Keeping track of progress toward Rank?

[Exibar 10]

Aside from the scout himself, I would think that the Patrol leaders and Senior Patrol leaders would ask their patrol members hat they require to work on.

On top of that, I would think that the ScoutMaster should also be made aware of what his Scouts are in need of. Perhaps the majority of the scouts require one or two items, the ScoutMaster can bring it up at the Patrol Leader meetings and steer the Patrol leaders into perhaps focusing on those items during the next troop meeting.

 

Am I off base here? I realize that there is the TroopMaster software and many other 3rd party tools to help with this, but am I correct in thinking the way I am?

 

thanks!

Mike B

[Oak Tree 15]

Mike,

 

I think your thinking is fine. The main advantages that TroopMaster brings to this are 1. a record in case a boy loses his book (not that any of us have *ever* seen that happen), and 2. a quick way to see who all needs those one or two items that you mention. TroopMaster is also faster than doing it by hand, and makes it easy to transfer a Scout to another unit.

 

But as for who would want to see the data, I think you're fine. There is often also an ASM responsible for helping out with this for the new Scouts. I'd be curious to hear if others have been successful (and how they've done it) at getting the PL and/or SPL interested in paying attention to this.

[Eagle92 110]

Maybe I'm old school, or maybe my troop wasn't advancement oriented, but the ONLY person responsible for keeping track of advancement is the scout, not the PLs, not the SPLs, and not the leaders. The PLs may be told what their patrol members need in order for advancement. The SPL may push for advancement opportunities in the planning of his program for his planning conference, and the leaders may advise implementing advancement opportunities. But Ultimately the Scout is responsible.

 

Now the scout will need assistance from folks. As stated he will need to advise the PL and through the PL the SPL what he needs done to advance. And he will need adults to get the MBCs and assist in getting some of the paperwork completed for Eagle. And of course adutls may need to have a SMC or ROR to find out what's going on and why the scout isn't advancing.

 

But again the Scout and Scout alone is responsible, and no one else.

[shortridge 184]

Oak Tree and Eagle92 hit it on the head. Keeping those records is the Scout's job, no one else's. No need for TroopMaster or any other adult-run recordkeeping software. He can create a backup record on his own by photocopying the pages from his book every couple of months. Cost? 50 cents at the local library.

 

The Scoutmaster can get the information about what Scouts need simply by asking the SPL to ask the PLs to ask their patrol members. That's much simpler, time-efficient and cost-effective. Oh, and it strengthens the patrol method.

 

Much better than having Scouts report to Mr. Jones with his laptop at the back of the room every time they get something signed off.

[gcnphkr 11]

"Much better than having Scouts report to Mr. Jones with his laptop at the back of the room every time they get something signed off."

 

What an odd thing to do. We mostly just update TroopMaster after the BOR. The Advancement Chair takes the handbook with him and returns it to the scout the next week. But such tracking tools are much older than PCs. Back in the seventies we had an advancement chart.

[shortridge 184]

jet,

 

In the example the OP provided - where a couple Scouts may be short a requirement or two for the next rank - updating a database after the BOR wouldn't really accomplish the goal of figuring out what they needed.

[dg98adams 18]

In the Troop I serve, they do a little of both.

 

An ASM is responsible for Troop Master, and he prints reports which are given to the PLC (SPL/Patrol Members ~monthly). The SPL/PL are responsible for planning the program, so they make opportunities available on outings as needed.

 

An ASM is around for each Patrol leader (when newly elected) to answer questions related to this report. It is the Scout who wants to complete advancement to tell the PL (or Troop guide/PL when NSP) when he is in need of opportunity. The NSP gets a little more direction than the other Patrols.

 

Usually, when the Scout requests a SM conference, he has swung by the advancement ASM to match-up/update the Troop Master record of his current hand book to the Troop record. This ASM also uses Troop Master to record MB start and completions.

 

The SM gets a report (when there is changes or before COH) that shows Troop advancement in rank from Troop Master.

 

Lost books are not much of an issue, when it's only 1 ranks worth of advancement. It's the Scouts that come in to the Troop and complete advancement in T-2-1 but don't get the 1-2 requirements for T or 2 that loose their hand book that can be an issue. The advancement ASM watches for those outlier Scouts and periodically asks them to swing by and get Troop Master up to date.

[Buffalo Skipper 13]

I agree with Eagle92 that this ultimately is the responsiblity of the scout. However, if you look at the Patrol Record Book #605241, there are several pages of scout advancement. This book is for the PL, whose responsibilities include assisting members of his patrol advance.

 

Advancement for each troop is going to be different, in terms of their expectations and process. We gently encourage and remind our Scouts ("Brownies") to be completing Tenderfoot requirements. This is done throught the Patrol Leaders. As the scouts progress through the first ranks this happens less, with the expectation that the scout pursue this on his own; by the time the scout is working on First Class, they are expected to make this leap of repsonsiblity on their own. After all a First Class scout should be have the basic skills to thrive on his own.

 

We also have records on Troopmaster, and the tools (reports) provided with this product are key in tracking progress. Spotting scouts who are advancing and progressing regularly is easy; identifying those who may be struggling or floundering is not always so obvious. I look at these reports in one form or another nearly every week, and they give me an idea on whom I should be keeping an eye. Having these tools at my disposal, and seeing that they are up to date saves me a signifiant amount of time which I can then apply to seeing (ovserving) the scouts and leaders in action.

