CA_Scouter

Ya, everything Beav reported plus:

We don't always backpack, but we we try to do more of that then car camp.

We sometimes bring dutch ovens when we car camp, though we still use the lightweight gear for other cooking.

We don't bring axes when we backpack, don't need 'em. Fires are small in the backcountry and sometimes we can't have 'em due to conditions.

ANYONE CAN CAR CAMP. Challenge yourself! Teach your guys to do more with less. If you can't teach 'em, learn with 'em. ( its actually OK for the adults to learn new things in scouts too.. ;-) )

Going lightweight generates a TON of skillbases - equipment use and care, lighter gear, clothing, menus, menus, menus and more...

*disclaimer* the previous opinion is for the sole enjoyment of the audience and is not intended in any way to diagnose or treat any existing or imagined condition. Opinions are like belly buttons: everyone's got one. ;-)

Now E92, you know you cannot 'add to' nor 'delete from' BSA!

( or did I mess that up again!?! )

;-)

STRIVE to own as little gear as humanly possible! More gear means more crap to sift through, more paperwork to hassle with, more adult interference, etc.

Lightweight, lightweight, lightweight. Support BSA in the Leave No Trace policy. You leave a large trace if the weight of your gear leaves dents in the earth!

Purchase good quality lightweight gear from REI, Campmor, etc. REI has these 4 qt lightweight pots that we use..we try for one pot meals.. we usually have 2 stoves/pots per patrol. We don't cook breakfast on the trail, only boil water in the morning. These guys can suffer thru a day or two without bacon, eggs and warm toast.

Anyone can 'seige camp' as I call it. Even if you go car camping, the lightweight gear means less time for packing are more time for fun!

1. don't know

2. We keep the med forms in a large sealed manila envelope, with instructions that its not to be opened unless an emergency arises. Travel binders are handed out at the start of the activity and returned at the end.

well I can certainly see from where he gets his immaturity... ;-)

That's not a pack, that's a small CITY!

$15 a year is $1.25 a month.

I can find that in my couch.

IMHO - For what BSA does they could charge a lot more.

Say Blade, you want some cheese with that whine?

Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't:

Prior to my involvement with the troop, a family received a 'campership' for summer camp. The week after they flew to Dizzyland on vacation. The SM was P-O'd big time.

We did a payment plan for one family but they approached us about a month before summer camp. We had a heckuva time getting paid back and don't think we ever got all the money ( the kid quit ).

We've had another family pay an extra $20/month in dues, which we held for them for summer camp. That worked out well for both parties.

This year one of our new crossover parents was annoyed that we didn't offer a full ride for her foster son. Sorry lady.

With you having several scouts needing assistance, you'll have to come up with some type of solid criteria that is fair to all, maybe partial assistance from the troop and a payment plan for the rest.

Outstanding ! Treating your scout as a responsible young man rather than a lawsuit waiting to happen? Unbelieveable. Next thing you know they start wanting to let patrols go backpacking on their own... ( or will they???? ) .......

1. Yes. ( blasphemy, heresey, hang him from the yardarm, off with yer head )

I have one scout who earned his Eagle just before 18 and is now an ASM until he goes away to college in August. I don't have the heart to tell his mom, who waited patiently all these years, that the patch has to come off.

2. Yes, 1975.

1. Maybe one was upside down.

2. Maybe one of you was a left leaning commie liberal.

3. Maybe one of you was a right leaning dolphin killing hawk.

2a/3a - maybe the combination of both ?????

4. Perhaps you and the other guy are polar opposites.

;-)

I would say that article reflects a 'holier than thou' attitude.

I have been doing some thinking on this and have arrived at a valid solution.

I will no longer fight the battle, but will insist that they all have the same device:

http://www.iwood3b.com/index.php

We rented 2 vans last year for a trip to Yellowstone and had multiple drivers. I put together a list of all the potential drivers, their insurance info, DL #, etc. and submitted that with the National Tour Permit. I put 'see attached' on the application. Worked out just fine.

I can neither confirm nor deny the use of cell phones in my troop.

Example: We do a 'play' outing at the local gym. Reserve the basketball court and we run drills for a bit then play a full court game for a while. During drills, ol' Jeremy is texting somebody, not paying attention, and WHAM bball hits him on the side of the head. No damage just the normal confused look I get out of him... ;-) Misuse of cell phone is dangerous, yes?

I am fighting a losing battle though. I can't say it enough times but I still see the phones at meetings, however, I don't really see the scouts using them, so maybe its not as big a problem as I perceive.

I've even thought of EMBRACING their use, mostly for task lists, reminders, etc. Just thinking about it though...

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/14/us/14explorers.html?_r=2&hp

Scouts Train to Fight Terrorists, and More

IMPERIAL, Calif. Ten minutes into arrant mayhem in this town near the Mexican border, and the gunman, a disgruntled Iraq war veteran, has already taken out two people, one slumped in his desk, the other covered in blood on the floor.

