cajuncody

"The term 'banned skits' will be forever banned forthwith from all Scouting Events. Especially Council Camporees. " -- this was posted in Fixin Scouting thread and struck home for me.

I had never heard of banned skits until NCS when one group of adults did the banana/bandana skit and the instructors told us it was inappropriate as there could be a "hungry" scout in the group that shouldn't see food wasted in such a way. I thought at the time that that was taking PC too far but mayhaps I was wrong (it has happened before). What is the consensus of this group about banned skits and which skits are your refering too?

Kristi

Juris says --" I improved the recruiting program by asking my high ranking scouts to serve as Den Leaders in the Packs, so they can influence the Cub scouts to join the best troop in the district"

Just how old were these "high ranking scouts"?

Kristi

It was the annual planning meeting and I would say that yes someone went. That someone should have been your SE with a small group with him. The memo about the race (before it happened) inviting councils to participate was addressed to the Scout Exec.

Kristi

No good news, just more delays. It seems that the letter that is supposed to be going out from National is still sitting on someones desk waiting for a signature. A month after the cars disapeared and still no begining to the search on the part of national.

If someone could give me a list of all the councils and their phone numbers I could clear this up in a week.

Frustrated in Tn

Kristi

I have taken YPT 2 times in the past year (my card never made it to council so I took it from my council's web site to print it out). I have also within the past year taken : NLE, Leaderspecific, Safe Swim Defense, CPR, First Aid, and have been to National Camp School to be Camp Director. All of this training is current and yet very little dealt with the buddy system. The only Lost Scout training I received was at National Camp School which most Scouters never attend. I think that it would be a good idea for the BSA to include Lost Scout training in YPT because it is much easier to find a lost boy within minutes of his becoming lost then when the "local authorities" arrive.

It may be common sense to catch a lone scout walking through camp but our YPT says no one on one, I think a lone scout heading down a trail would be a good exception to that rule, not go find another adult and hope to catch up with him. Simple things have been overlooked in the list of LDS scouts missing or killed that could have prevented those incidence. For example if the clmbing tower instructor had immediatly checked on the scout that was having problems getting unhooked when his friends walked off he may have been found sooner and closer to camp and I would be willing to bet that what I just typed went through his head as the search went on. We need to take the "What ifs" and plan to use them.

Just my 2 cents.

Kristi

I favor our councils camp here in East Tennessee, Camp Buck Toms. could just be that it is close to home

http://www.campbucktoms.org/

Kristi

For the type of drills that you are talking about I would suggest pawn shops, yard sales, estate sales, and the flea market. You can pick them up for about a buck there and just oil and sharpen most of them back into condition. Just be sure to test them for usage to be safe.

The only problem with this plan is it is not one stop shopping, but, heck, you have all year. . .

Kristi

The only problem I see is coming from the leaders. The leaders are there to lead. They are also there to make sure the rules are followed. Each incident could have been prevented had the leaders done their job. Unfortunatly there is nothing that can be done by the BSA to force leaders to comply as leadership is solely the responsiblity of the CO. The CO needs to step up and tell these leaders they are not there to be a buddy to the boys and throw the rule book to the wind. It is up to them to insure that rules are followed and boys are kept safe whether they like it or not.

No safety harness . . . no climb

Not physically able . . . No acitivity

No Buddy . . . No going

Throwing logs in a river . . . just plain no.

I don't know how many boys I sent back to den leaders with a spare den chief at day camp when they were caught without their buddy, I lost count but I didn't lose a scout. If we leaders don't enforce the rules the boys sure won't do it for us.

Kristi

I would be interested to know what type of training differences there are in the LDS troops. It seems that most of these are from poor judgment calls and out and out blatent mistakes on the part of adults.

1. Why were they pushing logs in the river? That would create a hazard further down the river and I wouldn't allow my boys to do it and the news said that adults were present.

2. No safety helment or harness? Shouldn't have happened.

3. Not supervised and no buddy.

4. No buddy system and adult sent him back to camp alone.

5 and 6 Buddy system not in place or well used

7 Leader left him behind to pick him up on return trip???!!! Shouldn't have happened

8 Lack of supervision

9 not equiped for the trip and passed a sign that warned them about needing water.

10 group should have canceled the trip after finding water levels much higher than normal but did not

11 This boy had a cast on 1 of his hands at the time yet was unsupervised and unsecured during the climb

This says to me that leaders are not doing their jobs and that there is a major failure somewhere on the part of adults.

Kristi

Ya know, I was in the Home Depot store down the road about 2 months ago and my son tripped and fell on an aerator that some foolish employee had left sitting with its tines up. He punctured his bottom and it bled profusly. I know you may be wondering what this has to do with this thread but bear with me.

I went to the manager and asked for a bandaid and he wanted to know why I needed one so I told him. They wouldn't give me a bandaid untill I filled out a 4 page "Accident report".

My 5 year old son was standing there bleeding and they were more concerned with covering their legal behinds that his needs were put aside. Things like this happen (along with that line on the BSA Registration) because we live in a society where the first answer to most is to sue someone. I would be interested to know when that line was put on the registration and how that time frame compare to the sue generation.

Kristi(This message has been edited by cajuncody)

Here in TN we have the photo ID similar to the Drivers Lic. It is taken at the DOT and made on the same type card with the digital photo printed directly on the card. You need the SS card and the Birth Cert. and there is a small fee ($10) the one change we have is that you get an ID number on the card that stays with you to become your drivers lic. number eventually. They will make these cards for the younger children also.

