imachristian13

Thank you for trying to steer back from HIPAA-land. We assume that they are doing this outside of good conscience because of past actions. We, further, know that they are doing so because they contacted the Second Troop's Scoutmaster before we even called ourselves to set-up a visitation. They, quite literally, had to call and say (to the effect of) "you might be hearing from one of our troop members named because he might want to come visit you...if he does, he has all kinds of problems." It is our role, as the parents, to guide the path of our child. If we go to the second troop and make an inquiry, I would certainly expect that SM to contact the SCOUTMASTER at our present troop for more information. We haven't even decided to leave our present troop yet - we are just weighing options and these folks are contacting other troops to warn them about our son.

Some folks have been asking (in different words) "why is switching troops being considered?" These 2 ASMs are the primary leaders of the Troop after the SM. In other words, when he can't be there, it is their show to run. Since they choose to ignore (or, to be fair, give up on) the training that they have had from us, our son finds himself in potentially dangerous situations. These choices typically provoke further escalation of our son's scenarios and, now that he is adult-sized, we don't want to see where that goes. Further, our son doesn't feel that he is welcomed by his fellow scouts simply because they have grown tired of dealing with him (as most teen boys would do whether dealing with NT kids or those on the spectrum). In order for him to stay with the current troop, we need to reset everything and that just doesn't appear to be feasible. If I had my own druthers, I'd sit down with the SM, other ASMs, and the scouts themselves and say "hey! we are trying to make it that my son can succeed at this. we know it's tough. what can we do to team up and make it work for all of us?" A lot of the kids are good and the ASMs are as well. Frankly, it's one of the few times in his life that we want folks to treat him like he's different because it's the only way it can work.

@@Eagledad - Sorry - which person is the "CC" to which you are referring? Beyond the local troop, I have spoken to the District Executive.

Right on the HIPAA misspelling. I do that all the time. Ironically, the female in this duo is in medicine so HIPAA should be on her brain somewhere. Whether it is HIPAA-violating or not, I am most frustrated by their decision to contact another troop leader whom we have never even met to, I guess, "warn" her about my son. Even if they have positive intentions - which I doubt but nevertheless - what was their drive behind reaching out on their own like that? For the record, just to be 100% clear. My son does do things he shouldn't do. When seen through the light of an NT child (neurotypical), he would be disciplined through reward-based or punitive measures. In his case, however, those methods do not yield results of any sort. These folks have received the majority of our training and have, subsequently, decided that they know better than us. For example, one thing that just doesn't work for him is to try to "talk him down" or "discuss" an issue while it is occurring. After our most recent incident, the male ASM came to me and said "I just cannot understand why I can't talk him down like the other boys". When I reminded him of what he should have done, he told me that I didn't know what I was talking about. I'm starting to sound like I'm just venting - don't want to do that. More thoughts are always welcomed. Thanks!

Hi folks...sorry I had to step away for a bit. A few comments. I suggested to the Troop that I join the ASM ranks for the Troop back in October. When they didn't jump at the opportunity, I submitted my application to the SM anyway and proceeded to take all available training (I am only short the Introduction to Outdoor Skills or whatever it's formal title is - I will take that in October of this year). Despite monthly reminders to submit the paperwork and get me in motion, they only did so last month (April) and I am awaiting confirmation from the Council on my status. In short, I have been attempting to be an ASM for half a year now. I am clear that it's a fine line on whether they are going past HIPPA whether or not. It's more of a question - to me - of how they contacted her before we even had the chance to make our own contact. We try very hard to advocate for our Son while giving him some room to be his own man. (We have had to stand up for him so much over the years, he had asked us to try to stand back on Scouting. He understands that might not be possible now and we're good with it.). Thanks everyone for the ongoing discussions.

