OutdoorThinker

My Girl Scout council, and I am sure the rest of the councils in the country have something called Girl Scout groups (for you Boy Scouts reading this post, it's similiar to Scoutreach). The idea of a Girl Scout groups is to have someone (usually college age women, but not exclusively) faciliate the Girl Scout program to girls in high risk or impoverished areas, some meet in schools after school, some meet in community centers and other places where there are after school activities for high risk children. The groups are encompass girls kindergarten through twelveth grade, so faciliating the program for the twelve year old, three ten year olds, the two seven year olds the five year old can be a bit of a challenge, but it offers Girl Scouting and an older girl role model to girls who may have never gotten those oppertunites.

All of the materials that are used come in kits from council and they use a special fund for the outreach program, as well as other Girl Scout troops donating supplies to the groups. My girls in my group got a lot of donations throughout the year and the first thing that we did with their new art supplies was make thank you cards.

My girls have also gotten involved in "community service," as we've made cards for a woman active in Girl Scouting who recently turned 90, and cards and letters of encouragement for a friend who was doing a dance-a-thon to raise money for kids with cancer. The girls that I worked with told me they felt good about being able to help other people.

That's my two cents on Girl Scout Groups and my own Group.

OGE, I totally agree with the fact that although, youth-led, the Venturing Youth in leadership positions must be reasonable.

However, despite our imperfections, the youth are supposed to run the show. To quote an earlier post of yours: "Actually the more I think about it, I think the Round Table topics should be 100 percent youth driven. Now thats a goal to strive for!" As we strive to be 100 percent youth driven are you ready to advise that? Adults role is to advise, which basically means sit back and reel us in when we get too far off the path (I'll use your example, when we want to go see the Cubs in the playoffs this weekend) or teach us from our mistakes (I'll use an example of my own, I did not inform my advisor of something before another party got to inform him, despite the fact there was only a 24 hour or so interlude between the two, he would have rather the information come from me imediately). It is in those moments where you need to act that you teach us our lessons about leadership. We learn from our slip ups and we learn where our advisors' limits are by pushing them. We're teenagers. We're imperfect.

I recently helped at a Powderhorn training offering my view as a "real live teenage human being" (yes, shocking isnt it? they let us out of the zoo for a day, and they were even allowed to feed the animals) along with three other "real live teenage human beings." We got talking to the Powderhorn trainees and it seems that beyond dealing with mixed gender teenage relationships, most advisors (at least at this session and grant it, it's not a statistical analysis by any means)are most concerned about finding the fine line and keeping that line between leader (as many of them were in Scout troops) and advisor (the role they need to play with Venturing Crews). OGE, you said earlier that you want the youth to totally led their roundtables, with your slamming on the brakes now, is it becuase you've had a change of heart or is it because you're concerned about teh role that adults will have to play when youth actually begin running the Venturing organization?

As I've stated in previous posts, I've been in Venturing for nearly four years and I've had the same two advisors since the start. Awesome guys, I couldn't have asked for anything better, but we've had our rocky moments until they found their role as advisor as opposed to leader. It's taken almost the whole four years, but the youth are now getting comfortable with taking charge and the adults are now getting comfortable with being advisors. We had the original problem of them being leaders and the youth following, then when they realized they were doing that, they had the not so brillant idea of being completely silent during meetings (although, quite an achievement if you were to ever meet my advisors), this not only was burdensome for them, but it became a problem as we youth needed advise and guidance and we turned to them and got silence looks on their faces as if they were ready to burst. The youth in my crew have now stepped up and the advisors have stepped back, but come to our advisal when the time is needed.

I feel it's a two way street between advisors and youth in crews based on trust and communication. The adults trust us to make good decisions most of the time (knowing that we have our imperfections) and we trust the adults not to be baby-sitters. I hope that all of your crews can find the happy coexsistance that we have in our crew.

I realize that I've veered off from the original post, but I'll admit I got a little fired up. I'll be stepping down from my soap box now, ready and willing to read what you all have to right.

I would like to commend Campaholic and Yarrow for their positive comments on the Girl Scouting program and the Girl Scout Gold Award.

I would also like to take this moment to express what the Girl Scouting program has meant done for me. I hope everyone understands that the Girl Scouting program is more than cookies and crochetting. I know Campaholic mentioned the Career Exploration pin, which Senior Girl Scouts must earn prior to their completion of the Gold Award. This is actually a very interesting award and allows young women to think about their future career paths as well as the road that they must take in order to get to where they want to be.

