topshot

I am curious how many councils have moved to the subscription model and how much they charge each month. Ours just announced they will be moving to that next year and it's not going over well (~300% increase). They claim there are others that do this.

I'm curious how often most Troops hold elections. We just started to look at this Star to Life time issue in depth. We have elections only twice a year (2nd Mon of May and Nov). This means the May-Nov Scouts will always be short 3 days (which seems stupid to me since Nov-May span is actually fewer days). They can wait for the next monthly BoR to get advanced, but they also must have some type of position or special SM project to cover the extra days (assuming they aren't re-elected into another one that counts). To me this seems rather unfair.

 

Maybe our Eagles have been lucky to not have been Star during the May-Nov cycle or it just got dismissed as Troop error at their EBOR. I figure we should fix it so it's never an issue, but don't see how to do it simply. Yearly elections definitely won't work. So what are you doing to get around this issue?

By the way, I'm moving to the "every gram counts" school of thought. Pack, pad, bag and tent at less than 8 pounds. It's going to be expensive, but so is knee surgery.

With that kind of base weight, why are you wearing boots?

I'm re-thinking this whole topic lately.

 

I recently followed a discussion on another forum that I visit (camping but not scouting). Anyway, this guy just finished a rim to rim hike of the grand canyon...... something like his 4th or 5th time doing it. This time, he and his teenaged daughter did it wearing those Vibram 5-Fingers shoes.

 

I've never tried these things, but I understand that the idea is that it makes you walk in a more natural way, using your foot and legs as God designed them. I found a you-tube video that had side by side screen shots of someone running on a treadmill before and after some sort of coaching (nothing to do with the 5-fingers, she was wearing std running shoes). She was running differently to land on her forefoot and not her heel and I have to say that her whole body mechanics were noticeably better.

 

So this guy hiking the canyon said that he and his daughter felt great. Said in years past they would be hobbling around camp with aching feet (I've been there with the dogs barking!). This time they weren't at all.

 

He contends that it's all about conditioning and wearing these shoes to build these muscles in his feet and legs that never get used. I think there may be something to the modified walking style too.

 

Regardless, he said they felt stable on the trail, no ankle issues, etc..... and yes, they were wearing packs, and camped 2 nights along the trail.

The running shoe/hiking boot industry is filled with a bunch of BS about support and such that keep your feet from operating as designed. How else will they continue to get you to buy the new and improved models? That being said you will need to ease into minimalist footwear to avoid a lot of pain since you're not used to walking like you should be. I personally wouldn't go without a rock plate though.

At least when using the "New Topics" feature, the "Sort By" function does not work. I tried Started Post, Last Update, Replies and Title. It gets resorted, but it's clearly not even close to correct.

In our Council, family camps are district level events for all Packs in the district (usually only once per year in our district). Pack overnighter is any overnight (camping or otherwise) with just your pack.

Our council switched to Walmart or Amazon gift cards last year though there were a couple prizes that could be earned at higher levels in addition to the GC. I much prefer that to the old way (though you could also get cards back then, too) though I suspect some Scouts/parents may prefer those prizes.

 

My son has always been one of the top sellers in the unit ($1,500+ avg sales) so he's able to fund his entire year of Scouting including uniform pieces with the earnings.

May be too late for you, but I'd also go for the 7x7 Walmart tent. It's fly isn't as pathetically small as the 6x5 tent, which would be too small for you anyway. However, be advised that you should really seal the seam between the walls and bottom. They apparently aren't taped. Had torrential rains on our recent trip and our son and his buddy got wet while my wife and I were fine in my true backpacking tent.

Should have added you should check out this paper I wrote, too. It's made for newbies and Scouters that don't know how to backpack light.

http://topshotsystems.com/Lightweight_Scouting_Dissertation.pdf

May be too late for you, but I'd also go for the 7x7 Walmart tent. It's fly isn't as pathetically small as the 6x5 tent, which would be too small for you anyway. However, be advised that you should really seal the seam between the walls and bottom. They apparently aren't taped. Had torrential rains on our recent trip and our son and his buddy got wet while my wife and I were fine in my true backpacking tent.

