andrews

KoreaScouter,

I apologize if I misunderstood your post.

As to the purpose of public schools, you need to look at their origins, especially in Prussia of the late 1800s.

Whether it sounds like a conspiracy theory is irrelevant. Their purpose is far from what some claimed. They certainly aren't doing a good job created an intelligent populace.

- "Just because you are paranoid doesn't mean someone isn't out to get you." :)

Brad

Given that they cover such a wide range of areas, what would be wrong with using them as a significant part of the curriculum? While some subjects would need to be supplimented (math, science in some areas, etc.), their wide coverage, and extensive amount of writing would expose a boy to a lot of different things.

Brad

I wish you were, because me sons could have a lot more when they hit Eagle, since they will be well over the Eagle badges, but the requirements specify 3 months per palm, not 3 months for the next batch.

If you could get any number 3 months after eagle, every 3 months after that you should be able to get another batch, and that is not what is written.

Some website I saw a while back had a calculation of the most palms a Scout could get, and that included a comment about needing to turn Eagle at a certain point (12 or 14 I recall) to "max out" on palms.

Brad

Among other things:

However, I would submit to you that disparaging public schools (our local governments), and at the same time, encouraging completion of Citizenship in the Community and repeating the Oath, probably warrants at least a look in the mirror...

I completely disagree. Helping make my country better does not require me to sacrifice my children in a system that is designed to produce meek and mild servants to the government state. (See its origins in 19th century Prussia.)

I am doing my part to train a new generation of leaders who will (hopefully) help influence society for the better. And the evidence is that homeschoolers, in general, make more responsible adults who will then be able to have a positve effect on society.

If being a Scout required blind worship of a faulty government school system, I would turn all my awards in tomorrow, including my Eagle!

The government does a wide variety of things I oppose. Part of being a good citizen lies in speaking out against such injustices, not in blind observence of them.

Brad

Is the WDL compelled to provide a "program" for 1-3 remaing Weblos? I don't think so. All my den crossed over at the same time, but a den the year before had a few boys occasionally going to the leader's house to get things signed off.

I suspect the comment above about "waiting to sign things off until school was out" referred to signing of Boy Scout requirements, which they couldn't earn until they were truly Boy Scouts, not just "visiting" Webelos.

Brad

I am the only MB counselor in the house, and we have done few merit badges together. I "picked" Citizenship in the Community, Nation and World, Hiking and Camping. Both my sons did camping with someone else, and the youngest worked on CitW at merit badge college. I did do CitC with both of them, along with one or two other scouts (it was supposed to be a group of six or so) and CitW with the oldest, along with another scout who was redoing things from a previous MB college.

We plan on working on hiking together this spring, but since they both already have swimming, it is an "elective."

Getting them to call, and work with other counselors is painful at times, but I think that is worth it as well.

Brad

The original issue would only be worth consideration if they never worked on any badges with other scouts/counselors.

We don't heavily focus on it, but the merit badges are part of the work for my two boys. They have already done more merit badges than most, and may even get them all before they are done. Given that most boys don't do any more than required for Eagle, if even that many, I don't see the problem.

Both my boys have participated in merit badge college, summer camp, winter camp, and troop activities extensively. I don't see any conflict in this case.

Brad

At least you have the opportunity to pick a different school in that case! Try that without paying any tuition and being assigned to a specific government school.

Brad

I prefer to call them government schools, which is what they are since they are government controlled, guided, etc. (They nod to parental involvement, but if you stand against their programs you will see how quickly you are not really in charge.)

Brad

It is still a high percentage. In most places I would guess that more than 80% of the people use the government schools.

It would be interesting to see if Scouting parents are really different. I would guess they would be slightly different since they tend to be more active in their children's lives. (No guarantees on that of course.) And it is likely that the more active you are in a child's life, the more likely you are to seriously consider homeschooling.

Of course that doesn't mean a majority of anything will homeschool, but the numbers are certainly growing in the overall population, and most likely in Scouts as well. You don't have to have a majority to be growing or even a sizeable number.

Brad

An interesting commentary on "government schools."

http://www.lewrockwell.com/orig2/m-davis1.html

Brad

In the Venture specific training course this weekend the topic of paintball and lazertag came up. The instructor said the reason these were "prohibited" by the G2SS was that it involved pointing a weapon at another scout. That made more sense to me than any "danger" aspect. Someone may have said this before online, but I finally caught it.

Brad

Sctmom,

I would agree that just about anyone could homeschool, but for many (most?) private schooling is too expensive, or at least they aren't willing/able to sacrifice for it.

Those people who "make their own choice" are still working outside the law, and liable for major trouble if caught. We need to open the system up to true, and open, competition.

Brad

OGE,

Most of what I am referring to centers around parents who disagree with much of the "lifestyle training" they are pushing these days, like that embracing homosexuality as a valid choice, or passing out condoms at the school. Related to this would be those who dare raise issues about evolution, whether it is one of Intelligent Design or "even worse" a young-earth creation focus.

They have put out guide books of how to discount such parents, marginalize them, and basically push them out of the system.

Of course there are exceptions, as was noted.

