ScoutNut

As you noted, that excerpt was about a Boy Scout Troop. Cub Packs are very, very different from a BS Troop.

They only meet together as a complete group 1X a month. And at this meeting there is no "training" of the boys going on. It is a meeting for fun, recognition, and more fun. The "training" goes on in the individual Dens which usually average only about 6 boys.

While I will grant that 100 boys in a Pack is large number, splitting one that size is not always the answer.

Bringing in the Unit Commissioner to visit some meetings is a good idea.

Also, 2 leaders for 17 boys is simply not enough. There should be another 2-4 assistant leaders too. Then, if you end up splitting them up, each group will have 1 leader and 1-2 assistant leaders already set.

As CC, it is part of your job, along with the COR & committee, to provide leaders. The leaders then need to go to training. Training will help them provide a better Scout experience for their boys.

For the 75 Anniversary - The requirement says to participate in a pack, district or council celebration. Give your council a call and see if there is something the council, or one of the districts, is planning. Explain that your pack is not celebrating the 75th.

Maybe you could visit another pack's Blue & Gold 75th celebration. This would help your son earn the award and help you in your search for a new pack too!

Remember, you have until Dec 31, 2005, to earn the award.

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Does your Pack have an Advancement Person? If not that is one reason things have fallen through. Also, it's been 5 months now since the beginning of this scouting year. What has been everyone been doing at the past 5 Pack meetings? Have any of the other boys &/or their families said anything about things not received? Are advancements, patches, beads, etc ever discussed at the monthly Pack Committee meetings? That would be the time for each Den Leader to hand the Advancement Person a list of what is needed for the upcoming Pack meeting.

For "special" awards that are only earned by a few scouts you do the same thing that you would do if the whole Den earned them. You recognize them for their efforts in front of their peers at a Pack meeting & present them with the award they have earned.

I agree with Semper. It seems like communication (or the lack of) is one of your Den's main problems.

I have found that repetition, a lot of it, in various different forms, is often needed with families. A Den newsletter, verbal reminders to boys, to adults (grab everyone as they come to pick up son), e-mail. If there is a special activity coming up reminders need to start about 3 weeks earlier.

As Semper asked, was the project clearly, & in writing, explained to the boys & their families? How would you go about determining which boys did the project all by themselves & which had help? If the boy brought in something & said he did it himself how could you tell him he didn't? The only way to be sure that the project was done by the scouts was to do it in a den meeting. For instance, each family could have been charged a specific amount, fleece purchased, & then small blankets & caps made at a meeting. Or the boys could have sponsored a drive at their school, made handouts & collected the products.

If repeated requests for a item get no results then the boys should be told that such & such activity will not be done due to the fact they never brought in the needed items. If this happens often enough maybe the boys will remember to remind their parents.

Your Den Leader needs to communicate her needs better & more often.

Ooops - Double post.

But I did find this on another ceremony:

Story -- The story this year is about 'Scout Spirt' I use a large gallon jar, filled 3/4 with fine dirt, and a ping pong ball. When I turn it upside down the ping pong ball is on the bottom. The ping pong ball is a Scout. As I talk about the virtues of Scouting I slightly Shake the jar. Within a few shakes (about one minute of talking) the ping pong ball appears at the top of jar having overcome the great weight of the dirt. The moral of the story focuses on that the the virtues of Scouting overcomes all that is dumped on you.

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The 7 Virtues are represented by the 7 rays on the Arrow of Light. This is from an AOL presentation ceremony:

A Scout has WISDOM - Having wisdom doesn't mean that a Scout is smarter than others. It means that he uses what he knows to live a better life -- to be a good example for other people, young and old, Scouts and others, family and friends.

A Scout has COURAGE - Having courage doesn't mean that you're never afraid -- very courageous people are often afraid. However, facing danger despite your fear is the act of a brave, courageous Scout.

A Scout has SELF-CONTROL - Scouts have to know when to stop. When you can stop yourself when you have had enough or done enough of something -- enough eating, enough playing, or even enough working -- then you have self-control. Know what behavior is correct in each situation, and do it. When you have self-control, you are growing up as a Scout.

A Scout gives JUSTICE - Justice is part of the Pledge of Allegiance: "with liberty and justice for all." Justice is being fair with others that we go to school with, work and play with. Justice means it doesn't matter who the person is, or what color they are, or what they do ... Scouts are fair to everyone.

A Scout has FAITH - Scouts believe in God. Faith means that we believe in God and other things we cannot see. When you know God exists in your heart, you have faith.

A Scout has HOPE - Hope means you look forward to good things that you believe will happen. You hope for better things tomorrow, but you work hard today to make those good things happen.

A Scout has LOVE - Scouts have many kinds of love. Love of family, home, your fellow Scouts, God and country are all a part of Scouting. Every kind of love is important for a full and happy life.

You will find that if you live by these seven virtues, you will be happy and will make the people around you happy as well.

Don't Panic! Have Fun!

