A rock and a hard place

[Eamonn 61]

We are having a reorganization of the Council, I was dumb enough to agree to take on membership.

A good many years back, I was all for holding spring round-ups for Tiger Cubs.

That is recruiting these little Lad's as soon as they graduate from kindergarten.

Back then I was more concerned with the numbers than the quality of program that the new recruits would receive.

I tried to justify what I was doing by telling myself that it was up to the unit to provide the program and I was just helping out by recruiting these boys.

I still whole heartedly believe that the program is in the hands of the unit.

But I have noticed that a good many of the new recruits that are signed up in May, never make it into the program.

A lot of the Packs tend to slow down or even stop from when school breaks in late May /early June until school restarts in late August early September.

My big concern is that they and their parents feel let down and decide that Scouting just isn't for them, now or ever.

 

Some ideas that I'm playing with that might help overcome this are.

* Allowing Tiger Cubs and their adult partner to sign up for Day camps as individuals. (Not depending on the Pack, who might or might not attend.

*Challenging Packs to sign-up six Tiger Cubs and having someone organize a inter-pack six-a-side Tiger Cub soccer tournament.

My thinking here is that very often small packs don't recruit enough Tigers to form a real Den.

(Six seems like a manageable number when you add the adult partner!)

Most parents understand a little bit about soccer!!

*Offering people who will be the adult partner an overview of what Tiger Cub Scouting is about, before they join. I'm thinking of a few public type meetings to be held in different locations in the Council.

I welcome your comments and ideas.

As I have said this is all still very much up in the air at this time.

Thanks

Eamonn.

 

[infoscouter 11]

Our Council is also running a "Tiger-Mania" this spring. Each district is tasked with putting on several events aimed just at the new Scouts to keep them involved, even if their unit doesn't run a strong summer program.

 

Typical events would be water bottle rocket shoots, raingutter regattas, trips to minor league soccer/baseball games, nature activity day at a local camp or nature center, etc. Just a couple hours where district level volunteers would run something simple. The boys would complete an elective or requirement or receive a belt loop or patch.

 

We are asking our units *not* to participate if they can't commit to a full summer program that would involve the new Tigers and their partners.

 

I our pack, I run the new Tiger dens each year for 2 months. I am the Pack Trainer and do *not* serve as a regular den leader. This allows us to let the parents ease into the shared leadership concept, get used to the rhythm of meetings and go-and-see-its, etc. It allows us to get to know the parents and make educated choices for leaders. It works well for us. I realize not every pack would have this luxury, but it might work for some units.

[rjscout 11]

I like that idea of having an experience leader run the Tiger Den(s) for a few months. I get feedback that some of the Tiger Den Leaders are a little overwhelmed, at first. I'll have to check on that for our Pack.

 

I think we had a Spring Recruit last year, but I was just a Tiger Dad at that point, so I was not familiar with what was happening. I hear that we did get two new Tigers who went to Day Camp. We didn't have a lot of summer activities last year. I am now the ACM and will be the CM next year. We are already looking to have summer activities on top of Pack participation in the Adventure (Resident) Camp and the Fun with Son weekend Camping. We are are also offering to help initiate the organization of Pack members who want to go to Day Camp, Adventure Camp or the Weekend Camps on dates other then the Pack events. We want to maximize the camping opportunities for all of the pack members.

 

We do plan to participate in the Spring Recruiting and hope to have some new Tigers at a few of our summer camping experiences, as well as give the new families information about the Day Camps. We hope to be successful.

 

[Scouting Mom 10]

The last three years, we've had Tigers sign up before Fall.

 

Three years ago, there was no recruiting event, just some little brothers in our pack. Mom had reluctantly agreed to be den leader. It was ok, the boy stayed in, Mom didn't really do any DL things until Fall came and eventually they moved. A second early Tiger also moved over the summer, so never really became part of the pack. Not a very successful situation.

