GaHillBilly

As some one with severe allergies in the family, I carry an epinephrine amp and a syringe in our kit at all times. I'll use it on my family members, according to my own judgment. I'll use it on Scouts or Scouters, per 911 counsel, unless there's clear evidence of anaphylaxis and difficulty reaching medical emergency staff via a cell. But . . . you may want to look into the quick dissolve Benadryl formulations that can be used sublingually. Not only does this side step problems with pills and nausea, it will tend to be faster acting than the pills. GaHillBilly

Brent, just to avoid a distracting side issue, I'll try to clear up the differences between the EPA and G2SS sanitation. 1) EPA recommends boiling OR chlorination; G2SS calls for boiling AND chlorination. This is why I referred to it as a "belt AND suspenders" approach. The G2SS "AND" complicates the process greatly, without adding much to safety. 2) The EPA's chlorination method includes settling and filtering; G2SS does not. Without getting into water treatment tech too much, this is a hugely significant difference. The chlorination of dirty, unsettled and unfiltered water is VERY

"It can't be that complicated if millions have been able to understand it for almost 100 years." You ask this, in a thread about how BSA rules make Scouting more difficult?? Bob, you are practicing an 'evidence-free' approach to truth! You claim that BSA rules are easy to understand and follow, yet when you are asked a simple and common question, you cannot point to a simple and definitive answer. Even worse, you get the ANSWER to the question WRONG, yourself! You make the claim quoted above, which assumes that ALL Scouts and Scouters have found the rules easy and helpful, in th

"But to say I want to see a specific document that says specifically XYZ, well things are not always documented the way you see them in your head." . . . which is the long way round of saying what I said in my original post . . . The LTP questions is one of many *basic* questions are NOT answered clearly and specifically in BSA literature, but have to be 'teased out' of a complex and dispersed body of regulations, standards, and guides. FScouter is correct, however. I wasn't really looking for the answers. I already know one of them. I don't know the other, but I'm pret

"1) Yes probably, the requirements for the Local Tour Permit say that any unit event away from the regular meeting site would require you to file . . . The only real exception I am aware of is a patrol activity when no adults will be present and no vehicles are involved. Since none of the permits sections would be applicable. 2) Yes, not filing the permit can have a definite bearing on liability protection. . ." Uh . . . you're not 'following the rules': I asked for a citation, with document name AND page number. What I'm looking for is the specific official BSA text, identi

OK; fair enough. But do this for me, please. Identify precisely which SINGLE document (page #, please) answers these two often asked and basic questions: (1) Is an LTP *required* for a local area, non-overnight troop trip or activity, and if so, precisely when and under what circumstances is it required? (2) If such an activity or trip takes place without an LTP, does the lack of an LTP have any DIRECT impact on whether the activity or trip is covered under the "BSA General Liability Insurance" policy, and if so what is the impact, and what triggers it? GaHillBilly

Reading through this thread, it becomes evident that many of the perceived obstacles created by BSA rules actually can be worked around, in one way or another. But, what's also clear is that doing so requires an extensive understanding of the details of the rules, as well as an active awareness of which requirements are actually rules, and which are troop or council custom! It seems to me that this 'need for knowledge' is the real barrier. In order for adult leaders to navigate 'the rules' successfully, they are going to have to do a LOT of reading, and a fair amount of real thinking abou

Darn, I wasn't thinking! There IS specific official BSA confirmation that the "native" requirement is intended to be interpreted precisely as I did, in the BSA video on that requirement. You can view it here: http://www.scouting.org/boyscouts/rankvideo/ By the way, these videos clear up a LOT Of questions I've had about precisely what is required or intended, and how some of the requirements should be met. I haven't watched them all yet. My son has done so, and to my surprise, thinks they are very helpful, possibly because the videos put the BSA on our side in the recent and unfruitf

LongHaul wrote, "if you think that is the intent of the BSA concerning this requirement? The effort involved in "weeding out" (pun intended) the invasive and/or non-native would warrant a mention in Scoutmaster specific training." I'm not sure what dialect of English is *native* to you, but in current American Standard dialect, "native", when applied to to plants or animals is a synonym of "indigenous", and thus excludes non-native plants, regardless of whether they are invasive or not. (The issue of invasive plants does show up, in rather substantial form, in some of the MBs Scouts are

Recently, my son participated in a 'nature walk' during which the ASM checked off my son's patrol on their first class plant ID requirement. Unfortunately, of the 13 plants he selected, 6 were non-native and 2 of those were invasive. Worse, he misidentified 5 of the 12 plants, going so far as to 'correct' (incorrectly) my son's identification of two of those plants. My son got the message, and shut up. Obviously such an effort, no matter how well-meaning, does injury to the Scouts involved. The effect on my son is minimal, other than to teach him a further lesson in not trusting, without

Addendum to the above . . . I should add that probably the SM originally thought he *did* want me to be involved with the troop. But if so, it would have been an idea he liked better than the reality, once my plans began to step on his last minute plans. GaHillBilly

GoldWinger wrote: "As a former advancement chair I'd have to say that the signed blue card is far more important. Just like the signed Handbook is more important than the rank card." That's good to know. They ought to add that info to the BSA "Handbook for Parents of New Scouts". ;-) Again, thanks for all the information and help. As we move forward, much of this will be valuable. Unfortunately, in my son's case it won't help with past work. The problem is that, because the troop wasn't doing advancement activities, I was the one that worked with my son, and checked him off on

