Glenn

I found this thread interesting. As someone who signed up last March to be an ASM, I was looking forward to helping out as much as possible. However, other than attending committe meetings and all but one campouts, I haven't done too much.

The SM did suggest training this spring. Hopefully, after that, I can become more involved with the boys.

I know I said I would not get in a religious debate on a Scouter forum. However, anytime the Catholic Church is slighted, I will respond.

Evmori, I feel sorry for you that you did not learn the Catholic faith as it is truly taught. I know I was confused until 2 years ago when I decided to truly investigate the Catholic Church (even after 12 years of Catholic schooling).

In any case, I have never prayed to a statue. I do pray to the person whom the statue represents in hope they will intercede on my behalf with God. I also pray directly to God. If a person is in Heaven with God, what is wrong with asking for them to intercede. Have you ever asked a friend to pray for you? If so, what is the difference? Also, do you not have pictures of friends and relatives to remind you of them? The same with the statues we Catholics have.

Lastly, Jesus talked to the dead (remember Moses and Elijah in Matt. 17:3). And He asked us to act like Him in all ways.

Thanks OGE for joining in. I just wanted to say that I am one Catholic that is grateful for Martin Luther. As you said, the Church was practicing abuses and was NOT following the faith as it was taught by the Apostles and early Church fathers. I only wish he could have brought about the changes you mentioned without splitting off.

I also believe that if he didn't go as far as he did, by removing books from the Bible (and changing verses!), then we could have seen a reconcilliation shortly after the split. But he became so anti-Catholic that it was impossible.

Sctmom, thanks for the story. I have heard that before (anti-Catholic teaching in some protestant churches). But it does surprise me that it still occurs today. As a Catholic, we are taught that all Christians can get to Heaven. I only wish that all Christians would work together to get America back to its Christian roots.

You're correct that the term "Catholic Church" was not in use during the first century as it was just beginning. But the Church was ruled by Saint Peter and his successive Popes have led the Church through the years. Here is the list http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/12272b.htm

Constantine was not a Pope, of course. As I said before, he simply stopped the persecutions of Catholics and allowed Christianity to grow enormously. I will NOT get into a religious argument with you on a Scouter forum, especially since your beliefs about morality so closely resemble mine.

By the way, I truly admire your dedication to your faith that you have demonstrated on this forum. I am sorry I was not following closely during the gay agenda and atheist arguments. I would have backed you up on every post (that I have read so far - still trying to catch up).

Dedicated Dad,

The Catholic Church (we prefer not to refer to it as the Roman Catholic Church as this was meant to be an insult when it first came into use) was started with the first Pope Peter. And we have a line of popes from Peter up to the present day. Constantine removed the persecutions of the Catholics of his day and the Church grew considerably at that time.

By the way, I too found it interesting that a non-Catholic church used the Apostle's Creed. Mostly because the creed we recite at Mass includes the belief in the Communion of Saints, which I believe is only part of the Catholic Church. I then went to the Catholic Encyclopedia and read of the history of the Nicene Creed. The original version did NOT have the communion of saints. Thanks for teaching me more about my faith.

Dedicated Dad,

Thanks for pointing out that the Brighid statement was some type of pagan statement. I had no idea. By the way, I agree with your response to it also!

Maybe I didn't express my point very well. The troop held a regular meeting, but when it came to patrol time, they made sure they reviewed knots with the Webelos. Then when game time came, they made sure the game included the 11/12 year olds. In other words, a regular game of tag football wouldn't be appropriate, but the game where numbers are called out and you race to grab some item in the middle would be.

Thanks for the interesting post. I don't know how I missed that news since I grew up in the Youngstown area and still live about 60 miles from there. As a non-hunter, I usually skip that section (hunting/fishing) of the newspaper. I guess I need to call up some old friends still living over there to see if they bagged a vest.

As the Webelos Den Leader who led 5 boys to crossover last year, I made it a point that all 5 boys visit two troops, preferably three. I asked the parents to strongly consider their son's choice when picking the troop (one father told me his son was definitely going to the closest troop regardless of what the boy wanted).

After each visit, I asked the boys how they liked the meeting/troop. The one visit where the troop centered their meeting around the Webelos' visit, and the parents received a talk separately from the Scoutmaster stood out in the boys' minds. The boy scouts taught the Webelos some knots and played games that the younger boys could actively participate in.

The one visit where the boys were bored was where the Scoutmaster spent the entire time (1:30) talking to the parents AND boys about the troop policy.

Finally, when we visited the troop that I initially wanted my son to join, the boy scouts did give their attenttion to the Webelos but the parents were left standing around. Needless to say, I did not push this troop on my son because I felt the adult committment might not be there.