The only time I use a groundcloth is if I'm using a tarp (no floor). On a recent trip to the Smokies where we had to pitch on gravel platforms, my backpacking tent with it's ultralight 30D floor was the only one that didn't get wet when torrential rains created nice ponds on these platforms.

I only found 3 of them (via Google). Fishing, Fly Fishing and Fish and Wildlife Management. Given the commonality of subjects, it's clear someone did those for some special purpose.

Our troop's Scouts are "lazy" as the former SM told me. We pretty much car camp each month within a couple hours. We did go rafting in southern KY (5+ hours) 4 years ago. We'll have a small contingent going to the Smokies this summer. We also live in one of the most depressed areas of the state so few families have money (or money to buy popcorn, etc.). A few of the Scouts do manage to fund their whole year via fundraising though. Since the troop doesn't provide the adventure, I've been doing it on my own with my sons.

Use the self-stick velcro - no need to sew it. Sticks very well to the "glue" on the back of the patches. It may come off the newer uniforms, which seem to have some kind of finish, when washed. Make sure the loop part is put on the shirt to prevent pilling when being laundered. I ended up using an iron from the opposite side to help the glue set into the fabric better. Removing the patch when washing also helps it stay put. I prefer using the 2" wide strip and cutting to shape as needed vs using several of the dots. Only problem is if the Scout doesn't have a current position, you'd have a piece of velcro on the sleeve.

 

Though for all other patches, I agree the Scouts should sew them.

Grubmaster from each patrol is on their own to get their food. they are given the budgeted amount of cash. Generally they take the food tub and cooler home......Generally mom takes them to the store.

 

 

I have taken them when asked but parent is the first choice.

Our Troop does the same. Each patrol rotates who buys the food for the next campout and it's up to the parent to get them to the store. Those Scouts will take home a tote (and sometimes a cooler). He gets $10/Scout so he knows his budget.

From the Guide to Safe Scouting:

 

 

The online version of the Guide to Safe Scouting is updated quarterly.

Go to

http://www.scouting.org/HealthandSafety/GSS.aspx.

 

VI. Chemical Fuels and Equipment

 

Purpose

This policy directs Boy Scouts of America members how to safely store, handle, and use chemical fuels and equipment. Safety and environmental awareness concerns have persuaded many campers to move away from traditional outdoor campfires in favor of chemical-fueled equipment used for cooking, heating, and lighting. Be aware that chemical fuels and equipment create very different hazards than traditional wood, charcoal, and other solid fuels; this policy defines how to address those hazards.

 

Before any chemical fuels or chemical-fueled equipment is used, an adult knowledgeable about chemical fuels and equipment, including regulatory requirements, should resolve any hazards not specifically addressed within this policy.

 

Definitions

Chemical fuelsâ€â€Liquid, gaseous, or gelled fuels.

 

Approved chemical-fueled equipmentâ€â€Commercially manufactured equipment, including stoves, grills, burners, heaters, and lanterns that are designed to be used with chemical fuels.

 

Prohibited chemical-fueled equipmentâ€â€Equipment that is handcrafted, homemade, modified, or installed beyond the manufacturer’s stated design limitations or use. Examples include alcohol-burning “can†stoves, smudge pots, improperly installed heaters, and propane burners with their regulators removed.

 

Recommended chemical fuels White gas (Coleman fuel); kerosene; liquefied petroleum gas fuels, including propane, butane, and isobutane; vegetable oil fuels; biodiesel fuel; and commercially prepared gelled-alcohol fuel in original containers.

 

Chemical fuels not recommended Unleaded gasoline; liquid alcohol fuels, including isopropyl alcohol, denatured ethyl alcohol, and ethanol; and other flammable chemicals that are not in accordance with the manufacturer’s instructions for chemical-fueled equipment.