Kristi

Sorry, I need to clarify, I sent that last message on my way out the door. The reason I said "Out of your hands" is because I meant that personally to the poster, the troop/unit/pack will still have responsibility here. Since the poster refered to the SM and CC I was assuming (bad to do I know) that meant the poster had a much lesser position in the group and I really think that the council folks and SE will probably deal with the pack leadership from the top down (as was done in my area not too long ago).

As far as what to do on upcoming camp outs, I would invite both sets of parents to come along and help. Then it would be easy to have the boys bunk in with their parents. The only problem with this is that it would call attention to the boys yet again. Of couse who knows if they will even attend after all is said and done.

Kristi

Sorry for your lack of response. I am not all that familiar with the patrol method as I work with Cubs and my oldest is just now a Bear. I do read all of the other posts, not just the Cub program posts, to learn about the program for my son in a few years but I don't consider myself qualified to answer that question. Don't lose heart!

Kristi

Well, the stuff will probably hit the fan anyway but here is what I would do (regardless of my position in the pack) I would call the SE (council will connect you) then I would set up a meeting for all adults in the pack/troop and do Youth Protection Training. At the training I wouldn't mention and particular incident just do the training only. The training itself will tell everyone involved what should have happened without telling those who don't already know what they shouldn't know. I would end with a few words about confidentiality and it would end there as the situation will be out of your hands and in the hands of the SE where it belongs.

Kristi

Wingnut,

I covered Hug a Tree and Survive last year with my pack and even handed out fanny packs with surveyor tape, trash bags, and whistles in them for hiking and camping. I think that wrapping surveyor tape around a water bottle is a good idea. Any thing that helps to remind a boy to stay in one spot is a good idea. If this scout in UT had stayed put when he realized he was lost he would have been found quicker.

In my program we use the surveyor tape to tie to the tree you are hugging so that you can go that far (about 25 foot ) to relieve yourself or to possibly find water. It is much better than walking over to a ditch then to a creek as you have just moved more than 25 foot and have no way of knowing where you started from.

If all scouts would use the buddy system and the hug a tree system it would be a perfect world where no one would be lost.

Kristi

No, unfortunatly nothing new to report with the exception that the grand total now missing is up to 36 cars and the National Office just now (nearly a month after the incident) prepared letters to go out to the different councils to try to track down these cars. The delay really bothers me because anything could have happened to the cars by now.

My council received the trophy this week and we are trying to arrange a party for my son for the presentation of said trophy. I don't see any bright lights at the end of the tunnel yet. Please keep spreading the word and maybe these cars will be found.

Still searching . . .

Kristi

Yes, I think the Pintos did go boom alot. But mostly I think that was on purpose.

Kristi

Um, who is Juris and who keeps asking him all these questions?

In al seriousness, I don't really find any part of the BSA program useless.

Kristi

What really bothers me isn't Politics and Scouting, It is the politics that people put in scouting. When you plan an event and inadvertantly "step on someone's toes". Or when you try and improve an event and someone acts like you are reinventing the wheel. I understand that there are "old ways" but they don't have to be the only way. And just because you have been a volunteer for a while doesn't mean that you own the program/event/troop and any changes have to go through you.

Kristi

I would add a suggestion to check out a local Boys and Girls Club if available. They do a wonderful job with mixed groups using things such as "Power Hour" (study time), games, sports, and other activities.

Kristi

OOhH OOHH! Pick my pack! Pick my pack! We would love to have you.

Seriously, go ahead and join now, the experience you gain early will help you with your son in scouting. Plus early training is always the best.

Kristi

Lead by example. I always wear mine and so does my son.

Also it helps to have a cute girl scout say how handsome the boys look in uniform.

Kristi

Wow. Deja Vu

Many years ago my beloved mother (God Rest Her Soul) had a new mustang GT. Sweet Car, brand new 1989 (didn't realize it had been so long ago). Anyway, she brought it home from grocery shopping with a full tank of gas. 7 hours later it self ignited in our driveway. As we lived in rural TN we had several fire extinguishers and managed to put it out before the fire dept got there. Insurance company said "Don't worry, we can rebuild it" and they did but it was never the same, always had bugs after that (as if self igniting wasn't a big enough bug) and she finally got rid of it. Really a big case of Deja Vu to hear about Ford problems like this as Ford denied any problem with her Mustang.

I drive a Dodge

Kristi(This message has been edited by cajuncody)

Um, well you see, the current director is the former CM of my pack so he is in the loop on this whole project. I sent that email out as a "reply to all" email to the email from our Roundtable commish and didn't take the time to check to see if his email was on it as the original email was supposed to go to all leaders in our district. I didn't send him a seperate email as we have a staff meeting for this years camp tomorrow and I prefered to cover my ambitions with him personally there. A blanket email to him wouldn't do justice to the multitude of questions I have for him. He has also said he will be "taking me under his wing" this week at camp and passing along what knowledge he can to me there. Again, that would seem a much better time to go over change of venue with him rather than in an email. I also sent a seperate email to my DE who is the camp admin. to check with him on some other questions as he probabaly won't be at the staff meeting. I didn't post that email here, maybe I should have as you seem to imply that I am sneaking around doing this behind someones back.

Something else that I didn't post here is that I hope to pass out camp evaluation forms at the end of this years camp to get some more feedback. (With the current camp directors approval of course.)

I just want to improve on camp. Since you are from my district would you like to volunteer now for next year?

Kristi(This message has been edited by cajuncody)

It is a 4 day evening only camp for Cubs. This coming years theme is Cubs and Bugs.

Kristi