It was Girl Scouting where I first wrote my resume, this was for the Career Exploration pin, but it is a highly useful skill to learn. Unrelated to the Career Exploration Pin, I participated in a Girl Scout program in my state's capital, which included shadowing my State Representative around the Capitol for a day. As cliche as it may sound, it was this program that set me off into the political world. I am now a political science major and I have spent almost three years working in that same legislators office. Armed with my resume that I began in Girl Scouting and experiences I had with him through Girl Scouting, I had my first job in my major before I even graduated high school, which set me up to meeting people in the political arena and now I am much further along with my contacts and experiences than many Political Science graduates. I have Girl Scouting to thank for that.

As I got older in Girl Scouting, I volunteered with Brownie troops. My experiences helped to hone in my leadership and organizational skills, thus helping me as a Girl Scout leader and an Asst. Scoutmaser for my Boy Scout troop.

Interestingly enough, I first learned how to check my oil and do minor car repair in the Girl Scouts.

My original camping experiences came from being a Brownie in Girl Scouting, and going off to Girl Scout summer camp. I also learned how to ski, snowboard and snowshoe in the Girl Scouts. These outdoor skills, allowed me to become a Boy Scout camp Scoutcraft Director, which anyone who is familiar with the position can honestly say is no 'girly girl'position.

All of this rooted in Girl Scouting. My Girl Scouting success story is not isolated. I know of many girls who have had similiar successes because of the Girl Scouting program.

A 'girly girl' organization where the members knit and sell cookies, I can honestly say I have done both, so if that makes me a stereotype, so be it, I have gained far more skills in Girl Scouting than how to be domesticated...in fact, I feel Girl Scouting has taught me I should expect more from life than knitting and cookies.

To answer Pounder's question, despite a mission statement that has advisors working towards a youth'-led organization, we all know that most things are easier said than done. In the case that I have been dealing with, many of the adult advisors are still stuck in a Boy Scout mentality, rather than a Venturing Crew mentality.

In the case of the council youth board, I've had my setbacks come from advisors who do not have coed crews and are not familiar with girls in the Boy Scouting movement, thus, I have had to on a number of occasions with a number of advisors (fortunately never from my own crew advisors) had to prove my abilities in a much longer drawn out process than any boy would have to. Right or wrong, it is a reality.

Fortunately after being involved in Venturing youth leadership on a council level for over two years, I have proven myself as a capable female Boy Scout to all but one or two of these advisors. My battle was long (and I am still fighting it with one of the head honchos) and I feel that I could have goten more accomplished (and can still get more accomplished) if my ever move is not questioned by the powers to be that still have trouble with my leadership role.

Whether this is a gender issue (which I feel it is partly) or just a youth in leadership issue, it is a problem, especially in an organization where the youth should be calling the shots.

Eamonn, my advice for you to help get the ball rolling for a youth roundtable is (if your youth are truly interested) have them start to make the contacts to the other crews and get them to start putting it together. Our council was finally kicked into high gear after my crew began to contact other crews for an all-council crew camp out in 2002. When council got word, they decided to be supportive, and six months after a successful campout, the youth roundtable began.

OGE, to answer your question, the youth officers of the VEB are ready, willing and able, and in fact have showed their capabalities as an entirely youth led entity, however, we continue the arduous uphill battle that we often find ourselves fighting to gain youth soveriegnty over the VEB. We're making progress and I think we have in our history as a VEB put some adults into their place, but if you think it's hard for some of the old time scouters to pass leadership over to the youth, just think about what happens when the youth in charge are all female.

Senior_Patrol_Leader_T15:

I dont understand why you find it unfair for a girl to be in Venturing Crew and continue the work on her Gold Award, when a boy can be in a Venturing Crew and continue to work on his Eagle.

I also wouldnt recommend only recruiting Gold Award recipiants, because most girls dont recieve their Gold unti their senior year in high school.

Everything else looks good with the age comparision, but your best bet to learn more about the Girl Scouts is to ask questions of the girls in your crew rather than assume stuff, because that could get you in some big trouble.