MooseTracker hits it dead on here. This is what bothers me. Not like we hide his Asperger's (if anything, we probably share it too much) but it's not their call to make. thanks

We haven't given up on the possibility of the new Troop - far from it. We aren't going to let two bad eggs spoil things. Our current SM is a great guy - and the rest of the ASMs do fairly well with our Son as well. It's just these two. They do a lot of things like this - including starting gossip that the current SM was planning to step down last Christmastime...it wasn't even on his radar. We have toyed with trying to stay put and remove or modify the problem ASMs as well - just thought we'd look at an "easier" option.

Thank you for your reply. The only reason we believe they shared in a negative light - as opposed to the method you describe - is how it was shared with us. Based on our interactions with them, it would surprise us to find that you are correct.

As you can probably guess by my moniker and avatar, I come to this from a different perspective. Having a "word" from God is not craziness for a Believer. That being said, there is a right way and a wrong way to share such a word. This is clearly the wrong way. Specifically, because the word from God is supposed to be shared only with the person/people for which it is related. If the charter of the troop is through a faith-based organization - especially one that includes this woman as a member - please treat it with respect even if it is not your cup of tea. Take it to the leader of the chartering group (presumably, a lay leader or, perhaps, a member of the clergy) and explain the concerns that apply to the "when" and "how" the word was shared. Do not dive in to the other aspects because - no different than someone saying "God Bless You" when you sneeze, she was sharing in good faith. If, however, the charter of the troop is through a non-faith group, take it directly to the woman in a private meeting (just a few primary Committee members) and - again, be respectful - say that you appreciate that she felt strong enough in her faith to share this with you. However, as someone who doesn't share in this faith, you would prefer not to hear these types of messages in the future. Further, as we are uncertain of the entire faith life of our Scouts, kindly refrain from making statements of this nature in front of them at any time. Either way, there is no need to remove her from the group on this instance - nor is there any need to threaten her with banishment for next time. If there is a next time, you simply have to remind her of this discussion and - since she has disobeyed the request - ask her to depart. Hope you'll consider my advice. Bob

Hi folks. Here's the scoop. My 13 y.o. son lives with Asperger's Syndrome. He is high-functioning but can be difficult for those who are inexperienced. My wife and I have worked with our Troop leadership team since we joined Scouting in Fall of 2013 to help them to work with him and to be an overall support. While we have found a good deal of success, there is a husband and wife team who serve as ASMs...they have a 14 y.o. in the Troop as well. They either don't get it or they don't want to get it. When our son is in scenarios under their direct leadership, he has a bad experience. After speaking with our District Executive, we had elected to consider a shift to another local Troop. Unfortunately, the husband is also the Commissioner for this other Troop. Still, we were planning a visit to see what we could find out. We shared this decision with our SM and Committee Chair. Earlier today, I was informed that the ASMs from our present Troop contacted the SM of the Troop we planned to visit. Although I have not yet determined all of the details of what they shared, they pained a very poor picture of my son as well as of our family as a whole. While we will be the first to tell you that our son can be challenging, he is most certainly capable of achieving in BSA. Working with a new SM on this scenario is our prerogative - not theirs. We are realistic. People make mistakes. They do things because they think they are doing the right thing. We get it. Our son is the loser in all of this so we want to be clear. In a nutshell, my questions are these: From a general point of view, the only reason that we can see for sharing information about our son with this new SM was to be spiteful. What are your thoughts? From a "BSA Guidelines" point of view, this sounds like a violation of privacy. They are sharing medical and personal information with the new SM, a person with whom we've never even met at this point, without our expressed permission. Isn't that the case?

I could not agree with you more...let's make sure that our sons are total pigs so that scouting gets a bad rep.

This is VERY interesting to me. You are saying that all Committee Members are "registered". At my ASM training, we were told that this was 100% inaccurate - all parents are members of the Committee. There is a leadership structure (which these folks don't even come close to following either). On the motto - some of the boys think it's hilarious and the leaders all think it is just a fantastic concept. Despite having the stupid part pointed out.