So to answer the original question, when Webelos are visiting your troop, make sure the activities involve the Webelos and are age appropriate. Include knots (a staple of boy scouting) and other like activity. Be sure to include the game time. And also have a separate talk with the parents.

How do you actually sew the patch on the shirt pocket. I told my wife that it would be preferable for my son to sew his patches, but she told me it is a hard task for her to sew the rank badges (on the front pocket). Since I am sewing illiterate, I left it go.

But is this a tough task? Do you simply loop the thread around the edge of badge and then through the badge? Is my wife being too "motherly"?

Here is a joke that I seem to get every year. But it always makes me smile.

The Christmas Party

FROM: Pat Lewis, Human Resources Director

DATE: December 1

RE: Christmas Party

I'm happy to inform you that the company Christmas Party will take place on December 23, starting at noon in the banquet room at Luigi's Open Pit Barbecue. No-host bar, but plenty of eggnog! We'll have a small band playing traditional carols...feel free to sing along. And don't be surprised if our CEO shows up dressed as Santa Claus!

FROM: Pat Lewis, Human Resources Director

DATE: December 2

RE: Christmas Party

In no way was yesterday's memo intended to exclude our Jewish employees. We recognize that Chanukah is an important holiday which often coincides with Christmas, though unfortunately not this year. However, from now on we're calling it our "Holiday Party." The same policy applies to employees who are celebrating Kwanzaa at this time. Happy now?

FROM: Pat Lewis, Human Resources Director

DATE: December 3

RE: Holiday Party

Regarding the note I received from a member of Alcoholics Anonymous requesting a non-drinking table ... you didn't sign your name. I'm happy to accommodate this request, but if I put a sign on a table that reads "AA Only" you wouldn't be anonymous anymore. How am I supposed to handle this? Somebody?

FROM: Pat Lewis, Human Resources Director

DATE: December 7

RE: Holiday Party

What a diverse company we are! I had no idea that December 20 begins the Muslim holy month of Ramadan, which forbids eating, drinking and sex during daylight hours. There goes the party! Seriously, we can appreciate how a luncheon this time of year does not accommodate our Muslim employees' beliefs. Perhaps Luigi's can hold off on serving your meal until the end of the party -- the days are so short this time of year -- or else package everything for take-home in little foil swans. Will that work? Meanwhile, I've arranged for members of Overeaters Anonymous to sit farthest from the dessert buffet and pregnant women will get the table closest to the restrooms. Did I miss anything?

FROM: Pat Lewis, Human Resources Director

DATE: December 8

RE: Holiday Party

So December 22 marks the Winter Solstice...what do you expect me to do, a tap-dance on your heads? Fire regulations at Luigi's prohibit the burning of sage by our "earth-based Goddess-worshipping" employees, but we'll try to Accommodate your shamanic drumming circle during the band's breaks. Okay?

FROM: Pat Lewis, Human Resources Director

DATE: December 9

RE: Holiday Party

People, people, nothing sinister was intended by having our CEO dress up like Santa Claus! Even if the anagram of "Santa" does happen to be "Satan," there is no evil connotation to our own "little man in a red suit." It's a tradition, folks, like sugar shock at Halloween or family feuds over the Thanksgiving turkey or broken hearts on Valentine's Day. Could we lighten up?

FROM: Pat Lewis, Human Resources Director

DATE: December 10

RE: Holiday Party

Vegetarians!?!?!? I've had it with you people! We're going to keep this party at Luigi's Open Pit Barbecue whether you like it or not, so you can sit quietly at the table furthest from the "grill of death," as you so quaintly put it, and you'll get your damn salad bar, including hydroponics tomatoes. But you know, they have feelings, too. Tomatoes scream when you slice them. I've heard them scream. I'm hearing them scream right now!

FROM: Teri Bishops, Acting Human Resources Director

DATE: December 14

RE: Pat Lewis and Holiday Party

I'm sure I speak for all of us in wishing Pat Lewis a speedy recovery from her stress-related illness and I'll continue to forward your cards to her at the sanitarium. In the meantime, management has decided to cancel our Holiday Party and give everyone the afternoon of the 23rd off with full pay.

Sctmom,

That is wonderful. It sounds like your community is even more conservative than mine. I was commenting to my wife at the beginning of the school year at how restrictive the rules were (and I was glad). This is a public school. Skirts had to be below the hands (when the arms are extended downward, thank you). No body piercings other than the ear LOBE. No underwear showing (i.e. no baggy pants). Etc. If the ACLU ever got a hold of these rules, there goes the neighberhood.

As far as the Christmas season, almost all correspondence from the teachers to parents have used the word Christmas (i.e. Christmas gift exchange, Christmas party, etc). Since I work for a company where all middle level managers and above were told a few years ago to use Happy Holidays, it is refreshing to hear Merry Christmas from public employees.

