BulldogBlitz

We've got a patrol of older scouts - 15, 16, 17. They are Star and Life (recently awarded Life). They begrudgingly come to meetings at a decent clip; however, they sit off in the corner and make snide comments during the meeting. Their attention span is non-existent. I can tell they have been coddled, I can see the egg shells all around them. In talking with another leader tonight, I got most of the scoop.

They are bored out of their minds. They were scattered in the troop, and when there was a large influx of new members, the adult leaders thought it best to get these older guys in their own patrol. One recent BOR, one of the scouts was asked what he thought about his patrol. He explained that he had some ideas about doing things, on their own, on their level of interest - no details were given. That BOR was 6 weeks ago, nothing has been done to this point.

Tonight, the new SM stood to speak. It was obvious by the (very quiet) comments, they don't care for the new approach (not that they cared for the other SM either). It seems to me that these scouts are hanging on by a thread (or are tied on to that thread by their parents). Any guidance for inspiring these scouts who have much vested time in the program?

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Next month the troop is having a "Survivor" campout. The patrols will start out with their sleeping bags and water bottle. They will acquire things like food, fire and shelter during the course of the weekend. Periodically scouts will be "injured" and will need to be correctly treated. Most of the outdoor skills will be a part of the game. "

this sounds so very similar to the camporees that i remember as a scout in the mid 80s.

since boys can't be retested (or so i've read somewhere here), are they really supposed to have any skills at first class other than those most directly related to the rank requirements of first class? i know i'd expect more than i should. i would expect them to have a full compliment of basic troop camping skills... just getting their first taste of patrol leadership.

"Move on! Who care what the colors are.. We are in this for the boys! Arent we? "

i'm sorry, but i am only in it for the epaulets and bolos. ;p

what is it with this phrase:

"I climbed Mount Baldy (during daylight)"

is there something to day/night? i served on the trail crew in the mid 80s and don't recall anyone specifying if there was daylight when they topped baldy.

how is "come back to scouting" defined? come back as a scout? 1-100. come back as an adult? i'll take 1-50. coming back as an adult depends greatly upon their son's involvement though, I'm not sure i've met anyone who got bored with the program at first class who came back without a vested interest.

Since laser tag is a prohibited activity, encourage the boys to throw tomahawks instead. They might get a kick out of the exposure to an activity which is out of the ordinary for most city-fied scouts.

i'd just be too tempted to walk through there and ask all those "friendly" locals to give me half of their most recent paycheck. most of them make more than i do, which makes it unfair (boohoo) ... so it is only fair that their wealth get redistributed to me.

"Knives, axes, guns, arrows (bows without arrows are okay), rope and fire should all be banned as potentially hazardous. Swimming also since you can drown or pick up a disease from the water. Hiking should go away as well because you can get sunburned."

can we add sarcasm to the "banned" list?

swimming with concrete shoes is just as an important skill to learn as tomahawk throwing, maybe that should be a side by side event.

must be a district or council druther then.... there seems to be an issue with us having an adult with two caps (those specific caps).

The other night, the patrols pulled out their chuck boxes. One patrol had a shiny, new coffee pot. I asked the scout if they were big coffee drinkers in his patrol. He said no, and then couldn't offer any reason for them to have the coffee pot.

Is there some use for a camping coffee pot other than making coffee? boiling water can be done in any of the pots they had. I don't have anything against them having it either, but as a life long sponge, I'd like to know what other use it could have.

Is there a conflict of interest for the person serving as the COR also being the CC?

New to being adult leader (and 20 years removed from my youth stint). Two weeks ago, I was at our Troop meeting which was conducted offsite from our normal CO meeting place. I asked the COR who was early like me for a reason for the offsite meeting (as I am a member of the CO and know that there wasn't a conflict of schedule). He explained that we'd been booted - temporarily. A month prior, the scouts made a total mess of the entire grounds with a water baloon fight (leaving all the busted baloons). Apparently there have been other instances of unruly behavior.

Anyway... there was a board of review that night, actually several. I only sat on one. This whole event of being temporarily banned is embarrassing. During the BOR, after we dismissed the scout, I asked the BOR if we could discuss "the incident" because I have my one remaining feeling hurt that we - curteous, obedient, clean - scouts have been reprimanded. We did ask the scout what he thought about "the incident" and how it could have been handled differently and how it will (or will not) be handled differently going forward. However, after some thought on the matter, I was looking more to the point of our (troop leadership) response should have been "the entire troop did not show scout spirit, therefore, during the month that we are limited to offsite meetings, there will be no BORs". Would that be "too tough"?

I also just recently went to my first troop committee meeting and these folks seem willing to bend over backwards to make BORs available at a moments notice (going so far as to put little or no time limits). I think I see a trend, and it has to do with the fact that I'm the only one in the adult ranks that does not have a child in the program (yet). They are all agreeable to cater to the boys, without discrimination (as in all boys are treated as "theirs").

"What do ya give up 1st? Why do you have to give anything up. Instead of driving the vehicle you have, get one you can afford. Keeping up with the Jones is what gets people in trouble financially! People with massive credit card debt are hurting only themselves!"

bzzt.... wrong. they aren't hurting only themselves. they refinanced their home and used the same illogic that got them the credit card debt and signed off on a loan they had no realistic shot of paying for in the long run. now what... the big bad wolf is coming to take the american dream away from those poor defenseless souls. have no fear though, the might democrats will slay the wolf and lower the principle or forgive what is overdue.

i'm bitter. i'm bitter that i didn't buy a house last year (one that i can't afford) because it definitely looks like the taxpayers are about to reward bad debtors.