Making the PWD car is supposed to be a cooperative effort between the boy & his folks. A FUN learning process with the parents making sure that no digets are injured in the process, at least not badly !

As the others have noted you don't have to be a woodworking pro to do this. As long as your son is very involved in the creation process & happy with the final look that's what counts. We had a brand new Webelos this year who did the basic block design in orange with some pumpkin stickers. His mom was worried that he would be disappointed. I told her that I had seen block designs before that did fine, but she was unconvinced. The BS Den Chief dad working Pit Crew kind of pointed & chuckled. Every boy in the Pack ran 7 races. Out of this Webelos 7 races his good 'ole pumpkin won 2. The boy was thrilled, his mom was happy, & the Pit Crew dad stopped chuckling!!

BTW - 1) Ask if your Pack has any printed rules & regs for the race so you will not be suprised on race day. 2) Make sure that you do NOT add any weight, or anything else, to the BOTTOM of the car. Each lane of the track has a strip of wood down the middle that keeps the cars in a straight line. If you add stuff to the bottom it will scrape against the strip of wood & not go ANYWHERE very fast!

HAVE FUN!

Is there a general theme that is being used for the Pack meeting? Are all of the rank advancement ceremonies following a similar/same theme? Is each Den doing their own thing, and if this is the case what theme would you like to use?

I find that I very seldom can use any of the ceremonies exactly as they are written on the net. What I do is find one that follows the theme I want and then re-write it for my particular situation.

At this month's B&G our theme will be the 75th anniversary. We have been thinking of doing birthday presents with the rank badges.

If this is for 5th grade Webelos then they never had belt totems to lose. The Tiger rank was not introduced until 2001. These boys would have been Wolf Cub Scouts at that time.

The "Tiger Cubs BSA" orange rectangle was phased out in 2001 when the Tiger rank badge was added. You could check on ebay or call around to different councils to see if they have any left over.

Only 1 committee meeting per year?

How do you find out what is going on? How do you decide what is going to be going on at each monthly Pack meeting? Do you even have monthly Pack meetings? How do you decide about or put together Pack-wide activites?

Sounds like you need to contact your Unit Commissioner & have him give your CC & CM some help.

As far as the other Bear Den - Give the other leader a call and ask if there is anything you can do to help them. Semper's idea of a group outing is a great way to start. That way the boys & leaders can get to know each other.

The more you do FOR people the LESS they will do themselves. It is just human nature.

You need to step back & NOT do some things. It is hard, especially if it looks like things will not get done, but that is how people learn.

For instance your Tiger. You only have 1 Tiger Cub, correct? Is he your son? If he is, then you get the leader job by default. If not, then where is this boys Partner? One Tiger - One Tiger Partner. The Partner should be the "Tiger Leader" not you. You could give them a copy of Program Helps & some ideas & be there for them if they have questions, but they should be working on the Tiger (not Wolf) program on their own.

Your Wolf Den. You need to talk to the other 2 leaders & set some things straight. You should all be working TOGETHER!

Your Hubby. He should not be doing both Committee Chair & Webelos Leader at the same time. If he feels overwhelmed he will not do either job well. For his CC position, is he truly doing only his job as CC or is he doing everyone else's job also. If you have to step in to help it sounds like he is doing more than JUST the job of CC. Or maybe it is that he is not doing the job of CC correctly. He should be mainly a delegator, a coordinator. He OVERSEES the monthly Committee meetings and the business end of the Pack. NOTE - I said oversee NOT do it all himself. He should have committee members that he has designated to do different tasks, head up different sub-committees, who report back to him at the committee meetings. I am sure that by now he knows the families in the Pack. He should be able to put together a list of possibles for each position he needs filled and then go see them, face-to-face, and ask them to do that job. Out of 25 boys I am sure that you have some folks out there that are willing & even wanting to help, but are not ready to make the first move & are just waiting to be asked.

If something doesn't get done, then maybe the parents will realize that you guys aren't going to do it ALL yourselves after all!

BTW - CO is Charter Organization. This is the organization which owns the Pack. The Charter Organization Rep (COR), along with the Committee Chair (CC) is responsible for providing Pack leaders.

Our current 5th grade Webelos Den has met every other week since Tigers. They have earned each rank by that Feb's B & G. This year at B & G, they will have earned their AOL & be ready to crossover to Boy Scouts. They are great boys and this shedule has worked for them.

BTW - the every other week was because of the Leaders work shedule, not because of the parents.

"PROBLEM is where will the boys go when they advance to Boy Scouts... do you break up the Patrol or continue with the new boys"

They go to whatever BS Troop they (& their parents) decide they like the best. This does NOT have to be the BS Troop affiliated with the CO of their CS Pack. That is why boys should visit as many different BS Troops as possible in their Webelos years.

Also, even if all of the Webelos decide to join the same BS Troop that does not mean that they will all stay in the same patrol together. Many Troops like to mix up their new Scouts.

