MattHiggins

Has the BSA confirmed they will be adhering to the WOSM rules?

SPL closes by asking if there are any more announcements and then says the Scoutmaster Benediction and dismissed. No Scoutmaster minute, which I thought was odd.

I'm all for shopping around and for the Scout getting the experience he wants.

In our town, until recently, we had six troops and three packs. Two of the three packs were "feeder packs." Our pack wasn't affiliated with any troop, so the crossovers had to shop around. Does shopping around guarantee a perfect fit? Of course not, but I wouldn't have it any other way.

Has he visited all four? If so, did any click for him more than the others. If the distance for D isn't a deal breaker for you, it seems to be the best choice. 30 miles isn't the same everywhere. I live in New England and it might take me a lot longer to go thirty miles than someone in, say, the Midwest. The lack of weekly meetings is just a red flag to me. I'd flat out ask why they don't meet weekly.

Great topic, by the way. My son just crossed over. We had a den of 12 and five troops to pick from in town. If was a tough choice for them.

22 hours ago, blw2 said:

old thread so I'm sorry if I've already written this...b I disagree with this idea.... I think it's never fine

Exactly!!!

well I've never actually seen it happen so I can't confirm it's fun to see, but "Exactly" to the first part of what you said!!!  makes total sense!

Keep in mind I wasn't endorsing the idea. I too wish it would never happen, but if it's a reality a troop can't escape, having an ad hoc patrol perform the functions of a patrol is better than Scouts showing up for an adult run event

34 minutes ago, qwazse said:

@MattHiggins, file this under "all politics is local". We usually let the boys adjust their camping arrangements the week before the campout. That is, we expect them to come the Monday before telling us who will be joining their patrol for the weekend.

Yes, this opens the gate for adult intervention. So, the PLC has a 15 minutes pow-wow after each meeting (rather than the more typical monthly meeting). This helps them be "first-to-know" about who's on what roster, and gives them a chance to "task" adults with things that will actually help boys lead rather than replace their leadership.

The best solution for patrols is a group of boys so tight and proud of their identity that they would more than happily arrive at camp as a "patrol of one" if need be, for the sake of his buddies. Inculcating that vision is truly challenging. But, it's fun when you see it happen.

So, are your patrols still planning their own meals, budgeting and buying their own food and cooking as separate patrols as well as planning their own activities based on what they need and/or want to get done? If so, then making or tweaking patrols is fine. If not, then we have camping clubs, not Boy Scouts. I imagine your patrols are doing those things, but I am eager to see what transpires locally.

"We have patrols, but have to form patrols at each outing based on who goes." I hear this a lot locally (we have five troops in town) and it always concerns me. My son crosses over tomorrow. My worry is if new patrols are being formed--when? If it's in advance, fine. But, if it's happening at or right before, who's planning the meals, buying the food, making the duty roster, etc.? Sounds like a recipe for an adult led program.

This happened one year to my son at districts. He previously won his den and had pretty fast car. When we went to districts he watched his car not even make it to the finish line. He was supposed to run four races--one in each lane. After the second race we just asked for the car. The tires had been inadvertently pushed in. All rubbed and one front tire wouldn't even turn. Oh well. He was disappointed and I was sad for him, but there was nothing anyone could do. The next year, he glued his axles in place and won districts.

On ‎12‎/‎6‎/‎2017 at 8:56 AM, WisconsinMomma said:

They look nice.  This is small stuff. 

BINGO!

Oh man (no pun intended), do what you have to do, BSA, as far going co-ed goes, but whatever you do, don't combine with GSUSA. My daughter was in the program and while the two organizations, in theory, have similar goals, they share just about nothing in common when it comes to actual program

We Now Have Our 1st Cub Co-Ed Pack (Boys And Girls) As A Pilot Program. The entire meeting room went silent when given this news by our district.

 

It was just a matter of time...

Is this an official pilot program?

Curious how many den meetings people are needing to get this adventure done. In my opinion, this is the biggest, hardest, most complicated, whatever adventure of the Webelos rank

I have three and a half den meetings dedicated to content plus an event they get to practice in staged scenarios (we're planning to do this zombie apocalypse themed).