The responding officers eight teenage boys and girls, the youngest 14 face tripwire, a thin cloud of poisonous gas and loud shots BAM! BAM! fired from behind a flimsy wall. They move quickly, pellet guns drawn and masks affixed.

United States Border Patrol! Put your hands up! screams one in a voice cracking with adolescent determination as the suspect is subdued.

It is all quite a step up from the square knot.

The Explorers program, a coeducational affiliate of the Boy Scouts of America that began 60 years ago, is training thousands of young people in skills used to confront terrorism, illegal immigration and escalating border violence an intense ratcheting up of one of the groups longtime missions to prepare youths for more traditional jobs as police officers and firefighters.

This is about being a true-blooded American guy and girl, said A. J. Lowenthal, a sheriffs deputy here in Imperial County, whose life clock, he says, is set around the Explorers events he helps run. It fits right in with the honor and bravery of the Boy Scouts.

The training, which leaders say is not intended to be applied outside the simulated Explorer setting, can involve chasing down illegal border crossers as well as more dangerous situations that include facing down terrorists and taking out active shooters, like those who bring gunfire and death to college campuses. In a simulation here of a raid on a marijuana field, several Explorers were instructed on how to quiet an obstreperous lookout.

Put him on his face and put a knee in his back, a Border Patrol agent explained. I guarantee that hell shut up.

One participant, Felix Arce, 16, said he liked the discipline of the program, which was something he said his life was lacking. I want to be a lawyer, and this teaches you about how crimes are committed, he said.

Cathy Noriego, also 16, said she was attracted by the guns. The group uses compressed-air guns known as airsoft guns, which fire tiny plastic pellets in the training exercises, and sometimes they shoot real guns on a closed range.

I like shooting them, Cathy said. I like the sound they make. It gets me excited.

If there are critics of the content or purpose of the law enforcement training, they have not made themselves known to the Explorers national organization in Irving, Tex., or to the volunteers here on the ground, national officials and local leaders said. That said, the Explorers have faced problems over the years. There have been numerous cases over the last three decades in which police officers supervising Explorers have been charged, in civil and criminal cases, with sexually abusing them.

Several years ago, two University of Nebraska criminal justice professors published a study that found at least a dozen cases of sexual abuse involving police officers over the last decade. Adult Explorer leaders are now required to take an online training program on sexual misconduct.

Many law enforcement officials, particularly those who work for the rapidly growing Border Patrol, part of the Homeland Security Department, have helped shape the programs focus and see it as preparing the Explorers as potential employees. The Explorer posts are attached to various agencies, including the Federal Bureau of Investigation and local police and fire departments, that sponsor them much the way churches sponsor Boy Scout troops.

Our end goal is to create more agents, said April McKee, a senior Border Patrol agent and mentor at the session here.

Membership in the Explorers has been overseen since 1998 by an affiliate of the Boy Scouts called Learning for Life, which offers 12 career-related programs, including those focused on aviation, medicine and the sciences.

But the more than 2,000 law enforcement posts across the country are the Explorers most popular, accounting for 35,000 of the groups 145,000 members, said John Anthony, national director of Learning for Life. Since the attacks of Sept. 11, 2001, and the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, many posts have taken on an emphasis of fighting terrorism and other less conventional threats.

Before it was more about the basics, said Johnny Longoria, a Border Patrol agent here. But now our emphasis is on terrorism, illegal entry, drugs and human smuggling.

The law enforcement posts are restricted to those ages 14 to 21 who have a C average, but there seems to be some wiggle room. I will take them at 13 and a half, Deputy Lowenthal said. I would rather take a kid than possibly lose a kid.

The law enforcement programs are highly decentralized, and each post is run in a way that reflects the culture of its sponsoring agency and region. Most have weekly meetings in which the children work on their law-enforcement techniques in preparing for competitions. Weekends are often spent on service projects.

Just as there are soccer moms, there are Explorers dads, who attend the competitions, man the hamburger grill and donate their land for the simulated marijuana field raids. In their training, the would-be law-enforcement officers do not mess around, as revealed at a recent competition on the state fairgrounds here, where a Ferris wheel sat next to the police cars set up for a felony investigation.

Their hearts pounding, Explorers moved down alleys where there were hidden paper targets of people pointing guns, and made split-second decisions about when to shoot. In rescuing hostages from a bus taken over by terrorists, a baby-faced young girl screamed, Separate your feet! as she moved to handcuff her suspect.

In a competition in Arizona that he did not oversee, Deputy Lowenthal said, one role-player wore traditional Arab dress. If were looking at 9/11 and what a Middle Eastern terrorist would be like, he said, then maybe your role-player would look like that. I dont know, would you call that politically incorrect?

