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Showing results for 'Owasippe'.
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LH writes: "I do apologize Jim, if your going to dis a man you should get his name right." ********* Yes, it is rather important to get names correct. I guess how important it is for you to dis someone is a judgement call that only you can make. Take the best shots you can man. I can take it. ********* LH further writes: "Late 70's early 80's Blue Lake Township rezoned the property from what ever it was to a higher rate. Chicago Area Council requested for years to have the zoning changed BLT refused." and also wrote: "I was angry when Blue Lake Township or
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eolesen writes: "To keep all of Owasippe tax exempt, the land could be subdivided into 400 acre parcels, with individual councils and other not-for-profits owning them. If CAC is unable to sell it as residential property, I don't know if they'll still go forward with selling it. If they do, someone should be lobbying the state to just buy it as a wildlife refuge..." ********* There are many alternatives to the sale of the property by the CAC for residential development. However, the Chicago Scouts have decided to invest what I believe is close to $1-million of their money
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Gold Winger writes: "A group of people have banded together to try to save this camp from becoming yet another place for people to park their BMWs and SUVs. CAC and the potential saviours are battling it out as we speak." This is not totally correct. The so called "potential saviours" and the CAC are NOT battling. It is correct to say that a group of people have banded together to prevent what is describe AND to make it possible for a Scout summer camp to operate under the Owasippe banner as it has for almost 100 years. The so called battle is between the township and the CAC.
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I do apologize Jim, if your going to dis a man you should get his name right. As for the OOEC is was presented to the public as being organized to save the camp not just the land. If the OOEC feels that calling what ever they were to set up "Owasippe" would make up for the loss of the camp then I guess I'm just a romantic because I don't Late 70's early 80's Blue Lake Township rezoned the property from what ever it was to a higher rate. Chicago Area Council requested for years to have the zoning changed BLT refused. 1990 (?)BLT agreed to rezone to reduce the tax on the camp. When CAC annou
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The State of Michigan allows not-for-profits to hold 400 acres of land tax free That's a fair amount of land. Texas's limitations are 1,000 acres for an organization in any one county, and there is only one scout camp I can think of that exceeds that (Sid Richardson or SR2, which is 2500 acres). To keep all of Owasippe tax exempt, the land could be subdivided into 400 acre parcels, with individual councils and other not-for-profits owning them. If CAC is unable to sell it as residential property, I don't know if they'll still go forward with selling it. If they do, someone shou
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Gold Wing, I realize you are relatively new to planet Earth. Owasippe is in the state of Michigan. Thats the one that sorta looks like a mitten in the middle of the Great lakes, well Lake Michigan on the west side and Lake Huron on the east with a touch of Lake Erie as well
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LH - First of all I don't know who you address as Joe. Then, I want to repeat something from two years ago, "I believe that the Owasippe Outdoor Education Center was created as an effort to find a single solution that satisfies all interested parties. Fundimental to the OOEC effort is that the property remain zoned FR-I, not rezoned to allow residential development. Don't get me wrong. I'd love to see the Council recind the sale and go forth with a long-range redevelopment plan for the Owasippe property. It is something that could have been done decades ago." Nothing I hav
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>>It is the members of the Chicago Council who want the houses built.<< Some people just can't see past their own noses Joe. You post in a Scouting forum and for many years were one of us but on this issue you just can't see past your nose. IF those "save OWASIPPE" signs were actually intended to mean SAVE BLUE LAKE TOWNSHIP the I say those involved are as much a bunch of hypocrites as are the Executive Board that started all this. IF those originators of the save OWASIPPE campaign sought to use the name and emotional power associated with it to champion their fight then I hope Sto
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LH says: "I wish this court case was about saving the camp but it is not." *************** Some Chicago Area Council members attempted to go the course of "saving the camp". They failed to do so from within the Council. The local community, as well as some from the Chicago Area Council, worked together to preserve the Owasippe property intact with the goal of having the property available for controlled use by Scouts, other youth and the public. ########################## LH further states: "The fight to preserve the "camp" found little support from the locals whe
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I wish this court case was about saving the camp but it is not. >>Chicago Council is selling the property and this entire trial is centered on the value of the property and a zoning issue. Nothing more. << The fight to preserve the "camp" found little support from the locals when it was determined that associating the Blue Lake Township issues with the governance issues concerning the sale of the camp under any circumstances could jeopardize the "zoning issue" case. The signs are still up "Save Owasippe" but if you read this entire thread you'll see that "Owasippe" no longer
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Friday was the final day of testimony in the matter of the Chicago Area Council vs. Blue Lake Township in the 14th Circuit Court of Michigan. CAC is the Plaintiff. The trial was reduced from around nine issues down to two legal points by Judge William Marietti. The judge dismissed the other Plaintiff claims. The issues in the trial were: 1) Was the zoning of "Forest Recreational - Institutional" for the Owasippe property (one of five camps so zoned in the township)arbitrary and cappricious? and 2) Was such zoning by the township a "taking" of the value of the property? Closi
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I'd say you get whole cloth red felt at the store and make a larger vest when a boy grows out of the smaller version. The Scout Shop does have vests in XL but you may need to make even bigger ons for some scouts. Side note one of the patches on the red vest in the picture that comes with the store bought vest is from Owasippe my council camp. If the boys would wear patches on their Red Wool Jacket why would they have necessarily out grown wearing them on a red vest that fit? As a scout we wanted our patches unused for trading purposes but I earned several very striking patches from events and