It is a messed up system overall. Good teachers have to fight the system just as much as many parents. I say that we should separate school from state and let people choose the education for their own children. Monopolies are never good for choice, and until alternatives are freely available the monopoly will get away with very poor service, or worse.

Brad

I used to be in favor of every teacher raise proposal I heard of, but I am a lot more skeptical today.

You would need to remove the power of the teachers' unions first, and reduce some of the false barriers to being a teacher. Then those you mentioned might be able to teach. You would also have to restore the ability to remove a poor teacher.

The parent-teacher relationship is a two way street, and many teachers' ed ongoing course focus on keeping parents from being involved, especially when it comes to some of the more controversial elements they are pushing in the education system today.

Many teachers are doing an outstanding job in spite of the system and the environment.

Brad

I wouldn't sweat the details as much right away, give yourself some time to get into the swing of things. A few meetings will go very well, while a few others will bomb completely. The key is to make it fun for the boys, and "sneak in" advancement while they are having fun.

Don't lecture, but get them to participate as much as possible.

The actual work for rank doesn't need to take that long, and they don't have to get all the badges, so you have plenty of time to work with all you can.

The toughest thing is that you will lose some boys, and likely get a few new ones later on.

One thing I would do differently is to have the boys more active in preparing and presenting the program. That is what they are headed for in Boy Scouts, so get them started doing it as soon as you can.

You can and will make it!

Brad

I wasn't disputing that parental inolvement wasn't vitally important - it certainly is!

As to the values, I don't really want to charge down that one, but I recall you having a much more open view of homosexuality, for example, than I, and therefore I don't think things in the school that told children homosexuality was a "fine alternative choice" would bother you much, while I would disagree greatly.

I teach my children, to the best of my abilities, to always respect others, even those who are disagreeable or who practice things we completely oppose.

Brad

Public schools share no blame for not doing their job? What do we hold them accountable for then, if not teaching the basics?

Sctmom, you probably don't see "an agenda" because you agree with a good portion of it (based on your posts here). If they are teaching what you agree with, it would seem well and good.

I do believe that education will change, with many bumps, over the next few decades. The mass production model does a good job producing "citizens" for the welfare/warfare state (started in Prussia), but it doesn't do a good job of educating people.

Brad

My wife does the primary teaching, largely because she is at home the most since she has no job outside the home. (But she does have a large one in it.)

While I make decent money, we could really use another income about now, but we continually decide that even a part time job for her is not worth it.

She does border on "going nuts" at times, and I need to be sensitive to that, and fill in whenever I can.

Brad

It says "show improvement" not "improve in every area."

I could even live with it if say the running score was a few seconds slower, but he could do forty situps instead of twenty at the start.

The tested items should be taken as a group, not as distinct elements.

Brad

Scoutmom,

Just so you know, we have 3 (and maybe 4) ADHD children (out of 4), and my wife is managing to do a quite reasonable job. Certainly better than they would be in a "formal" school setting. And we are without the drugs as well.

Obviously it would be a major jump, and I wouldn't force you into it, even if I could, but I wanted to let you know it can be done with ADHD children.

Brad

The name bothered me, and I am about as un-PC as you can get!

I would guess the name meant to differentiate between those from India and those from the Americas. I don't know that it will matter as much if you are doing it in Scotland, but I would (personally) try to fit something descriptive without the connotations.

Brad

According to the training materials, a chartering organization usually picks a COR witch then picks a CC and the rest of a committee. The committee than does a search for a SM.

However, in starting a new troop, having someone with the drive to want to be a Scoutmaster would seem to be paramount. I know in the troop we will be starting this year at our church I am the major driving factor, with the pastor's full blessing. I will be SM, not COR or CC. We are a bit different in that the church sees the troop as an active part of its outreach to the community, but even with our current troop, which I started two years ago just before my oldest son bridged over from Webelos, findiing a volunteer to be SM was the key that got the troop going, not the other way around. We did have a "sister" pack that most of the original troop leadership came from which is sponsored by the same CO.

I would be interested in comments on how it usually works out "in the real world."

Brad

I realize (and the next generation of Roosters may fall into this category) that not everybody can home school, even if they wanted to do so.

I would disagree with this statement and say that almost anyone could homeschool, but many people cannot do it at the committment level they are ready to make. A wide range of tools are available to help accomplish the task. (Almost too wide a range.)

Most people don't want to change their lives enough to do it, nor would I command them to do so. But I am completely convinced almost anyone could do it, though it would take sacrifices.

Some single parents even do it, though that situation makes it very hard.

NOTE: This is not to say everyone who doesn't homeschool is bad, evil, or whatever. It is just to say that it has matured enough that almost anyone could do it, with some hard dedication. We have been doing it 6 years and dedication is still required.

I do question those who trust even "good" public schools to spend more time with their children than they do, but its a free country. (Though I remain completely in favor of the separation of school and state!)

Brad

Correct me if I am wrong, but wasn't it LV who said God was a figment of our imaginations, or something like that?

If so, how could he "worship as his ancestors did," and not believe in God? They believed in a Great Spirit - God.

Brad