Authenticity seems to be the goal. Imperial County, in Southern California, is the poorest in the state, and the local economy revolves largely around the criminal justice system. In addition to the sheriff and local police departments, there are two state prisons and a large Border Patrol and immigration enforcement presence.

My uncle was a sheriffs deputy, said Alexandra Sanchez, 17, who joined the Explorers when she was 13. Alexandras police uniform was baggy on her lithe frame, her airsoft gun slung carefully to the side. She wants to be a coroner.

I like the idea of having law enforcement work with medicine, she said. This is a great program for me.

And then she was off to another bus hijacking.

Next Article in US (1 of 38) A version of this article appeared in print on May 14, 2009, on page A1 of the New York edition.

Red Green lives! Long live Red Green!

http://www.redgreen.com/OnlineStore/index.cfm?app=cart&a=list&categoryID=1

I'm thinking you feel guilty about losing your cool because it was out of character for you and you are trying to project a good image to the scouts and parents in your troop.

Only you can gauge the degree to how far you might have stepped out of line. From your description looks like 'not much'. A little frustration spilling over from an unruly and uncooperative kid. It happens.

You may simply want to address you raising your voice, but you should also bring the kid's unruliness into the conversation. Make sure you mention that he is one of many in the troop and that you need cooperation from all in order to have a fun and succesful time. Simple stuff like that. Make sure you don't entertain any mention of special consideration for the kid.

Yea, Beav I started to write a longer post in defense of my position and thought better of it. Just want to point out that I made my post AFTER my son had ALREADY secured 4 letters of recommendation. I am not embarassed about that.

Generally I agree with your post.

WAS ignorant ????!!????

UPDATE:

Son had Eagle BOR last night and is now the newest Eagle Scout in America ! ( unless someone from Hawaii did one last night )

;-)

The BOR was held the same night as a Council meeting, so the District Executive himself was on the BOR.

We are a happy family. Son now joins Dad and Uncle as Eagles and I have 2 more nephews at Life and Star who we hope will continue their advancement.

WooHoo!

Had a scout last year who had the project planned but was dragging his feet on starting the physical work. Did a car wash for funding in late October, started the physical work on the project first week in Dec and finished last week of Dec. Turned in his Eagle app on Friday, turned 18 on Sunday.

I received several gray hairs on this one!

Note to LisaBob... nothing gets a guy's hair on the back of his neck to stand on end than a woman raising her eyebrows. My wife's are registered with the Sheriff's dept. ;-)

OK, humble pie time. You'll get a laugh out of this!

I get a call from the DAC Sunday night. Hoo Boy! I'm excited, we're gonna get the BOR done this week. I am so relieved.

EXCEPT - He tells me the paperwork hasn't come back from council yet, but can I serve on an Eagle BOR for another scout on Tuesday night?

BOING!

So I figure the Big Guy is testing me. I know that patience is a virtue and that sometimes I'm in short supply.

So I accept the invite and I was fortunate to meet a fine young man whom we approved for his Eagle Rank last night.

DAC got the paperwork yesterday and Son's BOR is tomorrow night.

Neil, coupla things... I didn't mean to come across as angry, just frustrated.

1) We had the application ready April 1. With the runaround with the letters, we did not get it submitted until this last Tuesday.

2) Yes, but the procedure is vaguely worded. I flew off the handle a bit when I posted this originally, hence the VENT at the end of my subject line.

3) Yes, but I think that submitting this 8 weeks prior to her leaving is a reasonable amount of lead time. Our council usually turns these around in 2-3 weeks and then we get it back from Irving in usually 2 weeks. My last two Eagles had this turnaround time.

I think your admonition is a bit out of place. I did not expect them to move heaven and earth but to accept the 4 letters of recommendation we submitted the first time. My son was asked to submit two more, from an adult leader and from a teacher, and to be safe, he asked 2 persons in each category, so now he has 8. These were accepted last Tuesday.

Yes, I'm aware that the Board of Review date is what counts. I've been doing this for a while and know such things. He turns 18 in August so he must have that BOR in the first week of May.

All this being said, the DAC worked with my son to verify all numbers and dates on the application last Tuesday so they could turn it around quickly. He has indicated he should be able to get the BOR done next week.

I have not said anything to the DAC and despite my initial frustrations I will not say anything about the delay at all. I may at some point suggest that the wording on their 'cheat sheet' be adjusted to be less ambiguous but that's about it. I've learned a lot from the posters on this thread and am fortunate to have this resource available so I don't shoot my mouth off unneccessarily.

;-)

Thanks All!

We've actually been trying to get the school to break for us! ;-)

We are similar to Jblake. An outing every month of the year, meetings almost every Monday, High Adventure, Camporee, Summer Camp, etc. We don't really see a drop off in attendance in the summer, its pretty consistent all year round.

Ye old Scoutmaster tries to schedule the Monday of the NCAA Men's BB final to be one of those 'off' weeks, but has not been very successful. I did get the Committee to move a COH to the next week one time though...