Our policy is very similar to AdvanceOn. During all of our board of reviews, the adults do the uniform inspection. Up to and including First Class, we allow khaki pants (but NOT jeans). After that, we require the official boy scout pants.

The boys are required to wear their class A shirt to the weekly meetings (except for the summer months - then class B uniform short is OK). Only pants not allowed are sweats. We have never sent a boy home because of their dress, but because the other boys tease them (oh, oh - is that hazing?), they generally do not come dressed improperly again.

I like the above policy. Requiring the boy scout pants for first year scouts is a little too stringent for my taste. Since it is easier to have a boy wear a shirt that is too large, then the parents can buy a shirt that lasts a few years. Pants are a different story. They have to fit or else they fall down. So the parents would be buying a pair every year.

By the way, what are BDU pants?

Instead of wasting money by using information, try using the Yellow Pages available online at most of the search engines. I did and found this listing:

Boy Scouts of America-Ventura County Council

509 East Daily Drive, Camarillo, CA 93010

(805) 482-8938

Hope this helps!

My son's scout troop never wears their Class A uniform on hikes/weekend camping. However, the scoutmaster does ask each boy to wear their class B uniform (specific T-shirt with Troop logo and ANY pants). I have seen other troops do this also and the troop does stand out. Therefore, it is easily recognized as a boy scout troop (at least once close enough to read the logos).

FScouter,

I have to admit, that was a great comparison. However, as a Catholic, I am hoping you exaggerated your feelings on this. If not, and would like to know why the priest made those statements, I would be glad to explain. However, since this is not a religious forum, it will have to be in private email or I can direct you to a Catholic forum with a thread that tackled this question.

In fact, let me do that now.

http://www.catholic-forum.com/dcforum/apologetics/252.html

I like Rooster's definition. Just like the boy who cried wolf, their overuse of the word has made the word meaningless. Please note that his definition included the phrase those who do not approve of homosexual behavior and/or support homosexual causes and did not mention disliking the homosexual person themself.

Eisely,

Thanks. Especially now that I know I am supposed to be confused, I feel better about how I spend most of my life!

The last few posts have me totally confused. When my son was in cub scouts and I served as the den leader, the only people who showed up for the committee meetings were the cubmaster and other den leaders. Are you saying that we never had a valid vote? I can understand the need for checks and balances, but this seems unworkable.

Now that my son joined Boy Scouts and I am an assistant Scoutmaster, there are parents who simply wish to be committee members. But all of our assistant Scoutmasters participate in votes here also (our Scoutmaster is busy running the boy's meeting so he does not participate).

After reading this, I am going to ask at the next committee meeting if the assistant scoutmasters should NOT be allowed to vote. Where can I see the official BSA rules on this?

Fscouter,

Interesting. In my previous post I was referring to whether the file folder "within" the forum was green or yellow. If green, then new posts have been added.

But I also only enter those forums with a lit light bulb. Perhaps I have been missing some posts? I'll have to have a closer look.

Eisely,

You're right. The thread does show zero replies. I never noticed because I always look to the icon on the left to determine if there was any activity on a thread since I last looked.

Pwlane,

I get nothing when I type in that address.

Personally speaking, I would be more comfortable for my son to camp out where a female scouter was attending than allowing my daughter to a campout where a male leader was there.

Yes, it sounds sexist, but I trust females over males. I did not realize the Girl Scouts allowed males on sleep overs. My daughter's troop has always specified female adults only for any overnight trip. And I have always appreciated this.

I am in total agreement with Rooster, Mike Long, MrScout, and any others who see this behavior as immoral and would teach boys that it is acceptable.

One of the problems in America is we have become afraid to judge sins. We have been taught (brainwashed) to not comment or judge other people's actions. It wasn't too long ago where this type of behaviour was looked upon negatively. Therefore, it didn't happen too often. Now, since we are not "supposed" to comment on this, or even accept this, it is becoming all too common.

Sctmom,

I also cannot condone the actions of the leaders that you mentioned. Luckily, I have not witnessed any of that type of behavior in my 6 years of my son's participation in Scouts. If I did, I would have to say something to these people.

Like Rooster, I totally support the BSA policy. As a Catholic, I believe that engaging in homosexual behavior is a sin. However, I am also told to hate the sin, love the sinner. Therefore, if the gay leader is not openly practicing, I have no problem with their continued leadership. I believe the BSA policy is directed to those leaders who actively show/promote their homosexuality. In this case, they are teaching immoral behavior and should not be leaders of boys.

In the same vein, I believe if a heterosexual person is living with a girl/boyfriend, and actively promotes this behavior (by sharing a tent on campouts), then they should not be leaders either, nor allowed to attend campouts.