"the den chose to use the square patches"

I am not sure I understand. BSA came out with the new, improved Tiger program in 2001, the year that the current 4th grade Webelos (your son) were in Tigers. Didn't your Pack participate in the new Tiger program, use the Tiger handbooks & work towards a Tiger rank badge?

If the Tigers in his Den earned their Tiger rank there was no choice to be made. They should have received their diamond Tiger rank badge. If, for some reason, none of the Tigers earned their Tiger rank then I can see them receiving only the participation patch. That is what both the large square patch (which went on the red patch vest) and the small rectangle (which went on the blue Cub shirt) were. The participation patches would then be the "proof of" & "recognition for" his Tiger year.

Big difference between a Pack & a Den.

If you want to recruit enough boys so that you can split the Den in two that's fine. However, you should know that unless your Pack Committee Chair can find a Den Leader for those other boys they will be left with out a Den at all. It does not matter if the other school has enough boys to have it's own Den. Without Den Leaders they will not have Scouts. You currently have 5 boys in your Den. How many would you be spliting off that go to the other school?

If what you want to do is either have the other school form it's own Pack or have your school form it's own Pack, that is even more complicated. You should talk to your Council District Executive for help.

Another reason to contact your Cubmaster.

You should also have a Cub Scout Instant Recognition Kit which includes a pocket totem, thongs, and instant recognition beads. One of these beads should be given to your Bears each time they have completed 3 rank achievements.

OK - First off, if you went thru the entire Fast Start Leader Training then you should have a decent working knowledge of the various Dens, what a Pack is and what happens at a Pack meeting. It also talks about advancement, how to set up a Den meeting, the roles of the Cubmaster & Pack Committee, & mentions what a Charter Organization is.

Since you meet at your elementary school I would bet that an organization at the school is your Pack's Charter Organization. Check that list of phone numbers you have for your Cubmaster, Committee Chair, & Charter Representative. Find out from them when/where your Pack Committee meets, where/when your monthly Pack meetings are, what's going on about Blue & Gold which should be this month (Feb) & get a Pack calendar. Get a Assistant Den Leader ASAP.

Your council, Crater Lake, has a pretty decent website. They have online Youth Protection Training along with online Cub Scout Fast Start, both should be taken.

http://www.craterlakecouncil.org/roaringrogue/

This has the date/time/place of your District's monthly Roundtable Trainings. Go to the next one & talk to your District Training Chair to find out when they will be offering New Leader Essentials & Leader Specific Trainings.

Your Den meetings sound pretty good. The parents are wowing because they are new to Scouts too, or are they? Maybe last year's Den Leader didn't do much. Most of the Cub Scout achievements are ment to be done at home with the family. Make sure your families are aware that they should be doing this. You can make them a list of the things you will be covering in Den meetings & let them know they are responsible for the rest.

Good Luck & Have FUN!

At LEAST 2 adults are required for every outing. Make sure that the next time you go one of this boys parents is one of the adults.

Call your District Exec. National had a program that most councils used this fall for recruitment. I can't remember what the specific name was, but it involved the boys giving postcards to their friends inviting them to join Cub Scouts with them. Your council might have some supplies for this left that you could use.

Having some boys working towards rank while others are done can be tricky, but not impossible, especially with Bears. Remember that any complete achievements not used for rank can be used for electives. You could work on rank achievements that your current boys did NOT do. That way the new boys could count them for rank while the old boys could count them for electives.

It is never to late to recruit! Also, remind your boys that if they convince one of their friends to join they can receive the Recruiter strip!

"I too detected a negative comment (the one about GIRL scouts)."

Ok, I'll bite. Why was my post negative? It was a suggestion, & I feel a good one.

If you enjoy Scouting, and have daughters, why would you NOT want to be involved in Scouting with them too? You CAN volunteer for both organizations at the same time. I do.

Not sure yet. The boys make 4 centerpieces in each Den. I am leaning towards the history tree things for my guys, but I want to see what other ideas they come up with. We will probably make a decision at next week's Den meeting.

The red vests can be worn by all Scouts, Cub(most do) or Boy(rarely).

All earned rank, elective, and a few other special badges would go on the blue Cub Scout shirt. All other patches would go on the red vest.

Welcome & have FUN with the new Tiger program!

No awards? Why not?

Our B & G is set up rather like pack1003's though the timing might be different. We do awards after dinner with the crossing over to BS by the 5th grade last. The Troop is planning the crossover ceremony this year (guess who's son volunteered their parent to "check out all of those weird scout sites you are on all of time" to find indian type ceremonies!). After awards we will have some short announcements (what a horrible way to die - LOL!), retire the flags, and then have the entertainment. We usually hire someone.

By the time everything is cleaned up & put away it will be a total of 3-3.5 hrs.

Your son must be a 5th grade Webelos. His was the last Tiger group before the program was changed to include a Tiger rank.

Yes, you are right, the Tiger rectangle would go under the right pocket and the arrow points under the left. He can wear this with the rest of his Cub patches until he crosses over to a Boy Scout Troop.