We are definitely following his lead (we do that in everything of this nature). He is the one expressing concerns to us and we are seeking guidance to properly assist him. He does have the ball.

I am considering reporting to the DE. As I think I've said elsewhere, when it's not appropriate to bring all of them, I'm cool with that. It's when it IS appropriate and they aren't invited that I take issue. Thanks!

We let our son take the lead on all of these issues. He is having some fun - enough to worry about staying or going from the troop. It's just that the troop is disorganized which causes some to feel like they are not making progress.

Hi, Although we are not speaking of the Eagle Scout BOR, I think you are overstepping the point of what I am saying. A little bit of fun and levity was not my concern. The overall wasted time and nonsensical nature of the BOR in this format is where I'm disappointed. I just completed the ASM basic training course at our Merit Badge College. They made it painfully clear that BORs are not supposed to be a place where a Scout should fear that they have not earned the rank but, rather, a place where the Troop can check-in with the Scout to see how they are truly progressing while affirming their achievement of the rank. End of meeting...the 10-15 minutes that you call circle up is currently taking place...FOLLOWED BY the 20 minutes of comments from the entire adult leadership team. Comments on items that have already been (or should have been) covered earlier in the evening. Never been to an OA meeting or CTC. I do understand the difference between how adults do it and how boy-led can be done. This doesn't allow for two things, however. One, it denies that there are times that the whole troop has been invited (not just a small piece). Two, it completely rules out anyone with special needs - we have two Autistic boys who prefer "adult" methods when possible. I would disagree with your Philmont shirts (at least #2 and #3) because I would find them to be disrespectful. However, that is not the point here - this particular "motto" implies stupidity of the boys in the troop. (I subscribed to Mad and watched the Stooges every Saturday by the way - doesn't mean I have to degrade women or boys who cry in order that they might stretch their wings). Yes...the boys are having a good time. I'd like to see them have a better time!

My "hazing" comment was more about the overall experience. The sock question - if it was solely being used to lighten the boy up - is fine on its own. However, when added into the entire scenario with the false possibility of not earning the rank, that's where I felt it was too much. I do try very hard to differentiate between my views (as an adult) on how the meeting should be run and what is actually boy-led. There is a difference between having no plan of attack for the meeting at all or for a trip. We have two boys on the Autism Spectrum as well - they crave structure so it is stressful for them to be otherwise. I have discussed it with the SM and ASMs (the long end to the meeting) - they disagree. THANKS!

You are correct. The "do not" was continued through the sentence. If they were asking for the boy's views in relationship to advancements, etc., that'd be totally different. I can see the concepts you describe as a good avenue for moving forward within the troop...if possible.

I don't believe that the BOR members are trying to get the boys to say bad things. The questions are more off the wall than I am implying I guess but we are on the same general page. Scoutmaster and I have met on several occasions with and without the CC. I'm clear that this is not really something that can be "changed" and that is why I came here for advice. thank you so much!

Starting our own would be cool BUT I think we'll lean toward another Troop. thanks!

Funny you should ask. I requested consideration as an ASM and/or Named Committee Member in November of last year. Since then, I have completed all of the ASM training except for the basic outdoor skills course (taking that in March). Troop leadership told me they were going to wait to process me until after re-chartering. I have asked multiple times for my status since that was completed, to no avail. ("We're working on it...we'll let you know".) So...officially, I'm "just" a Dad on the Committee

Thank you for your reply! 1. I agree in full. 2. SPL does nothing other than gather the boys for the closing - the adults take over at that point. 3. SPL is one of the folks that facilitates the clique concept (only texts his buddies on some things). Motto - My thoughts as well. Funny for an "inside joke" but not to publicize. Considering the shopping...thanks1

I have been holding back on this because I am trying not to always be the one in front (I do a lot of volunteering and I'm always "that guy"). We have other troops to consider. Just making sure before we yank our son elsewhere. Thank you!