jambo

To all the forums scouters who upheld his notion of not to have boys run the unit verses experienced trained adult leaders. Jambo most likely will be away for awhile in the hospital. When he returns he will jump into all the topics of discussian. Tobias Russo, former Asst. Scoutmaster, Commitee Chairman of one of the best units in the nation.

Eagle dad, and Gold winger, I appreciate your input. Yes ,we have a problem in todays Scouting. How do we solve that problem,? then I have to write a book on it or run a course on leadership...and then ,I have to throw away the notion for the boys to run their own troops. We need dedicated adult leaders with a vision, imagination, energy and love of kids. It would be nice to have council cooperating in recruiting boys from 10 1/2 years and up. Which at present time they are just involved to get the cubbing program running. A lot of cubbing program resemble the old Scouting program, where the adults guide in running the units. I hear that we have cub packs as large as 40 to 60 boys. Only 20% join a Troop, and then within a year 50% quite, because boys don't know how to run a unit. They get dissolutioned and join churches teen club, where it is run by religious dedicated adult leaders.

Barry, I respect your opinion...but you chastised me for not having my facts straight ?( I deserve an apology !) I feel that you never been in the trenches of Scouting...on professional level as I have, or a scoutmaster for 32 years, and maxed out at 90 boys in the troop, Our troop attended two National Jamboree, and one International at Calgary Canada. We went on a exchange program to England and Kandersteg Switzerland.. We had 20 Eagle Scouts and etc. I am getting closer and closer to 90 years of age...and soon you will have me on 'silent key ". Good Scoutmaster never die, they just pass away. If I can impart some wisdom, to you neophytes, it is you who have to carry the ball. Here is 3 cheers to Scouting, jambo

Eagle dad, and Mr. Nelson:

I think you missed my point, that I tried to bring out, I would suggest you read it again..." The real Scouting is dying, a slow death "...it refurbished into tigering, cubbing, and weblows. As I said before ,soon we we will have " diaper Scouts, and girls scouts will be the baby sitters ". Our rough and tough Boy Scouts units will be found and mentioned only in Boy Scouts museums. A few of the boys that will cross over from cubbing , will be joining " club for boys ", as I indicated before.So called" boy run " units, where the boys are ashamed to wear their class "A" uniformed, nor lead by axberienced adults., is going to be history . Since I spend more then 30 years, in many functions of Scouting, it hurts me, to see my beloved organization turning into demise. Oh, yes...we still have very few units that resemble the REAL Scouting units, but they going to go, as soon as the new leaders get trained on the philosphy of ' boy run ' consept. jambo

In response to Greg Nelson's critique of Jambo:

I respect your opinion, and I see where you are coming from. But, let's get real , cubing became a glorified 'baby sitting organization', you don't need to look for day care center, anymore , it is called tigers, and etc. We dress them up and parade the kids in front of the parents, and call it Scouting. If you look at the National statistics, only 40 % of former cubs join a real Scouting unit. And when that boy joins that unit, and see's the disorganization of so called "boy run" unit, he quits and joins an organized teen club at church, YMCA, or Boys Club.

Mr. Nelson, before you criticize, I would suggest you do some research. Long live Scouting spirit. jambo

We will have more irate parents, when they see the mess we made out of Scouting. Cubbing is not Scouting, but a baby sitting organization, run by Den mothers, Den leaders. In my oid days ,a boy went to become a weblow for one year, to get aquinted what Scouting .. Then he crossed over into real Scouting, and not the so called ''boy run''. boys club, where most of them don''t even wear the uniform. Scouting got watered down, to Tiger cubs, and soon we we will have '' Diaper Scouts ''(ha,ha,) Yes, dear Irate parent...there is something to be concerned.