[Frank17 10]

In our Troop, we use Troopmaster but not in order to keep track of an individual scout's advancement for them. It is the scouts job to record and keep track of their own advancement and progress (good practice for the recordkeeping their Eagle Project will require). Troopmaster is excelling in planning trail to 1st class events, merit badge opportunities, and outings for the entire group. If we see that most of our newer scouts are falling behind in orientereing skills, we tell our SPL and suggest a geocaching trip to the PLC. If we need 1st aid skills, we suggest participating in 1st aid meets run by our council. We also run a Troop Trail to 1st Class camput one weekend that covers topics missing by most of the newer scouts, run by the Troop Guides and Instructors. We still have a few scouts who slip through the cracks with missing one or two items; their PLs assist them with finding opportunities for learning, but the scouts still have to put the effort forth.

[BrentAllen 10]

Advancement in the patrol can certainly be tied back to Patrol Method, and is a leadership issue for the PL. During our training, I ask the PLs to come up with a vision of success for their patrol. What would a successful patrol look like, and how would that patrol be better than the one they currently have.

 

The new PLs will struggle with this at the beginning, but after some discussion, we usually work around to the problems patrols experience on outings - not very skilled at cooking, slow in setting up camp, very slow in breaking camp, not efficient in camp clean-up, disorganized, etc... If they don't come to the realization on their own, I will ask "how many of these problems would you still have if every Scout in your patrol was a First Class Scout?" The PLs will soon see that a big part of their vision for success will involve getting their patrol members trained in the T-FC skills, which leads to them all being FC Scouts. So, yes, the Patrol Leader should be working with his Scouts on moving up the advancement trail, at least to FC.

 

We use both the books and Troopmaster. For our boys to be considered in uniform for the Honor Patrol competition, they must have their Scout book with them (as well as be in complete, correct uniform). During the patrol meeting, a PL that is on top of the ball will look at the boys' Scout books and see what they need to work on, and see if there will be opportunities during the upcoming campout. Does this happen all the time, without some reminding? No, not in our Troop, but I try to get the SPL to give them gentle reminders at appropriate times.

 

I can't imagine being SM without Troopmaster. We record all activities and attendance, including Troop meetings and service projects. Rank information exports straight into our Troop web page, so individuals, PLs and all Troop leaders can see where each boy is in working on their next rank. TM also helps me keep up with the status of each award - earned, reported to council, presented to the Scout. It also keeps track of our MB counselors, partial MBs, nights camped, miles hiked or canoed, and a million other things. We just have 26 Scouts; I can't imagine working with an even larger Troop without the program.(This message has been edited by BrentAllen)

[John-in-KC 311]

Eagle92,

 

You've not seen some of the advancement abortions I've seen from our Council clerical staff in the past decade.

 

ScoutNet may be the BSA database of record, but G-I-G-O applies, and if my unit is keeping accurate local records, I can reduce the garbage.

 

Troopmast has a place in the stuff a Troop uses.

[Eagle92 110]

John,

TRUST ME I know what the ways councils can screw up records My records were slightly screwed up (the registrar at the time would use the date inputed into the computer instead of the date on the AR) and had a good friend completely screwed up (they had him listed as a star scout on the charter for 3 years, despite repeated attempts to correct it.) In my case they had to use my photocopies of my handbook (don't ask; book went for a swim after LBOR ) And my buddy's book and ARs.

[Beavah 205]

Yah, just curious, for all yeh keyboard-tappers out there...

 

If you're usin' TroopMaster or somethin' else, how the heck do yeh do all that data entry?

 

I can see ranks and MBs.

 

But we're talkin' individual requirements here. That's about 45 per boy for T-2-1 if yeh don't count da fact that half the requirements have multiple sub-parts. If yeh count those, the data entry goes into the hundreds per scout.

 

Plus attendance records and uniform inspection records and days/nights campin' and MB partials...

 

Sounds like yeh need a full-time data entry staff.

 

Ain't it gettin' just a bit out of control?

 

Beavah

 

[John-in-KC 311]

B,

 

That's what the Troop Scribe is for. I cycled each Patrol through on a 2 week turnaround x N patrols in the Troop. I used the second side of paper that had hit our office recycle bin. He'd get with the Scout, pencil the changes, and give them to me. Events? He gave me the checkoff list he kept at departure assembly (or upon arrival), and after poking the event in, I used the databases drop-downs to update it. Took me about 30 minutes most weeks. Didn't worry about uniform inspections and some of the other stuff.

 

I've really had Scouts with bad records at Council. Because of some of the things our Council does, knowing a kid had made Star or Life MATTERED. I'm glad to be out of it, but I was glad to be doing it!

 

Hope that makes sense.

[Oak Tree 15]

We usually just catch the books up with TroopMaster periodically. When all the new Scouts are all making rapid progress at the beginning (after crossover) it doesn't matter too much, as you can just assume everyone needs everything. We definitely sync up the books and the program at advancement time, so when the new Scout gets Tenderfoot or Second Class, it's a good time to record what all First Class items he has done. Then after about six months, it gets to be a smaller set who still need various things, and our new Scout ASM will usually update things that he sees get accomplished. It doesn't keep things in perfect synchronicity, but TroopMaster is never too far behind.

 

Also, there are shortcuts in TroopMaster that speed things up. There is a "group credit" function, where you can give a whole set of Scouts a date for completing a requirement. There are also shortcut date entry methods, like 'L' for the last (previous) date you typed, or 'T' for today's date.