How to Regain Program Focus

[Eagledad 2780]

Im a little embarrassed that I will sound like Im preaching the same point over and over, but I will just throw out one more suggestion.

 

The boys arent really going to except the program as boy run as long as the adults keep preventing the boys from feeling independence. There are a lot of good suggestions that I think you can follow, but it is human instinct to go the path of least resistance. In this case, changing into a different direction is a lot of resistance because the adults just dont know that different is better.

 

So at the risk of sound repetitive and preachy, give every active scout and adult the SPL Handbook and PL Handbook. Required everyone to read them then have a meeting to discuss how your troop is different? Guide the discussions toward a small list of program changes from both the scouts and scouters. The books are really easy to read and pretty clear on running the troop. Every time a situation like this comes up, have both the SM and SPL sit and find the answer in the books.

 

Troops Ive seen use this technique like it because everyone starts on even footing and the program becomes surprisingly simple for both the scouts and adults. It is in our human nature adults tend to complicate processes where as boys work toward simplifying them. Working off the same set of guidelines and instructions braces everything down to simple easy program with a path everyone can vision.

 

Once you get on that path, then you can push for additional training so the program can grow.

 

Just another suggestion.

 

I love this scouting stuff.

 

Barry

 

[Stosh 3452]

A lot of stuff flying around, hard to keep up with it and it would require multiple new threads to sift through it all.

 

However, I find that when one makes a comment with no referencing to particular people, place or thing, sometimes guilt emerges to judge oneself in the process. I've seen myself in many situations this way and didn't feel all that great either, but it was important that I saw it for what it was worth. From the initial post it appeared that the CC and ASM's were on one side and the SM off someplace doing his own thingy. Then it appeared to be that the SM needed to get his act together, and if not, the adults were going to step in and take over. I do believe it is BSA policy that the CC has the responsibility of making sure the adult leadership is all on the same page. If that is not being accomplished, well then, maybe the "assumption of guilt" would fall someplace, and according to BSA program dynamics onto the CC. Sorry, but that's not a rule/opinion that I adhere to, but BSA seems to. If that conclusion doesn't speak to anyone's situation, then the only thing I've done is waste my breath.

 

Never have I stated in any post that boy-led, patrol-method means adult-abandoned. (Gotta love those assumptive statesments, but I don't take it as a slam against my character. Don't cha just hate it when that happens?) I only take note of how adults think it is proper to coerce, trick, mentor, coach, assist, etc. etc. to manipulate the kids to do the BSA program. I find it a lot easier for the boys to read the books, understand them, read G2SS and then let them loose. These boys aren't stupid, they know what's expected of them. Never have my boys suggested any inappropriate activity that wasn't shot down by ANOTHER SCOUT! I didn't need to mentor anyone, they take care of themselves just fine. They have the responsibility to run the program as they see fit, they have the authority to make the decisions, and maybe someday when they decide to become a Girl Scout troop, I'll have to step in. Until then, they are doing a fantastic job.

 

The greatest impact I have on the program is monitoring the adults and keeping them from interferring with the dynamics of the boy-led/run, patrol-method, adult-supported program. (I toss that little extra in to ease the assumption that I have abandoned my boys to a world of soccer and movies.)

 

As far as adult teaching, guiding, etc.? Well, when the boys come and ask me questions, bounce off ideas, or just chat, I'm available to LISTEN and offer my opinions/insights as needed. Do they take my advice? Sometimes, sometimes not. Do I guide, mentor, coach, interfer, persuade, etc.? Nope.

 

Laisse faire is the best tool a SM has with his boys. I find my boys mature at a faster rate when they are given the opportunity to grow up and take responsibility for their own actions. Sometimes they disappoint me, most of the time they don't. I just have to remember that these boys are only 11-12 years old and have the authority of taking on an adult level reponsibility. Some can handle it better than others. By by the time they're 14-15 and Eagle rank, I'm sure they'll have the hang of things. I had a parent sitting around the campfire with me that started to get up to go help his boy load the boy's gear in the back of his pickup. The boy was small the the tailgate was quite high. I told the parent to leave him alone, the parent turned and asked me if I expected an 11 year-old to do an adult's job. I said, nope, but I was going to at least let him have an opportunity to do so. The boy got his gear in just fine.

 

Stosh

[evmori 11]

Boy led with adult guidance! Simple!

[Stosh 3452]

Boy-led, adult-support, even simpler.

 

Adult guidance assumes adult-led.

 

By definition, support better describes it for me.

 

Stosh

 

Encarta World English Dictionary, North American Edition

 

guidance

 

guidance [ gd'nss ] noun

 

Definition:

 

1. leadership: leadership or direction

 

2. advice: advice or counseling, especially counseling given to students on academic matters

 

3. systems that control flight: the systems and devices that control the flight of an aircraft, missile, or spacecraft

onboard guidance

 

 

 

support

 

support [ sə pwrt ] transitive verb (past and past participle supported, present participle supporting, 3rd person present singular supports)

 

Definition:

 

1. keep something or somebody stable: to keep something or somebody upright or in place, or prevent something or somebody from falling

Those pillars support the roof.

 

2. bear weight: to be strong enough to hold a particular object or weight in place without breaking or giving way

Are you sure the ice is thick enough to support our weight?

 

3. sustain somebody financially: to provide somebody with money and the other necessities of life over a period of time

She succeeds in supporting her family on what she earns.

 

4. give active help and encouragement: to give active help, encouragement, or money to somebody or something

We support the charity through voluntary work.