What a response from the BSA cadre in reference to my experience with a Regional Scouting Executive, on the Eastern coast of USA. No mention of the salary they get on the National level.? No mention is made how much money a year is made by the Boy Scouts, Inc., on national level. Scouting on top is strictly administrative, they don''t even know that there is " boy " involved ? It is perpetual self supporting, and self financed organization ,for the benefit of the professional , and not trench loving volunteers. You, should be ashamed to quote your BSA Manuel, on the qualification to be a professional. I have been there, and never again ! jambo

Brianshore, most of the informaton is correct on this site. I had an executive who worked real high in Scouting , on the Regional level. His salery at that time was about $ 60,00 t0 $ 80.000. They worked him worse then a horse, 12-16 hours a day, and you never got any time off. You are responsible of recruiting new Council Executives. The most important thing is how well do you have skills in raising the finances. Scouting knowledge they would get in training courses. He told me, if he had a chance he would go into Airline busines or Corporate world, and not into BSA, Inc....jambo

GWD=scouter,

I sympathize your sincere effort to recruit Scouting. This is not done by the Council any more. They want each boy to be a recruiter, and they get a patch for it. I remember when I assisted running " school night for Scouting ". The Council executive would get permission from the principal to book the auditorium, to put on a show. I recruited Order of the Arrow, members and a dozen or so Eagle Scouts, in their class "A" Uniforms. The Scouts would put on skids on First Aid and etc. The MC was a Marine Sargent, who told the boys to grow up to be men, and join the adventure of Scouting ( not cubbing ). After the presentationt , we had a run on the recruiting table, we had 50 to 60 boys being excited to join Scouting. That was the good all days. Jambo

Howdy all, no this is not jambo's post, I received a few PMs from people who did not appreciate what he had to say. If interested, I copied it and can send it to any one who wishes to see it, then let me know what you think

OGE (This message has been edited by a staff member.)

( Jones of Kenntucky )In my past experience of running a very large BSA unit, I have noticed that some of the small town Scouting, are the best. The whole town would back the unit...providing that the Council does not break it up. in order to create a new units,... for the sake of the numbers ? If you are going to send your boys to join a Troop, make sure it has experienced adult leadership, and not run on the " boy run " concept ? Other wise all it will be is "BSA---baby sitting association " Keep that Scouting spirit...jambo

Volker, once again thanks for the info. What is this about " sod grass " placement ? Is that a new German techique to keep the water out of the tent ? Please educate me ! Sincerely, jambo

Barry, I have read your articles on this forum, and I see you were in the trenches as I have, trying to run a successful scouting program. I am not going to beat this " boy run'' / adult run/guided " program. to its demise . But I will tell you my experience just lately, attended a district fall camporee.

.....

During the camp assembly, there were 12 units of Scouts. Two units had 20+ scouts, with class "A" uniforms, and there leaders looked very well decorated and seemed very well organized. The rest of the units was a disgrace to the scouting movement. We had one obese lady ASM, in charge of six boys, with just about no one wearing a uniform. The rest of the overweight leaders, wore a Scout shirt with assorted colored pants ( red, yellow,blue ), the scouts looked about the same. The only ones that had a patrol flag was the ones with class" A " uniforms. But, generally speaking they all had fun. But, one can see which were adult run/guided, or the so called " boy run "

I feel sorry for the future of Scouting. Jambo

Volker mein Herr,

Thanks for the info...but what is the difference between the regular Kohte tent, and the ''super '' Kohte. I know the price difference ! Have you used any of them, and do you have negative or positive to say about them. " Aufwiedersehen " jambo

Mein Phadfinder Bruder Volker:

Thanks for the information...but I still could not find the " Kohte" tents...I found plenty of our American type tents. I hope Scouting is getting along fine in Germany. jambo

Barry: I was very much impresseded that you had 150 boys in your unit. When I had 90 boys in my unit the council told me to break it up, and form another unit. I don''t know how you got away ? The type of unit you had and maybe the type of the unit is only 10% of the National Statistics, 80% of the troops,( which boy run philosophy ) in the country , are 15-25 active scouts.( not what the rosters show ) When will the National wake up and repamp this failure program. jambo

Aquila: Woman don''t belong running the troop, nor sitting in at PLC meetings. The Scoutmaster and his SPL runs the Troop. Program is set up for the whole year with the rubber stamped by the PLC council. Once the boys leave the PLC meeting then the Troop is run by the Scoutmaster, SPL, Jasm''s...but definetly not by aggresive woman. jambo