"But the number one offender is the overall intense focus on Eagle achievement that this unit promotes. Earning Eagle is not the goal of the Scouting program. Each Scout has to bushwack his own path. If that means not earning Pioneering or never serving as a patrol leader, so be it! "

the current BSA advancement guidelines seem to encourage quickest route to first class.

the troop listed above would be decent, if no one ever transfered in, or started later than 11. advancement is not required - heck, i took two years to make it to second class. most of the requirements that this troop has taken the time to spell out SHOULD be accomplished within a normal framework, i think. a star scout that has never taught a skill? if there is camping one weekend a month (and summer camp), a scout earning first class in this troop would have camping, cooking, and maybe a few other of the outdoor MBs. as long as the troop is doing well, and has longevity, there isn't much of a reason to break the cycle.

200k per person? which 3 million people will get that?

i can say that being down here, when fema gave out debit cards, the things that were put on those fema cards weren't necessities - unless strip clubs, flat screen tvs, and cruises are considered necessities. give 200,000 to most of the affected people and you'd end up with the same thing - people buying things they don't need. until very recently, i was in that prime target market for WaMu and others that were encouraged to offer loans to people who shouldn't be getting loans. I didn't take the offer though. I am less than interested in paying for someone else's poor judgment (the banks who broad brush accepted anyone who'd sign on the bottom line...and the debtors who thought 30,000 a year was good enough to afford a 200,000 house).

"If the system has no way to differentiate this information, why include it on the form?"

To increase posts on scouter forums. ;-)

minor tangent to all of this, but related:

Yesterday, at the Scout Shop at National, I went in looking to build my first adult uniform. I went through my little laundry list of things, and went over to the patch section. For adults, most all patches were there, save for the knots. When I asked where for art the knots, I was met with the question "which ones do you want?, we keep them behind the counter". I wanted an Eagle and a God and Country Youth award knot.

"Do you have your card?" heh... they ask for my card even though I was awarded Eagle in 1985 - water under the bridge. They did have to call 'next door' and get it looked up in the computer because I didn't pack the card (even though I knew I was going to be near enough the National office). So.... for the one simple demand of a "blue card", I could see where that stays in the continuity with how they handle Eagle Scouts who are now adult.

"'Part of the problem might be email.'

Kids do have e-mail addresses but they never check their e-mail! Kids today communicate via text messages! "

I know our troop uses email. I also know that my troop got Trev's email broadcast to them (since we's in the same council and all). I also know that the boys have email since there is a flurry of emails (from scouts) this week about requesting BORs and help with citizenship MBs. i've not seen commentary from any parents - maybe they are worn out from last weekend's "parent participation" camping.

Lucky me, I was in Fort Worth until yesterday on business. I made a little side trip over to the mother ship before heading back south. In the scout shop at the national office, the display showed both socks - option given to the wearer. they even had "old" socks. however, none of the "green" socks that they had matched the green of the new pants. In fact, my wife pointed out that it was a pretty bad clash (before I could even comment). I remember my socks matching my pants (and shorts) in 1985.

I still have my ordeal and brotherhood sashes. The brotherhood sash went to a few conclaves, three summer camps, 4 ordeals, etc. and it may not be as bright a white as it began, but it still looks good. I know for a fact that they were cleaned (by me, but for the life of me, I can't recall how). I do remember having to iron it after every washing. BTW, the colors didn't bleed.

Many many changes for boy scouts for me to adjust to over a 20 year absence. Is it normal to have parents (one or both) along on a camping trip who are not part of troop leadership? I don't know if it happens every camping trip in the troop I'm involved with, but it is happening this month. I can see where that would have never worked with the troop I grew up in, we all enjoyed our time away from our parents a little too much to have them stay with us in a camp.

As a scout in Memphis, we went to Kia Kima. I don't recall a singular award voted on by the staff. I do recall there being a system similar to what eagle90 describes where there were requirements to a troop award available and we did do that every summer.

I also remember that on a patrol basis, there was a judging on a daily basis. The winning patrol was responsible for retiring the colors at the camp-wide flag ceremony each day (the staff would run the colors up in the morning at the morning ceremony).

"Why? Are you afraid that your faith isn't strong enough to survive?"

how about not wanting to put money into their pocket.... i might watch the movie for free, but i have no interest in shelling out $20 to see a movie that promotes a view that i goes against my value system. maybe BL should promote Brokeback Mountain too.

my troop gave me a porsche 911 turbo.

oh wait, that was just a dream. i got nothing. i didn't expect anything either. i do recall family and friends gave me token monetary gifts. i seem to recall it was spent well at the philmont trading post.

"Hoo boy, so Ed, now at the gateway to our troop's camp site (or in the parking lot?) I need to stop all adults and get answers to the following before I let them enter (in the tone of the gatekeeper from The Holy Grail):

STOP!

1) What is your religion?

2) What is your marital status?

3) What are your extra curricular intentions this weekend? "

1. where did the religion of the couple come into this?

2 and 3. if there aren't coed allowances, there isn't a problem at all. i don't recall anywhere that said cub scouts (or boy scouts) was the place to witness a healthy (or unhealthy) relationship between two adults who love each other.

since the holy grail was quoted... i'll quote one too... waterboy:

"momma always said, 'wimmen are da debil'"

hehe.