John-in-KC wrote: "Many times Scouts become active again after dropping from other units because of other interests, moving within the community, or relocating to another part of the country. Youth who were members of a "dropped" unit also may become active again." Thanks for your information -- it's very helpful. But, based on the quote above, it sounds like my son needs to affiliate (join) with another troop post-haste, lest he be dropped and have to re-register. Is that right? GaHillBilly

Beavah wrote: "Once da record has been entered into ScoutNet (either directly online by the troop or by the council registrar), that's the official record." OK, I'm still learning. It seems everyone agrees that ScoutNet is it, right? And, other records may be the basis of a submission to ScoutNet, but once it's in ScoutNet, the rank or MB is final. And, until it IS in ScoutNet, it's just a gleam in the Scout's eye. Right? Questions: 1. Are only completed ranks and MBs recorded in ScoutNet, or are partials ever recorded? 2. Can the troop advancement person enter Sco

Hm-m-mh. The light dawns . . . Eyes are opened . . . My cynicism is renewed . . . + I read the form. + I have an SM who's VERY motivated by Council / District awards + After being very puzzled about it, I now have a working hypothesis as to why an SM would want an recently approved ASM (me) to (a) propose less, and do less with the troop, AND to (b) go through BLT and SMST. See #1 on the form. + Likewise, I have a working hypothesis as to why a SM, who'd initially approved the idea of working with the 4 older boys to get them through 1st class, suddenly reversed, and wanted

*** CAUTION *** CAUTION *** CAUTION *** *** READ THIS >> BEFORE

Beavah wrote: "Yah GaHillBilly, you're wise beyond your years!" Nah, you just don't know how many years we've got! ;-)

Beavah wrote (in less abbreviated fashion): "I'd sit down with 'em over a beverage and explain all the . . . In turn I'd listen carefully . . . Yeh all have to be on the same page . . . . . . listening and hearin' 'em respectfully as colleagues." When I saw the thread, I was thinking of 'how much commitment' it took from an SM or other volunteer. I guess that's why I picked up on your comments. Well, that, and the fact that not doing this sort of communication is pretty much where the problems are arising here locally. The lead ASM told me this past weekend, on the campout, that

Gunny2862 wrote: "Perhaps it could be set as a decision guide with a positive slant rather than just a rehash of problems we have most likely all found when we started. Collaborative effort? New thread? Finished product might even go in my new parent orientation packet!" That sounds like a great idea! What might work would be a set of 'originators' like myself who are new to Scouting, and a set of 'commentators' like LisaBob who are experienced. I want to do this, in part, because I didn't do it for competitive USS age-group swimming. My wife and I still remember how bewilder

Gunny2862 wrote: "Perhaps it could be set as a decision guide with a positive slant rather than just a rehash of problems we have most likely all found when we started. Collaborative effort? New thread? Finished product might even go in my new parent orientation packet!" That sounds like a great idea! What might work would be a set of 'originators' like myself who are new to Scouting, and a set of 'commentators' like LisaBob who are experienced. I want to do this, in part, because I didn't do it for competitive USS age-group swimming. My wife and I still remember how bewilder

Lisabob asked: "I'd really like to see your list of things you wish you'd known before joining a troop. I think it could be quite instructive for people who are looking for troops now (keeping in mind, of course, that no troop is perfect!)." I planned to do so, in part because I think the list would be much better after I got criticism and correction from y'all. But, I don't have it finished yet, even in preliminary form. I just have some notes. Such a list probably should be in its own thread, or maybe even threads. However, I've put two example points below. GaHillBilly

Gunny2862 asked: "How was the weekend and did it clarify any thoughts you were having?" My son and I found the weekend 'challenging' -- he was trying to complete the 1st class cooking requirements, and was assigned the "adult" patrol. He's cooked for us at home, and even on camping trips, but delivering hot meals in the dark with minimal help for 9 - 10 adults is a lot different than cooking for our 4 person family. He did a great job (in my opinion), and learned a lot. Did he pass? Don't know yet -- not my call. My thoughts are somewhat clearer today, now that I've had time to dig

ScoutNut wrote: "Have you considered that BSA might not be the organization for you? Perhaps, instead of trying to change every unit you come into contact with . . ." Uh, I've 'come into contact with precisely ONE unit'. And I wasn't even "trying to change" it. The actions I've taken locally -- as opposed to the much more candid thoughts & questions I've posed here -- were motivated in part by guilt: I was trying to offer the other boys the opportunities my own son had. Under the circumstances, this proved to be a mistake. But it was not a mistake made because I set out to change

pinkflame wrote: "The point is, 'fun' is a completely relative term." Yeah, I'm coming to realize that. My family and I tend to use it to refer mean "entertaining" or "amusing" or "pleasurable". But, I'm realizing that many people, especially kids, and even including my own 12 year old would use the word "fun" where words like "meaningful" or "challenging" would be more appropriate. In the original case of the local ASM, I'm pretty sure, well, very sure, that he meant by "fun" what a Cub Scout would mean by it, but I'm not at all sure that all posters to this thread are using it that

I just got back from the camp out and it was an 'interesting' weekend. From several perspectives, it went well for us. From other perspectives . . . well, we'll have to wait and see. I've scanned the various posts made while I was gone, and I want to thank you all very much. I already saw many points I'd overlooked, forgotten, or simply didn't know. It will take some time to digest, but I know it will be helpful. I'll post later, once my brain is back up to normal function. A whole weekend of 'walking on eggshells' and 'biting my tongue' has been emotionally draining and mentally t