Meeting one (half of meeting): What is first aid and what are hurry cases, regular cases, minor cases

Meeting two: hurry cases and stroke and choking

Meeting three: everything else (frostbite, snake bites, etc.)

Meeting four: each Webelos teaches one of the of the previously covered items

Zombie Apocalypse: den is broken into teams and goes from stage to stage

I'd fight this and I'm glad they are too.

The obtaining of prescriptions for marijuana is a known joke. They have a long way to go before this cannabis is taken seriously for medical purposes. Far too many of the proponents of medical legalization want it legal across the board for recreational use. It's hardly endorsed by psychotherapists. Bottom line, while popular opinion has been moved on the subject, I'm all for keeping it away from Scouts. They can find another location.

Below is from Newsweek:

Other symptoms of Colorado’s pot culture include increased use among teens, resulting in educational problems in middle schools and high schools, a spike in “ediblesâ€-related emergency room visits, consumption by children and pets resulting in illness and death and regulatory confusion surrounding public consumption and enforcement.

 

Other accounts say she was shamed and embarrassed by the SM.  In video interviews she says the same thing.  One just has to find the media outlet that they like before they make comments on the forum, I guess.

I've watched all the same media you have on it. She didn't publically shame her. She did not berate her. That wasn't her account. Saying she did completely blows what was said to have happened out of proportion. This is completely typical these days.

I normally would feel hesitant to support single individual who motivated to "get the word" out on any particular cause.  But in this situation the woman was publicly humiliated and shamed for doing what is legally her right.  This woman deserves an apology directly and publicly from the SM. 

 

In our state when two lanes of traffic merge down to one, both lanes are to go to the point of merger and then alternate cars to maintain flow.  Somewhere along the line people start to get into the one lane way back and leave the one lane open.  When someone legally moves forward to fill that lane people get the idea that they are jumping ahead in line.  I saw a trucker move over to block the lane and then forced someone off the road who tried to get around him.  I got the license number of the truck and stopped to see if the elderly couple that were forced off the road were okay.  They were.  I called in the situation and about 3 miles down the road the state police had the trucker pulled over.  They had not seen the situation and were going to write him a ticket.  I stopped and gave my name address and phone number, said the couple that had been forced off the road were okay, and I was witness to the whole incident and was willing to testify.  At that point the ticket went from a warning to a citation for leaving the scene of an accident.

 

Like the SM in our thread, maybe next time she'll understand the rules before she berates another human being.  I bet that from that point onward, she's going to have to stop and think twice before not approving a scout for living the Scout Spirit.

I guess we can just completely make up our own version of stories to help make our points. I read this story in Forbes before seeing the video linked here, but based on the own woman's accounts she wasn't, as you say, "publicly humiliated and shamed." Nor did the Scoutmaster "berate" her. In her own account she was talked to in private. Should the Scoutmaster have just let it go? Yup. Is it the woman's right to breastfeed wherever and whenever she likes? Yup. Is modesty (not saying she wasn't being modest as I wasn't there) required? Nope. All of that's true, but you just can't make up your own more dramatic and completely embellished version to suit your stance on the issue.

 

The SM is a BSA backed personal zero-tolerant no legal basis bigot towards nursing infants and their mothers. 

Ooohhh, I see Godwin's Law on the horizon.

I got a kick out of that string of words too. These days I can't tell the difference between sincere statements and satire

I wasn't there, so I won't pretend to have all the answers. I will say I'm not sure the council handled it poorly. The letter is kind, professional and diplomatic. It just doesn't tar and feather the leader like the mom wanted it to. The only thing I believe the council may have initially done poorly is that they clearly underestimated how this "issue" explodes.

