moosetracker 132 Posted March 17, 2012 Share Posted March 17, 2012 Yeah, our DE told MIB to go be the ASM anyway, help out anyway he can. It's not about him. "It's all for the boys" Rah.. Rah.. MIB told him although he would like to help, the ASM is no place he can do that. The troop needs a good SM barring that, a Unit Commissioner.. He didn't get into the firing of the CC or COR.. That would not be the DE's position to do so.. He already knows the CC is running things into the ground, and has made comment it is the main problem of the group. Husband said he would try to squeeze MIB into the possition (anything to save his unit).. I said he wouldn't.. I lost the bet.. Today we has Specifics training.. The guy who took SM is coming to the course, MIB will be his trainer.. Or parently advice was to be nice and friendly, but blow him away with his knowledge.. Well the guy (and the rest of the participants) should be in for a wonderful training! Link to post Share on other sites
ghermanno 11 Posted March 17, 2012 Share Posted March 17, 2012 In answer to the original question: What would you do ... I would look for a different Troop to support. Go to Roundtable or go looking. If you want, you can support District as a member at large or on Commissioner Staff (UC/RTC/...) You can NOT save the Troop without the support. It is a losing battle. You can NOT force change even as a UC for the Troop (if you volunteer, don't be UC for this Troop it will only cause more strife) you can only make observations/reccomendations and you have already acknowledged that they don't want to change they only want to see what's available and pick and choose (CC's choice). You are an adult. You have multiple opinions... Let us know what you decided to do. My $0.02 Rick Link to post Share on other sites
JFL49 10 Posted March 17, 2012 Share Posted March 17, 2012 My advice: step away from the Troop for 6 12 months. Im sure your OA Chapter could use your help, or your District Committee, or become a Unit Commissioner (but not for your Troop). Or become an ASM in another Troop. Let your Troop work through it troubles. The world will look much different in the fall or next spring. Link to post Share on other sites
MoosetheItalianBlacksmith 13 Posted March 18, 2012 Author Share Posted March 18, 2012 In Case anyone was curious the training went very well. And everybody learned alot. But they also learned something new that i think people are forgetting and needs to be reitterated. Because ive now run into it several times and i keep hearing other people running into it. SO im going to start incorperating it into the training a bit more. Yes its a a program for the boys but without the help of leaders you cant have the program either. Leaders are looking for all the same things as boys. They want to be respected and treated well and not like pawns on a chess board. When the New SM left he left going oh crap our troops in trouble. I kepted my distance from him but was polite. My parents on the other hand made alot of comments about me knowing my stuff. Being really good at what i was doing. Thats why i teach all this....ect ect.In conversations with him. Link to post Share on other sites
moosetracker 132 Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 I believe training went well also.. Seems like the new SM at least now has had his eyes open that his troop isn't a little dysfunctional but that it is ALOT dysfunctional. The course is just a starting point. But lets hope it will spur him to look for other ways to get educated. Like roundtables, and Scouting U's etc.. Also if he is of the mind to change, perhaps a UC will find an open mind if he comes in and makes suggestions. MIB will find something else to champion, I'm sure.. As you said, when the troop looked like all except the CC was in support of him (or at least resigned to him being the only canidate), it had possibilities.. When the CC even seemed converted, it was hopeful. But when overnight, it changed to only having a few supporters, it was not so promising. Link to post Share on other sites
SeattlePioneer 144 Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 Hello Moose, From time to time as District Membership Chair I get inquiries from young adult graduates of the Scout program interested in getting back into the program. Unfortunately, often units are resistant to taking non parents in as adult leaders. If I don't find units interested in such young people, I usually invite them to participate in district activities, such as Order of the Arrow, organizing Camporee, Klondike or other activities. This allows Scout Troops to become familiar with those new leaders, and allows the young leaders to become acquainted with various Scout Troops. A positive partnership is easier to arrange on that basis. Plus, being acquainted with district leaders and programs is a big advantage for unit leaders which relatively few of those leaders have. Would you consider something like that? Link to post Share on other sites
Lisabob 13 Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 I haven't read every last post but here's my general take. 1. The way this went down presents evidence of a lot of adult dysfunction and you need to ask yourself how much you really want to get into that drama. (As a relatively young adult, you will also be endlessly questioned, tested, and discounted by other adults who like playing these power games and see you as wet behind the ears. No doubt it will tick you off because it is a fundamentally stupid way for adults to behave.) 2. If you feel you have common cause with the chosen SM, you may be able to tag team this mess and make some needed improvements together. But only if you have a common vision and common understanding of the path between the troop's current location and where your shared vision sees the troop being in a year or so. This requires a very strong working relationship and personal commitment to never throw each other under the bus, come what may. (Do try to be somewhat incremental - change is harder than it looks) 3. If you stay on as ASM and you don't have common cause with the actual SM - then you are setting yourself up, or being set up, or both. You'll take the fall for everything that goes wrong and every complaint. Meanwhile the SM can fail to rock the boat and be just fine. But the troop won't be better off for it, and you'll be smack in the middle of the drama. All that's good for is to raise your blood pressure. 4. Even if you are SM at this point, it sounds like there's a title without power waiting for you. You can't lead if nobody will follow. The CC will whip other committee folks into line - her line - and you'll end up at loggerheads with her on a regular basis. When it comes down to it, you can't make the changes it sounds like you want to make, if there isn't a solid majority of other adults supporting you, even if you're 100% right about what needs to happen. Good luck! Hope you'll find a scouting home where your talents are appreciated. Link to post Share on other sites