 

5. be in favor of something: to be in favor of something, e.g. a cause, policy, or organization, and wish to see it succeed

Do you support the committee's policy on membership fees?

 

6. be present and give encouragement: to give encouragement to somebody or something by being present at an event

Why not come along on Saturday and support the school team?

 

7. give assistance or comfort: to give assistance or comfort to somebody in difficulty or distress

He supported me throughout the crisis.

 

8. corroborate story: to give something greater credibility by being consistent with it or providing further evidence for it

There is further evidence that supports the defendant's claim.

 

9. enable something to live: to provide sufficient food and water or the appropriate conditions or facilities to enable people or animals to live or allow something to function

A better irrigation system would enable the area to support a larger population.

 

10. provide assistance with computer system: to provide technical advice and assistance to the users of a product, especially a computing system or package

 

11. comput permit use of software or devices: to be designed to allow something, e.g. a specific type of software, computer device, or programming language, to operate with it

This card cannot support parallel and serial ports.

 

12. performing arts play small role alongside somebody: to play a subsidiary role alongside an actor with a leading part in a play or movie

 

13. tolerate something: to put up with something unpleasant ( formal )

The Court will not support such behavior.

 

 

 

[SMDonHall 10]

Glad I found this old thread, cause it is similar to what we are going through as we transition into a "boy-led" troop.

 

I understand the opinions here, but I'd like to know nuts and bolts of how you keep the program scouting related.

 

Our PLC often brings up ideas that are less "scouty" than we would like for outings. (trip to the beach, trip to a science museum, trip to an amusement park). I'm not thinking that we should NEVER do anything like this, but it is hard to get them thinking in terms of more scoutlike activities in their planning. Since we pretty much only do one activity a month, I'd rather them leave these kinds of activities for other venues (school trips, family vacations etc).

 

So what do I do? Tell them no outright? Set parameters ahead of time as to what constitutes a scout activity? Let them do whatever they want?

 

What I'm looking for here is how you do it. Not your philosophy, but how your typical PLC planning meetings go and what happens to their ideas after the meeting? (approval from another source, etc.)

[Beavah 205]

Yah, one way yeh can do it is just be honest, eh?

 

"Going to play video games is an interestin' idea, but I'll be honest - I'm goin' to have a hard time getting any adults to support that. If we're goin' to give up a day with our family we want it to be for somethin' really cool like whitewater rafting (for real, not virtual)! Don't use us for stuff yeh can do on your own or with your family. That's boring! Use us for stuff yeh otherwise wouldn't be able to do."

 

Da other thing that yeh have to be aware of is that kids by and large are a conservative and uncreative lot. Just like adults, eh? They tend to only think of what they know, and tend to only choose things they know they're already good at. And what they know and are good at are da things yeh mention, eh?

 

If yeh want to expand their horizons a bit, take a small group of PLC lads to "explore" some new activity as a day trip or weekend trip. Go sailin' with a Ship. Go Mountain Bikin'. Whatever. Give them some experience they can feel and taste, eh? Sure as shootin', they'll bring that idea back to the PLC as their own. Yeh can also do things like send 'em a brochure about something cool in the mail (kids never get mail of their own) to "seed" ideas.

 

Beavah

 

 

[John-in-KC 311]

What's wrong with going to the beach? What's wrong with a campout at the beach? C'mon, use a little imagination I grew up in Southern California, and an opportunity to go play at the shore was always welcome. You have to be a bit careful in planning safe swim, BSA isn't fond of the strand these days, but that's about it.

 

Ditto the science museum. Go to the place in advance. See what sorts of discovery opportunities there are. Now, there are some science museums that are garbage. There are others which are fantastic. Leverage the good.

 

What's wrong with a Troop/family fun trip to Six Flags? Just tell the PLC it's going to be a SECOND activity that month.

 

I see two good decisions by your PLC and one that can be turned to a win-win.

[Stosh 3452]

I use the technique of "You're wasting my time". I constantly emphasize that the boys signed up to do scout stuff. If we aren't doing scout stuff, then we are wasting the boy's time. If they are jawjacking and not accomplishing their tasks, they are wasting their time and probably someone else's. When the flag ceremony doesn't start on time, the SPL is reminded that he is wasting the time of those who chose to be on time. While for some, it produces kids that are clock watchers, it also produces kids that constantly evaluate what it is they are doing. Is what we are doing accomplishing something or are we wasting time? Sleeping in? Is that wasting someone else's time?

 

Is it effective? I have had the SPL run a flag ceremony with only one other scout. When the tardy boys showed up and saw that the flags were already in their stands, they assumed they had been forgotten from the last meeting. When they went to "get" them, they were gently reminded by the SPL that the flags were already done and we are now getting patrols together for their activities. When the even later boys showed up they gathered with their patrols wondering why they weren't moving for the flags, and the PL's reminded them that they had missed them and they were now working on patrol activities. This cascade effect had a positive impact on the boys because now they realize that in order to not waste their buddies time, they show up when they are supposed to.

 

We have only an hour and a half each week to get a lot of scout stuff done, the more they waste time, the less that gets done and they miss out on things. Kinda like the real world. Scouting is a game with a purpose, purpose implies that the person is not simply there wasting time.

 

Stosh

[SMDonHall 10]

John, I did state that I don't think we should NEVER do those things, it's just they are coming up with things like this to the exclusion of the things that would give them more "scout skills". They pooh pooh ideas like hiking on the appalacian trail, having a "cooking campout" for ideas that they already do on school/band trips.

 

As a result, the majority of the more "scouty" outings have been the result of adult "persuasion"

 

DH