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I cetainly can not speak for Long Term but I will speak for myself. Above I have given the reasons I feel it is important for the Owasippe property, and a program of Scout camping and summer staff experience, be continued in that location further into the 21nd Century. While the politics in Chicago Council seems to burden the comments I made in opposition to my reasoning....so be it. I'm all for Owasippe being a place for BSA members (AND MANY MORE YOUTH) to available in the future. I have no economic or other vested interest in the Owasippe property as has been suggested b
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Jschlich, My concern is to determine where your priorities lie and why. As for the testimony in court please remember that our SE and Executive board have been saying different things for the last 7 years much of which turned out to be absolutely the opposite of what they actually have done. The firm assurances that neither Hoover or Owasippe were being considered for sale while at that very time Hoover had already been listed and Owasippe was in the process of being surveyed prior to sale, being only one. If the "Council" is forced to accept a 7 million dollar reduction in their proce
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From the OOEC web site; Will Owasippe continue to be used as a Boy Scout camp? Yes, we certainly hope so. Owasippe will offer outstanding programs and facilities and will make them available to any BSA Council or individual Scout Troop or Venture Crew. The OOEC would assure that the Owasippe facilities, staff and operations will meet or exceed the National Standards of the BSA before making it available to Scouts. The OOEC would love to have the Chicago Area Council as an anchor client. We have no reason to think that Boy Scouts will stop wanting to use the property for summer camping, a
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I would like to make something clear once again. There are two separate concerns pertaining to "Owasippe". One concerns 4765 acres of land in Michigan's Manestee National Forest and one concerns a BOY SCOUT CAMP which has been in existence since 1911. When Jschlich speaks about saving Owasippe, and he speaks about the formation of the OOEC (Owasippe Outdoor Education Center)he speaks about 4765 acres of land. Jschlich is a resident of Blue Lake Township in which Owasippe exists. He says that >>"There is no concerted effort to stop the sale of Owasippe...the controversy is about the build
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First let me reply to eolesen's post. Owasippe is right about 200 miles from Chicago it's about a 3.5 hr drive. Our neighbor to the north, NorthEast Illinois Council has it's Summer camp in Pearson Wisconsin about 285 miles away at 5 hours drive and they are expanding. A foot note is that the current SE from CAC was SE in NEIC and did try to sell their camp but was stopped by the executive board. As for the elections.... After the slate was turned down National sent a representative to "speak" with the voting members. The voting members were told in no uncertain terms that; Our SE would remain
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I'm going to leave comment about the governance issues and election to someone closer to what transpired in Chicago earlier this year. All I really know is that a new Board and all was elected and took their seats in March. **** Concerning the overall concerns and background that "eolesen" brought up: The "Save Owasippe" campaign is very wide across the region and was most evidence of the supported of the campaign begins at the residences adjacent to the Owasippe property. The Chicago Council has voted to sell the Owasippe property and the legal actions are all centered ar
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I have only been following this since July... My brother and nephew were with a troop from NWSC that attends Camp Wolverine each year, and I had to drive up there to pick up my nephew for a family event near Grand Rapids. On the way into the camp, just about all of the houses had "Save Owasippe" signs, and after asking, my brother filled me in on the rest. I can understand why CAC might be reluctant to retain ownership of the camp. At 200 miles and about four hours of driving from Chicago, it's not exactly convenient for use as a council camp. But, it's sad to see land of that size
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The waters are rising and running bright green with the monies being spent by both sides in the battle. Currently this case is in its second week before a judge in the 14th Circuit Court in Muskegon Michigan. The Chicago Area Council attorneys, along with the Scout executive and Council President have been trying to convince the court that the development and creation of 1278 residential sites and the influx of a projected 3604 residents on the 4765acres now comprising the Owasippe Scout Reservation would not negatively impact the community. It is the Councils position that the 4765 acres i
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Time has passed. How goes Chicago Area Council and Camp Owasippe? ""How high's the water, mama?""
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I don't know what Owasippe looks likes, but any location will have to be predominantly flat. The great majority of Jambo volunteers are not young! Adopting a site that is hilly or rugged would be a disaster in the making.
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Maybe National could buy Owasippe?
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A friend of mine saw my post here and reminded me that White Hall MIchigan is practically on the WEST shore of Lake Michigan. 10 miles east would make for a mighty soggy camp! Owasippe lies to the WEST of White Hall. Actually I should say Camps becasue we have more than one on the reservation. Camp Black Hawk is a dinning hall camp with swimming in Big Blue Lake. Camp Wolverine the meals are delivered to your site three times a day so it's troop camping without the cooking and cleaning. Swimming is in a pool. I believe a troop can still arrange to use Camp Hiawatha Beach which is lone tro
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The saga goes on. Shortly before the opening of th 96th year at Owasippe the new President of the Chicago Area Council released an "Open Letter" to the local community around Owasippe. The letter asks for comment from the community. Getting an update fom the community is always welcome and certainly strikes a conciliatory tone. At the same time the Chicago Council is rabidly pressing forth with long and intense legal depositions of the Township Officials. I guess that is also is a way to collect comments from the local community but, it is a rather distasteful method to use