I absolutely abhor this "issue." Like many people, I am 100% pro breastfeeding. My kids were and everyone knows it's the healthier (and cheaper) option. Sometimes there are moms who could exercise a bit more modesty. Sometimes they are covered up appropriately and it's a case of somebody overstepping. It's case by case and not something that we can armchair quarterback from she said, she accounts. Nor is it an issue that needs to decided on the national stage. I personally just don't get the "it's my right, so I don't have to consider anyone else."

Have your guys not crossed over yet?

Our Arrow of Light Scouts crossed over in early April. The other ranks advanced in May

This is where my Pack Shines, we are very much an outdoor pack and camp out very often and when I say often more than the troop!

I don't want to derail this thread, but I'm curious how often is often. Our pack went from one annual family camping event in a local park to four total (two Webelos campouts and two pack campouts). I imagine fix or six is the max.

Our pack is a little different when it comes to cross over successes and failures. I've been Cubmaster for a couple of years. Our previous Cubmaster was great. Well liked for good reason, and her business skills made for a well run pack. She admittedly wasn't super into the outdoors and or well versed in Scouting as a whole. Anyway, we have 100% cross over every year. Mostly because until recently the two Webelos years weren't any different than, say, Bears. The Webelos weren't getting a taste of making their own decisions. They weren't ramping up towards Scouting. They showed up for Blue & Gold because they were told to and they crossed over to a troop because they were told to previously pick one. Anyway, the downside to our 100% cross over rate was a significant drop out rate. Our cross over is no longer at Blue & gold, but that's besides the point. I am also the Webelos den leader and try to gently influence the Arrow of Light den leader (I get the idea he's generally not my biggest fan). The new Webelos hear a lot about Boy Scouts and how they are getting ready for a much bigger adventure. They hear a lot about how the Scouts run the troop. As a pack, we get outdoors a lot more. I don't doubt we'll still cross over 100%, but hopefully we'll have a lot fewer drop out due to culture shock.

Thanks, guys. I think we all agree.

I personally like the distinction between Cubs and Scouts. I am, however, on the fence about not having to earn Webelos to get Arrow of Light.

Yes, you award the Webelos badge when the scout has completed the requirements.  Depending on your den and your scouts, it may take them to the end of the school year, or they may finish up early.  I generally subscribe to awarding the badge as soon as possible after the scout has completed the requirements, the first pack meeting after is ideal.

I'm on the same page. Had a fellow leader in our unit with a different opinion. Asked a different leader and got yet a different answer.

Having just done the Bear program with a den, I suggest identifying two electives early (such as Bear Goes Fishing and Baloo the Builder) and picking away at them. Many of the Scouts in my den also did Critter Care on their own and three did forensics. The key, in my opinion, is not waiting to start the electives after the required adventures are done. Tell the Scouts to pick out ones they like and start early--do them in bits and pieces.

The leader guide has all the info you need. I did find with the Bear program that it wasn't always possible to start an adventure and only work on that adventure to completion.

Cub Scouts advancement frequently confuses people. A Tiger den wears Tiger gear (hat, neckerchief and slide), but gets the Tiger patch when they've completed the requirements. They're called Tigers but haven't yet earned the Tiger rank. Same with Wolves and Bears. You earn the patch when you've completed the requirements. Webelos, however, is a two-year program that concludes with the presentation of the Arrow of Light rank. My question is when are you awarding the Webelos patch. After the end of the first year, right? Complete the requirements, get the patch. We're talking new program here.

There are, no doubt, a lot of great leaders here . . . and there's no shortage of snobbery either. Paper Eagles, parlor Eagles, too many palms, better off being an Eagle, better not being Eagle, neckerchief under the collar, too many patches, not enough patches, not the right patches, blah, blah, blah. I do feel bad for the Scouts who find there way here and read.

When someone is willing to volunteer, you get a plus one in my book. If they're a former Scout, I see that as a plus as there's a good chance they know the basics of the program and how Scouts works. If they are an Eagle, another plus in my book. I also know prior experience is no guarantee of anything. The best leader in our town has previous experience of one year in Cub Scouts. While I credit his awesomeness as a reflection of who he is as a person, he gives the credit to--get ready for some heads to explode--Scout University/Pow Wow and Round Table.