 

Storing, Handling, and Using Chemical Fuels and Equipment

An adult knowledgeable about chemical fuels and equipment should always supervise youths involved in the storage, handling, and use of chemical fuels and equipment.

 

Operate and maintain chemical-fueled equipment according to the manufacturer’s instructions and in facilities or areas only where and when permitted.

 

Using liquid fuels for starting any type of fireâ€â€including lighting damp wood, charcoal, and ceremonial campfires or displaysâ€â€is prohibited.

 

No flames in tents. This includes burning any solid, liquid, gel, or gas fuelâ€â€including tents or teepees that feature or support stoves or fires; and any chemical-fueled equipment or catalytic heaters.

 

Store chemical fuels in their original containers or in containers designed for immediate use. Securely store any spare fuel away from sources of ignition, buildings, and tents.

 

During transport and storage, properly secure chemical fuel containers in an upright, vertical position.

 

 

 

So... there is nothing in the Guide to Safe Scouting that says liquid fuels are not permitted. Most people think of white gas when they think of liquid fuels. Our troop uses propane and I can think of few reasons that liquid fuels would be a better choice. Sure, if you have a high adventure patrol and they're going to Philmont, maybe something like an MSR stove would make sense. However... I'll recount a brief story that happened to me a few weeks ago. I've been using liquid fuel stoves since I was a Scout. I've got literally decades of experience in camping and using these stoves. We were working as a troop on some 1st & 2nd class rank requirements and were going over the stoves. In keeping with the "adult should supervise" part, I was right there. I broke out the MSR stove and showed the boys how it worked. They were all to get familiar with it. The MSR stove requires that you pressurize the pump/container and prime the stove by allowing a little bit of liquid fuel to pool under the burner. You light it and it heats the stove and then you open the fuel line and off you go. I've done it hundreds of times. Uhhh... this time was different. I (not a boy, but me) bumped against the stove and the liquid fuel (white gas) that was pooled under the burner spilled on the table that we were using to demonstrate the stoves. Of course it was on fire and before I knew it, within seconds, half the table top was aflame. Oh $(#*$#%!!. Yeah, I know, what the heck were we doing this inside for? It was in a big rustic lodge where we were all doing cabin camping. All sorts of things went through my mind - none of them good. I got the stove outside and other leaders quickly extinguished the fire. I would have never, ever, in a million years thought this could have happened. I did a bunch of things wrong - doing this in the lodge, bumping the stove, etc. It could have ended badly. I know you're probably thinking, well, no kidding - don't do stuff like that indoors. Prepare your area. That could never happen to me. I got complacent and had visions of a really horrible outcome. So... while the BSA doesn't have specific rules against liquid fuel, carefully consider when you really need it and when you can use propane. We're in Illinois and propane works 99.9% of the time. I'll personally never use liquid fuel with Scouts again.

 

And, btw, perhaps the camp had a specific rule for reasons just like the one I describe above. Believe me, I feel pretty stupid. And was stupid. I share this story as an example of how bad things could have turned.

Propane and it's various mixtures also have their own dangers. Valves can go bad, easy to tip over uprights, etc. The worst, of course, would be getting the canister too hot, which would cause it to go boom. That's pretty much only an issue with upright stoves (canister below the pot) where heat is reflected downward. That's why the mfr says never use a windscreen with an upright. If the canister is too hot to keep your hand on it, you need to remove the pot and turn down the stove ASAP.

It seems clear Terry (or someone else) restored from a backup so a couple weeks of posts are now gone. I'd mentioned here that vBulletin has screwed the pooch with this release for sure. It seems many of these issues existed in beta several months ago and haven't gotten fixed yet so I wouldn't look for a solution from the vendor anytime soon. No, they don't support downgrading. Your only option is restoring from a backup using the old version. I assume Terry went direct from whatever he was using to vB5 so here we are. From my quick searching on the vB support forums, it didn't seem like anyone had written any converters to move to a different forum platform, but I didn't check other vendors to if someone there had done so. Hmmm... let me go check phpBB, which is what I use.... Nope, there is a converter for vB3 or vB4 but not the newly released vB5, which is quite different.