Volker ! I have written to you in German , but you did not answer me ? Where can I can get that black kohte tents ? Hpe on hearing from you. jambo

Beaveh and Eagle dad, thanks for your comments. I think ''beaveh'' has been in the trenches. I went to most of the trainings courses and absorbed the philosophy of boy run. I could not understand why it would not work and I had only 18 boys in the unit. That''s when I came to awakening that there is no leadership, no motivation, no program, no activities and no enthusiasm. I had to modify the entire structure, not what that 14 year old PLC wanted, but what was exciting for the boy to be in Scouting. The Troop was run by JASM,

ASM''s and my self. We had brain storming sessions of what our kids wanted, and we executed it. Our membership grew form 20 to 40, and next year to 60. We had plenty of Eagle Scouts, and we got a Congressional mention. My thinking, on this is " It is better to have a boy stay longer in our movement, then see him leave in one year " This is not what ''boy run philosophy promotes. My suggestion, visit some large successful troops, and see that the so called ''guidance'', is really adult run. '' Scouting forever '' jambo

I tried sending you a letter in German...please let me know if you get ?

Mein Bruder-Pfadfinder,

Ich habe von Ihnen fr eine Weile nicht gehrt. Was ist im Kundschaften in Deutschland neu?. Sie haben Konkurrenz von anderer Organisation? Erhalten Sie Finanzhilfe von Ihrer Stadt oder dem Staat, oder privater Organisation, um Ihre Jugendorganisation zu fhren?. Sie stellte jeder Kontakt mit den amerikanischen Pfadfindern in Deutschland her? Ich wnsche Sie Erfolg, jambo

Sorry, guys...made an error in sending. jambo

Jones: I hope you got your cub scout pack of the ground. I just got the spring brochure on Scout equipment. I noticed they are promoting cub scout uniforms and per say cub oriented items. I have not seen one Boy Scout in their class ''A'' uniform in the catalog. Is the BSA, Inc. discouraging of wearing class '' A ''s ?. I have seen many class ''B'' Boy Scout

uniform advertisements. Maybe, I will see some in the Autumns or the Winter issues. It bothers me that Scouting, ages 11-17 is not being promoted.I guess, Cubing is becoming more successful , because it is not boy run. " Keep it simple, make it fun " jambo-USA

Jones: I hope you got your cub scout pack of the ground. I just got the spring brochure on Scout equipment. I noticed they are promoting cub scout uniforms and per say cub oriented items. I have not seen one Boy Scout in their class ''A'' uniform in the catalog. Is the BSA, Inc. discouraging of wearing class '' A ''s ?. I have seen many class ''B'' Boy Scout

uniform advertisements. Maybe, I will see some in the Autumns or the Winter issues. It bothers me that Scouting, ages 11-17 is not being promoted.I guess, Cubing is becoming more successful , because it is not boy run. " Keep it simple, make it fun " jambo

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Jones: I hope you got your cub scout pack of the ground. I just got the spring brochure on Scout equipment. I noticed they are promoting cub scout uniforms and per say cub oriented items. I have not seen one Boy Scout in their class ''A'' uniform in the catalog. Is the BSA, Inc. discouraging of wearing class '' A ''s ?. I have seen many class ''B'' Boy Scout

uniform advertisements. Maybe, I will see some in the Autumns or the Winter issues. It bothers me that Scouting, ages 11-17 is not being promoted.I guess, Cubing is becoming more successful , because it is not boy run. " Keep it simple, make it fun " jambo

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Jones: I hope you got your cub scout pack of the ground. I just got the spring brochure on Scout equipment. I noticed they are promoting cub scout uniforms and per say cub oriented items. I have not seen one Boy Scout in their class ''A'' uniform in the catalog. Is the BSA, Inc. discouraging of wearing class '' A ''s ?. I have seen many class ''B'' Boy Scout

uniform advertisements. Maybe, I will see some in the Autumns or the Winter issues. It bothers me that Scouting, ages 11-17 is not being promoted.I guess, Cubing is becoming more successful , because it is not boy run. " Keep it simple, make it fun " jambo

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