later?

Den Leaders typically handle the application process and turn them in to the Cubmaster.

Who handles rechartering in your pack?

Committee Chair, Cubmaster, and COR

Does anyone have a rule book (or cheat sheet) for membership chair and advancement chair?

Nope.  The Cub Scout Leader Handbook is used as our guide. 

If a pack has both has anyone had success with both using Packmaster?

Yes.  Our Cubmaster uses it religiously and it's a tremendous administrative time-saver.  I'm currently an ACM and I will be using it to take some admin duties off of our CM. 

It's good to schedule some organized activities at campouts with some free time along the way. Politely ask the leaders if "sitting around" is normal procedure on all of the campouts. If they answer "yes", then I would start looking for another Webelos Den.

You are not being unreasonable. Campouts are a great opportunity to work on outdoor skills, have an organized nature hike, play some group games, etc. They are not difficult to plan and are simple to implement.

Are the leaders new? Do they need some help planning? Ask them if you can be an Assistant Webelos Den Leader to help with campout planning. I'm sure they would appreciate it.

Folks understand that the popcorn prices are for fund-raising.  They understand that they are not solely buying the product, but supporting a program.  I say keep the prices on the high-side and sell fewer units rather than selling cheap and be burdened with a high volume of orders and deliveries to customers.

Quote by Calico:  Think Wal-Mart.  They sell known brand names of all kinds of items for less than a local store, or even other national chains, yet they make a lot of money. Why? Because they sell more of it. Why do they sell more of it? Because their prices are lower.

Wal-Mart is not a fundraising organization and they have the distribution infrastructure to handle their business model of stacking deep and selling cheap.  Scout Troops and Packs are made up of volunteers that do not have the infrastructure to handle massive distribution of popcorn units to customers.      

The traditional recruting methods don't work anymore in our city where the schools are no longer supportive of Cub Scouts.

Our Pack increased by about 20 boys this year but only 4 of those were from a School Night recruiting effort. If we hung our recruiting efforts only on "School Night" our Pack would be in serious decline.

We recruit by word of mouth and simply invite boys to join. In turn, the boys invite their friends to join. It's grassroots and it works. Parents tell us that they hear about us because we have a reputation for being active and actually doing "fun things".

Have all the leaders pitch in and buy him a Boy Scout uniform or an activity shirt. If he already has that, get him some personal camping gear.

You can get excellent results from hand-sewing. Secure the patch with a safety pin, use thread that matches or blends in with the patch background, and keep the stitches close together for a tight fit.

I have two uniform shirts one with hand-sewn patches and the other by sewing machine. Unless you take a close look, you cant tell the difference.

Whatever you do, avoid badge magic. Initially it will look fine, but the patches will eventually peal off and leave a residue on the uniform that cannot be removed.

(This message has been edited by Jeffrey H)

Neither is a boy a "Den Chief" by virtue of attending his little brother's campout. Den Chief is not a 1-day position.

You're right, it's usually not a short-term assignment.  However, he will be a "Den Chief" on this campout.  A Boy Scout who helps the Cubmaster and/or Den Leader with the Cub activities is by virtue a "Den Chief" for the duration that he performs his duties for the Pack.  I'm not aware of a minimum service time before you can call a Boy Scout a "Den Chief".

There is a Den Chief Service Award to encourage a minimum 1 year commitment to the Pack.

admin | IP:

The Quality Unit Award is a good award to recognize units that are doing their best to offer a fine Scout program.

The Quality Unit Award 100% Boys Life is an award that baffles me. It just comes across as a promotional billboard for Boys Life magazine just so National can find a way to make a little more money. It looks silly on a uniform, IMO. What incentive does a Pack or Troop have to try and obtain 100% Boys Life?

TwoSirius,

WELCOME TO CUB SCOUTS! You are a brave soul and to be commended.

You are asking the right questions. I started as an ADL and it gave me a chance to learn the Cub program without taking on too much. Really, what you need to do first is talk to your Den Leader and ask him the questions you are asking here. Your primary role as an ADL is to give the DL the support he/she needs. As Briantshore mentioned, check with your Den Leader and your Pack's library of leader books before you go out and make any purchases.

Wear the uniform. You're not just a "parent", you're a leader in the Den and the Pack. The uniform shows your commitment and sets a uniform example for the boys. I understand about cost and I've been there. If possible, purchase at least a uniform shirt for now. Yes, there are great deals on E-Bay for used uniforms (I have found some myself). Also, Thrift stores, Army/Navy stores are known to carry good used scout uniforms.

Training and Roundtables? You can never take too much and go when you can. I recommend University of Scouting (aka "Pow Wow") for some fun and helpful classes. In any case, the best training you will receive is the one you will get from your weekly Den meetings.

Enjoy and Have Fun!!

--Jeff

Our Bear Den rapidly grew from 9 boys to 21. Parents wanted to keep the Den together if possible. To manage this size of a Den, we decided to divide the den into 3 groups of 7 boys with a Den Leader for each group. The Den Leaders use the same meeting program. All groups meet on the same night at our Charter Organization and we are able to keep the Den together but keep it manageable. We also have 3 Den Chiefs that help out.

So far, it's working pretty well and we're having fun learning where we can make improvements. The key is to make sure you have a large meeting space.

Definitely include your ADL for input. They need to feel useful and a part of the deb program. In fact, let them take over a few times to give them confidence and experience.

Brianbuf,

I took a look at your website (www.savescouting.org) and I feel that much of what you have to say is based on your personal experiences. You might have some valid points, but your thoughts come across as emotional in nature. You have no real statistics or surveys to back up your grievances, just simply your personal opinion and preferences.

Maybe someday well go to a different uniform, but as I said above that will not be the determining factor for success and increased membership. Long-term, experienced adult volunteer leadership at the unit-level determines a successful and fun scouting program. Its very hard to find those that will be a leader, stay with it for the long-term, and do it with enthusiasm.

As a Cub Leader, I can say that the boys arent worried about who Akela is. They know the name means good leader and thats all they care about. I have yet to hear a parent or a Cub suggest that we change the Cub icons to superheroes. People know the organization does not base its foundation on the characters of Jungle Book. Boys like wild animals like Bobcats, Wolves, and Bears.

We do live in a world of change and change is inevitable. However, I do believe that people like things that dont change, they like good traditions, and they like organizations that are not easily influenced by the latest pop-culture trends. The BSA is that type of organization.

My thoughts on membership decline are in my previous post.

--Jeff

John,

What I meant to say is what you clarified in your post. No disagreement between us.

Have a good day,

Jeff

Brianbuf,

Changes in the uniform, badges, and icons will not help Scouting. If the boys believe in the organization, are having fun, getting outdoors, being challenged, then they will happily wear the uniform. Going to polo-style shirts will not keep up the membership. Scouting has always required a long-term commitment by adult leadership to be successful.

The BSA is currently losing numbers because it's values-based organization in a culture that is politically-correct and has very loose morals. Sadly, the Scout Oath and Law is an outdated concept for today's "cool" people. Now, we could change the BSA to be more like the rest of the culture, but I submit that droves of members would drop-out overnight. Why be a part of an oranization that has no purpose and core values? Heck, I don't need Scouting to go camping or get outdoors. I can do that myself.

Believe it or not, there is no BSA requirement that a Boy Scout must wear any kind of uniform to be an active member. Uniforms are recommended for a sense of identity and belonging to the organziation, but they are not required.

The only change I would make to the uniform is make the all the isignia smaller. Sometimes I feel like a "billboard", but that's just my preference and a minor issue.

YIS,

Jeff