 

Personally, I'd go back to the pre-change backup, lose all the posts since then (early Feb?), and start all over with a different product.

Is there some official national document that indicates you can't or shouldn't use scout accounts? We always have escrowed their money and haven't had any of the issues others have. The Scouts get 100% of their fundraising efforts. We charge an annual fee ($90 this year) and now run pay per activity in advance ($10 for food plus any other expenses) because we did have some issues when we considered the $10/month as dues with a few not paying for extended periods. So now you pay to play and only pay for those events where you attend.

Where to begin? Perhaps it's because I use Firefox 18, but lots of things don't show up correctly.

None of the tags seem to work (url, color and size in the post above, for example, as well as quote)

The number of pages in a thread seems to broken. One that claimed to have 78 posts only showed 1 page (I had set it to show 40 per page). Going to Latest Activity tab rather than Posts tab seemed to be correct. When I switched back to 10 per page, this thread for example showed 1 of 4 pages yet there were really 7 pages! There's also no way to go to the last page.

Doing a search will give results but no way to get to those actual posts, just the user or forum they were posted in.

The system is even slower than it was before which was already near painful. By far the slowest site I visit. I've given up a couple times already because it just seems to hang.

I really don't see why you didn't go with a proven forum package (eg, phpBB) that would have avoided all these headaches.

 

So topshot.....I am interested in hearing what your question were and how they got answered???????

Not sure how what I asked is relevant to the discussion but:

Is the omission of the Scuba MB an error? If not, are those hours to be counted as "swimming"? YES, Scuba is a valid MB

 

Would the hours needed to earn Boardsailing and Snorkeling emblems count as "swimming"? YES

 

Then I asked a followup, Whether any activities before the award was available should count, similar to how merit badges are done where they don't count? YES, prior activities any time during Boy Scout or Venturing carreer count.

 

Not sure what you mean by how they got answered. I was emailed back. Seems simple enough.

Susan.Fitzhugh has been answering some of my questions regarding these awards. Add scouting.org for her email.

> I see you recommend chemical water treatment and others in this thread do too. However I have had the filters recommended by another troop as a more surefire way of assuring water safety.

 

I don't know of a filter that you can verify it's working as you expect in the field. Yes, you can tell when it's clogging but have no idea if it's been damaged somehow, letting through larger particles.

 

Yes, chlorine dioxide tablets can "expire", but you can normally see and smell whether they're reacting as they should be.

 

You will get water faster with a filter. I don't see that as an issue. A large gravity system could be pretty useful though.

Haven't been by in a while or I would have responded sooner. The paper I wrote for my University of Scouting dissertation was done for people like you. You can find it at http://topshotsystems.com/Lightweight_Scouting_Dissertation.pdf

> We are looking for ways to handle Scout camp next year and in the near future, a 50-miler.

 

Hopefully, the Scout camp kitchen will accommodate you. We have one that did but stopped (we'd always go the first week to make it easier on them). When they stopped, the family made their own food and stayed out of the dining hall. The other camp we normally attend will also work with us.

 

As for the long backcountry trips, your son will likely need to fix and eat on his own given the amount of stuff that affects him since nearly all typical backpacking food will contain some of those ingredients.

 

Our troop has a father and 2 sons that are severely allergic to peanuts and less so with a few other things. Our troop has banned nuts at any event and we make sure all Scouts and parents know that when they join and we often remind them. We do it even if those 3 do not attend an event. We've only had one incident in the 5 years they've been with us. Went cabin camping and apparently some residue left on a tabletop sent one boy to the hospital and he missed a week of school.

I'd join Pack212 in Denali and Juneau.

Another happy NeoAir user. As a side sleeper you definitely want a pad over 2". There are those much cheaper than a Neo but also much heavier and bulkier. I'd be willing to try hammocking but most of my preferred camping is above treeline.