 

Two years ago, two Tigers came to us through a District recruiting event. They were invited to our graduation, where they were acknowledged as incoming Tigers. They were on the Cub Master's email list, so they got notice of all pack events, but there was no DL to communicate specifically to them. One boy never came to anything after the graduation, the second came to a couple of summer activities. They stayed on for a year and eventually dropped out.

 

Last year, I was tapped to be the Tiger DL for this year. I made a point of getting to any district recruiting event I could, so that I could personally meet any families that signed up for our pack. The ones I couldn't make, I made sure I got the contact info on my den by the end of that day. Our CC worked all of the Spring Tiger recruiting events and talked up day camp and the fact that we were going camping the day after school let out, when these boys would be full-fledged pack members. All but one of the boys went camping with the pack in June, but only my son went to day camp. All but that same one boy came to at least one summer event. That one boy's family was the only one I hadn't met when they signed up. Mom made it clear when I called her the next day that they didn't expect to be involved until fall, because of summer obligations...I kept them on my email list so they knew everything that was going on and they showed up at the first den meeting of the new school year...that boy was the first to earn his Tiger.

 

We already have a DL signed up for next year, and we are working on the year after that. (Gotta know who has little brothers). We are also going camping again as soon as school lets out...(the Tiger-DL-to-be really lobbied for that after seeing what a great time MY new Tigers had last June) My den is very successful. Of a total of 11 boys who signed up, only one dropped and that was because of family circumstances. The 5 original boys are the core of a tight group, that has been happy to welcome newcomers. I have a long "welcome" letter that I send to each new family that answers all the questions I can think of that I didn't know to ask when I was a new scout parent 4 years ago. I don't think I'm the world's greatest DL, but I try to make communication my number one priority.

 

I would say that the best thing to do is to get an experienced parent or leader to take the incoming Tigers under their wing and make a point of calling them/emailing them, etc. They also need to be an advocate for those new Tigers...like our Tiger-DL-to-be was when he lobbied to have our Spring camping trip late enough to include any potential Tigers. Much like I understand the old Tiger "Coach" program was supposed to work. Ideally, it'd be nice to have this person be DL, so if you can pick a parent with a younger son ready to join, that'd be good, but they could be just a place holder if necessary, until a more permanent DL can be chosen. Of course, they don't have to have a son in the den to be DL, but it's a great motivator.

 

Make sure the person will do the job. Make sure they have the best interests of the pack and the boys in mind and don't just agree because you need a name on the paper. Because, you don't NEED to have a name on the paper until you go to recharter again...what you need is someone to make sure the new Tigers don't fall through the cracks.

[Scouting Mom 10]

Oops, I just went back and read the original post and realized I didn't address the original ideas...

 

Our council does let kids sign up for day camp individually...in fact, I've been told that any boy who is a scout anywhere in the country can sign up for a day camp anywhere in the country...eliminates the "I'm spending the summer with dad who lives 5 states away, so I can't do day camp" excuse. BUT, if they boys don't know anyone and will never see anyone from camp again come fall, I don't think it matters for retention.

 

Six Tigers is a lot for us to recruit before school lets out...I was amazed when we got 5 and we are a medium sized pack. Plus, my own kids HATE soccer, that plan would have them dropping out before they'd start...they like scouts because sports are optional and they can choose to do activities on their own.

 

Providing info to potential Tiger parents is a wonderful idea...group sessions for that purpose, I'm not so sure about...makes it too easy to slip out the back door. Our district does a 4-hours "open house" type recruiting, but you need to make sure the people working it know their stuff and that the literature provided is good. We had one event that was run by district types who had been around long enough that their sons had Eagle on the mind...they'd forgotten what being in Cub Scouts was like. It was a total failure. Other events with current Cub leaders are much more successful.

[Lisabob 13]

Our district has done the following to try to make spring tiger recruiting a viable option:

 

1) Allows all tigers+adult partner to attend day camp with or without a pack. (Yet I agree with Scouting Mom about the problems with this if they don't make that connection to the pack as part of the daycamp experience)

 

2) Promote the heck out of the pack summertime activities award. If the pack has three summer activities and the Tigers know about them then that may keep them active enough to maintain their interest into fall, and pack activities take the pressure off new Tiger parents to really form a solid "den" right away.

