ASM patch with "Trained" patch

[AggieScouter 10]

A Scouter from our District training team told me that the ASM position patch must be worn with the "Trained" patch, that is, he/she may not wear the ASM patch until he/she is trained for that position. Therefore, several of our adults are not in proper uniform. As I read the Insignia Guide, it says that the "Trained" patch "...may be worn only in connection with the emblem of office for which the training has been completed". To me this means that you can't wear the "Trained" patch with the ASM patch unless you are ASM trained, but can still wear the ASM patch without the "Trained" patch if you have not done the training. The only other reference to this I can find is on the Female Leader Uniform Inspection Sheet which states "When earned, the Trained leader strip is worn touching the badge of office". Is there any other source I can point to? This Scouter won't take no for an answer; I need my ducks in a row before I get back to him.

[Bob White 20]

Aggie you are 100% correct.

 

Any registered scouter can wear the position of reponsibility patch for whatever position they have accepted. They can wear the TRAINED patch with that position patch once they have completed the required Basic Training for that position. For an ASM position you will need New Leader essentials, SM/ASM Leader Specific Training, and Introduction to Outdoor Skills.

 

Bob White

 

[Overtrained 10]

You asked for a further referance. I don't have my insignia guide handy, but you said you had one. Take a look under position patches and I bet it doesn't say anything about having to wear a trained patch with them.

[scoutldr 732]

I'll take a shot here...Aggie may be in one of those misguided Councils which is making training "mandatory" in order to be registered in a position. Therefore, you wear both patches, or none at all.

[Fat Old Guy 11]

"Aggie may be in one of those misguided Councils which is making training "mandatory" in order to be registered in a position. "

 

I don't know how misguided that is. Most of the time training is required for referees, umpires, teachers, and counselors. Why shouldn't training be required for a Scoutmaster?

 

[AggieScouter 10]

There is noe requirement for training, although it is highly recommended. Our Council and District are good about this.

[FScouter 24]

There is no BSA reference that will support what you were told. Likewise, you won't find a reference that states position patches may be worn without being trained. The literature speaks only of the conditions under which the "Trained" patch may be worn. (As BobWhite related).

 

There is no need to defend yourself about this. If your trainer person mentions it again, politely ask him for a written BSA resource so you can read up on it. Since there is no support for his statement, that leaves the ball permanently in his court, end of discussion.

[dozer 10]

On page three of the scoutmaster handbook says just what Aggie & bob are saying after being trained you may wear the trained strip under the position patch for which you were trained.

 

If you switch hats from den leader to ASM the trained strip comes off from under the ASM patch until you recieve training for that position.

 

 

[NWScouter 9]

I once saw but now cant find on the web pictures of old (at least 25 yrs ago) Scoutmaster patches that by the difference in color of the edging differed between trained and untrained. Maybe thats what he was thinking of.

[AggieScouter 10]

NWScouter:

I saw that page too. That was not what he was talking about. Actually, the "Trained" patch was put out to replace the two different patches. I am using this info as evidence that it is possible to wear an ASM patch w/o the "Trained", since there is only one patch now for both trained & untrained.

 

Dozer: Thanks for the tip. I will look it up when I get home.

[Fat Old Guy 11]

Many years ago, there was a "Trained Scoutmaster" patch that was fully embroidered with shiny thread. The colors of patch and border were the same, it was the thread that was different.

 

 

[NWScouter 9]

FOG,

Now that you mention it it was the metallic vs. regular thread that signified trained form untrained.