MoosetheItalianBlacksmith 13 Posted March 18, 2012 Author Share Posted March 18, 2012 Consider....i aldready do it. Pleas nobody take the Following the wrong way im just stating the point and answering the question posted by Seattle Pioneer. Im a Co-Training Chair for the District, Member of the District Eagle Board, Assistanct Cub Camp Promoter for District, District Committee Member at Large, Brotherhood meber of the OA, Meritbadge Councilor, Assitant SM, and Assistant CubMaster. On top of being one of the primary Trainers in the District for District Training, Being WoodBadge Trained and Being an Eagle Scout. I go to every Round table so I know alot of people around the district and even more people know me which i sometimes find alittle scary. Cause people will run into me places and start talking to me....and i have NNNOOOO clue who they are. Link to post Share on other sites
moosetracker 132 Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 Yeah, MIB does a lot.. The whole family has now gotten the name of the clan.. His father and he is into a whole lot more then I, but we are just known because the 4 of us (include MIB fiance, do show up to alot of things in-force).. I am talking to MIB about taking on the full District Training Chair position if he wishes, I was going to take one more year at it, then hand it over. Had he gotten SM of the troop my chosen replacement would have had to be someone else as the SM position would have taken up all his time.. I know he would like to get back into working at a BS troop level with the boys again. But he is always interested in the fix-me-ups, rather then the strong healthy troops.. He would be welcomed as an ASM in many healthy troops, but he doesn't see the challenge there.. I guess I am hoping if he has his main position in District as heading one of the larger program positions, he can be happy going to one of these healthy troops and just plain having fun, there on events, although there will be no big job there for him to do as the good troops normally have healthy adult leadership already. Perhaps at sometime he will hear of an area that is absent of a troop and could use one. It may be easier for him to someday start up a troop.. I do not know if that would require more of a name for himself in the district (since he has no kids).. Or if he would need to be older.. For the adults in the area to trust the guy without kids who wishes to start a troop. Anyway, a startup troop may be easier then a fix-me-upper with alot of dysfunctional adults. Link to post Share on other sites
qwazse 4345 Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 It's okay to tell people "I'm sorry, I forgot,your name?" I saw the VP schmoozing on our town's parade route yesterday, and he acted fine that everybody new him, and he was letting complete strangers take his picture give him their babies to kiss, etc.... But along those lines, it is also okay to make tough decisions like you are going to trade off one responsibility for another, so if you take on a position, you do so in a way that will do the most good. Turning down a position because under the circumstances, it's the better decision for the boys -- could fall in that category. It sounds like you helped the SM get the bigger picture, and maybe he'll still tap you as a resource. You can put him in touch with adults who will help him call "BS" on his dysfunctional committee. There was a time as a new crew advisor (the first one I ever met), my trainers did exactly that for me. I used the folks on our council's Venturing committee and the VOA as a sounding board. I could ask them, "Am I crazy?" They would reply, "Yes, but you are also right." That kept me going for several months until the adults in my troop and crew got on the same page. And the unit numbers on your shoulder won't have to match for you to provide that service! Link to post Share on other sites
SeattlePioneer 144 Posted March 19, 2012 Share Posted March 19, 2012 Hello Moose, That's a very commendable list of activities. If you want to be a SM I would suppose that you can find a troop that needs that leadership. We have several in our district! And ---oh yes! I finally figured it out: "MIB" = MoosetheItalianBlacksmith Hate those abbreviationjs I can't figure out.... Link to post Share on other sites
MoosetheItalianBlacksmith 13 Posted March 19, 2012 Author Share Posted March 19, 2012 HAHA I get really confused with some of the abreviations too....glad to know its not just me. Link to post Share on other sites
moosetracker 132 Posted March 19, 2012 Share Posted March 19, 2012 Sorry his username is way too long and with us both starting our usernames with "moose" that gets confusing to me also if we are posting in the same thread. Fine if I'm the only moose in the thread. Link to post Share on other sites
SeattlePioneer 144 Posted March 19, 2012 Share Posted March 19, 2012 Abbreviations that I can't fathom are a pet peeve of mine. Usually I'll key in the whole term once before using abbreviations. You can also copy screen names of people, and then paste them in using a control + v or right click your mouse and then select paste from the drop down menu. Hence: MoosetheItalianBlacksmith MoosetheItalianBlacksmith MoosetheItalianBlacksmith I also often just use the first part of a screen name, although that was ambiguous with moose... We seem to have a herd of moose here at the moment. Another pet peeve are screen names that often seem willfully obscure and impenetrable. I don't see the point. Link to post Share on other sites
MoosetheItalianBlacksmith 13 Posted March 19, 2012 Author Share Posted March 19, 2012 yha some abbrieviations i just cant figure out while others it takes me alittle while. In training on Saturday we had been talking about Stop,Start Continue for a little bit. and then sombody that uses it all the time at work and other places Said "SCC" and i had to stop and ask him what he was talking about. Probably should have been obvious but my mind just doesnt translate the abreviations as well as it should unless i already know them and i know them well. I did explain this to the class he explained everything was good and we moved on. Ive figured out MIB. My other problem on here besides not knowing an abbreviation is constant abbreviations....some people will use them so constantly i start having a hard time translating the ones i DO know. Dyslexic mind at work.....though never diagnosed my father has it and i have issues that strongly point to it. Ive just never gone and gotten diagnosed. Link to post Share on other sites
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