 

To that end, the district provides several "easy" summertime activities for all cubs with an emphasis on including Tigers (a district-wide archery and BB gun day, a fishing derby, district day at the ballpark, that sort of thing)

 

3) Provide Tiger DL training at the same time we do our spring tiger recruiting so that packs can start off with a "trained" DL.

 

However our spring Tiger recruiting isn't phenomenal either. In a district of about 1900 scouts (total, incl. boy scouts) we might get about 30-40 new Tigers each spring. No one has previously tracked how many of those stay active come fall. I'd like to do that over the summer if I can get council to open up the records to me.

 

About holding parent info meetings so they know what they're getting into - around here I think it would really depend on how/where/when you did these. Several school districts in our area have reorganized their K program so that all K children are in one building, yet they are re-distributed across all of the elementary buildings for 1st grade (with assignments sometimes not being made until late summer). This makes it extremely difficult for packs to recruit new Tigers based on a boy's "home" school in K. I don't know if that's becoming more common elsewhere or is just a local oddity.

 

But a short announcement in a church bulletin, a meeting after church services, etc., seems to work better around here for us than school-based recruitment for new Tigers does. And if you have a community recreation center (often part of either the school district or town gov't) you might try advertising through them since they are also the ones who typically run pre-k and tot-age activites/classes for families and parents of young kids therefore are familiar with them.

 

Also our districts try to provide template language that packs could use with minimal alteration (just drop their own pack contact info into it) so that they have very little they have to do to creat advertising for their unit. That plus a list of contacts for local news outlets might be useful to pack leaders.

 

Just a couple of thoughts Eamonn, I don't know how helpful it is to you.

 

 

[DYB-Mike 10]

Hi folks,

 

This topic and your ideas are timely for our Pack and myself as we are beginning to talk about spring recruitment (our Council is pushing it and we havent done it before). Personally, my youngest son will be coming in as a Tiger as his Webelos II brother crosses over this May. I am planning on being my Tigers den leader as well as retaining the ACM position.

 

I specifically wanted to address the recommendations of cub day camp for cubs recruited in the spring. I am going to sign my son up in the spring and I had planned to volunteer and take my new Tiger to day camp this summer, but when I got the flyer from our Council it stated that only Graduated Tiger Cubs and the other Cub ranks could apply. I have been told that graduated means having earned the Tiger rank. Obviously that will not be the case for my son or any other Tigers recruited in the spring for that matter.

 

Has anyone else encountered the Graduated Tiger Cub requirement for day camp? From the posts it doesnt seem like a standard practice. Is it unique to my Council (Old Colony, MA)? Have I been misinformed as to what graduated means?

 

Thanks,

 

YIS

Mike

 

[Sephrina 10]

I'm almost positive my council did not have a day camp available for incoming Tigers, because I remember being surprised that the council my son's dad lives in did offer one day of day camp specifically for new Tigers and their partners. In fact, when I asked at my council shop last spring, the staff was surprised boys could register as Tigers as soon as they finished kindergarten.

 

Karen

[Eagledad 2792]

Hi All

 

Eamonn, I have a couple questions that you and Lisabob may know. How much does recruiting in the Spring help the total Tiger numbers over the total numbers (Fall) before you started recruiting in the spring? It seems to me that you are recruiting the same pool of scouts you would be recruiting in the Fall. So Im wondering what you are trying to gain by recruiting in the Spring.

 

Barry

 

[Cubmaster Randy 10]

Our district does not allow for for incoming tiger to go to day camp and only encourages spring recruiting if the pack has a summer program. They can go to pack or council events

One observation that I have made in my old pack was that when we did do spring recruiting, we signed up more tigers. I think this is because we got ahead of all the other activities that they were being asked to sign up for. When we do spring sign ups, we usually sign up 7 more (3 dens of tigers as opposed to only 2)

Of course a good program keeps them. Summer time activities here are a hit/miss as many families are off doing other things.

 

[ScoutNut 147]

Tigers and their Partners are welcome at Day Camps in all of our Districts.

 

Perhaps the problem is that the Summer Camp must include programing appropriate to all of the age levels of their campers. The non-Tiger camps just do not want to be bothered coming up with programing that is age appropriate for those youngest Cubs.

[Eagledad 2792]

>>One observation that I have made in my old pack was that when we did do spring recruiting, we signed up more tigers. I think this is because we got ahead of all the other activities that they were being asked to sign up for.

[Lisabob 13]

Barry, my experience at the pack level was also that a push for spring tiger recruiting ended up giving us more tigers in the fall. It also gave us time to get to know a few tiger parents and get one or two of them all geared up to be Tiger DLs. Perhaps this is because our pack worked reasonably hard at doing this recruiting and at keeping these folks engaged over the summer.

 

But from a district perspective, I was really dismayed to see the numbers last year. Spring recruiting seems to help in that some of these boys are signed up primarily to go to day camp (which is allowed in our council) and even if they aren't ever active with a pack again, they're on the rolls for the year. I guess the thinking is that those same boys probably would not get signed up at all in the fall. I'm not a fan of this approach but I know it happens for some families. But the reality seems to be that the district recruits rather few (maybe 1-2%) of our overall youth membership this way. Last year I think we got 25 or 30 new tigers district wide in spring, out of a district of about 1900 scouts.

 

I'm glad you asked this question though. Sometimes we do things because that's what people have done before, without really giving it enough thought.

[Eagledad 2792]

Sometimes we tend to over complicate things that were intended to be simple. As an engineer, I tend to spend as much time scaling down my original idea as I did coming up with the idea in the first place. It drives me crazy, but because I know I have that problem, I also watch for it in other parts of my life. I used to drive our District Committee crazy because I had a knack for asking these types of questions. They seemed rather excited when I move up to council. Hmm

 

My fear in this case is the adults would put in more of their volunteer time then the benefits are worth and you could risk burnout. I was thinking along the lines of what Scoutnut said; the extra work to accommodate tiger age boys may be more then they want. But Cubmaster Randys observation is worth noting as well as yours, so we have to weigh these things.

 

I sure would like to give Eamonn a little more space from the rock.

 

Barry

 

[Eamonn 61]

Hi Barry,

While of course no two years are ever the same.

In what might be called a normal year. (Last year was far from normal!!)

For the District I serve:

We "Lose" about 200 -225 Cub Scouts each year.

About 70 -75 cross over and become Boy Scouts.

School Sign Up Night in September brings in 125 -150.

This Spring Tiger recruitment has in the past brought in 40 -50 of the little fellows.

There is no real way of knowing if these boys would or wouldn't join in the fall.

The thinking is that a Bird in the hand..

 

The history of this recruitment in the District is that I started this recruitment not long after Tigers started in the late 80's??

It was a District event held at one location. We managed to recruit something like 20 Tigers.

It ran this way for several years and then we changed it so we had 3 recruitments going on at the same time. One in each school district.

One area had a problem with finding a location, so they moved to the local YMCA.

Somehow over the years that I haven't been around it has morphed into a Scoutoree.

The feeling was why stop at Tigers? Why not all Cub Scouts? And if we are going to have Cub Scouts,? Why not include Boy Scouts?

In a lot of ways it became a one day Camporee where no one camped??

The first year it did a fair job of high lighting Scouting in the District and the sales from hot dogs and snacks were good.

But it never managed to do a good job of recruiting.

It is also very close in date to the District Boy Scout Spring Camporee.

 

I'm now changing it back to the school district recruitment.

Of course a lot of the people who were in favor of the big Scoutoree Type event are a little upset. It seems that the past District Chairman and DE didn't use budgets and the money made from the sales of snacks was used to buy stuff for Day Camp. Which didn't have a budget!!

Eamonn.