Our council has it's own youth roundtable for Venturing Crew members. It started out with the intent of being an officers meeting, with Presidents and VPs of the crews coming, but it has since expaned and includes anyone who wants to come. In fact, their president, myself, is not an officer in her crew. The youth board, called the Venture Executive Board or VEB, meets monthly with the adult roundtable meeting at the same time, and we plan events for all the crews in the council to participate in, as well as dicuss problems and issues that come up within the crews, and we inform the crews about new oppertunities for Crew members and other generic information that needs to be passed out. We've been around about six months under the title of the VEB, but the youth of the crews have been meeting for over a year and have planned three large camping events for the Crews in the council. We've also planned a leadership training weekend and a first aid/cpr training weekend. The possibilities are endless, especially if the crew youth get excited about it. Best of luck!

BT:

Best of luck with your first crew campout!!!!! Are you doing anything high adventure, or just camping? Is your crew coed?

SPL_Tr15,

Sounds like you've got it, just would you mind using the term age levels instead of ranks, because the girl scouts really dont have ranks.

Best of luck on your recruitment! Keep us posted on how you do!

SMT376Richmond KY, I continued staying an active Girl Scout after I joined the crew and two of my best friends were crew members and went on to recieve their Girl Scouting Gold Awards. If your daughter wants to camp, she should consider becoming involved in the Venturing Crew. It's just a matter of time management. I unforutnately got a little too wrapped up in a Boy Scout Council project when I should have been working on my Gold Award and aged out before I earned my Gold.

Campaholic brings up a good point that I neglected to mention in my post, about why I enjoyed the Venturing Crew, as I have mentioned, I am a very active Girl Scout. When I learned that my friend's Boy Scout troop was chartering a coed Venturing Crew, he really pushed for the Girl Scouts to join, he knew that we all had camping experience --- working at Girl Scout Day Camp, summer camping, and the occasional weekend camp out, but with our busy lives and working on our Gold Awards, we really didnt plan many camping trips in high school.

I almost didn't join my Venturing Crew, because of my schedule, but I really felt that I had nothing to lose and maybe we'd get to do some "high adventure" stuff that we didnt do in Girl Scouting. I had always wanted to backpack and learn about surviving in the wilderness.

Four years later, I think that joining the Crew was one of the smartest decisions I've made. It's open many new doors for me. I've had great high adventure experiences, and backpacking is now one of my favorite past times and I spent the whole summer teaching younger boy scouts how to survive in the wilderness. Who would have thought?

By the way, I also have to agree with Campaholic, when it comes to OGE's comment about his girls, as much as the girls of my crew and I would appreciate the sentiment behind your "they are two great happening young ladies who I am totally down with and respect in a far out way, just as it sounds you two are," we've been known to put our advisors on slang probation for statements phrased like that. My advisors are good sports though, and I would have to say, that we all are totally down with our advisors and respect them in a far out way, because they've been completely cool learning about Girl Scouting and not trying to judge us by our previous Scouting experiences and they totally support us when we tell them we want to try something new or a little off the wall.

Comparative Scouting 101

As a Venture Crew member, Assistant Scoutmaster for a Boy Scout troop and a life time member of the Girl Scouts, and a Girl Scout leader I can offer a few pieces of information. First, Girl Scouting is set up very differently than Boy Scouting. Girl Scouts don't "advance" but rather move along the system by age and grade. Daisies are kindergarteners, Brownies are first through third graders, Juniors are fourth through sixth graders, as a Junior you can earn the Bronze award, which is the first step to earning the Gold Award (however, the Bronze is NOT necessary to earn the Gold Award). The Cadettes are ususally seventh through ninth grade. It is in Cadettes that a Girl may earn her Silver award, another step in the Gold Award, but not necessary to earn the gold. Seniors are girls in high school. It is then you can earn your gold award.

When recruiting Girl Scouts for your crew, she must be a Senior girl scout, but beyond that I wouldn't descriminate. The Gold, like Eagle is something that girls work on throughout high school. Some arent interested in earning the awards at any level, either.

On camping experiences, at every level above Daisies, girls should have camping experiences. Yes, the average Junior Girl Scout or above knows how to tie a square knot, but her knot tying skill doesnt make or break her Venturing Material. (Please note: It wasnt until I spent a week at National Camp in the Scoutcraft area that I knew had to tie the basic Boy Scout knots).

Girl Scouting focus is slightly different than the Boy Scouting focus. First Girl Scouting really stresses a girl's leadership abilities. Making young women strong leaders and good communicators is probably one of the biggest goals. Second, career exploration is another major goal of the Girl Scouting movement.

Another major difference between the two groups is that where Boy Scouts work on merit badges in pairs, usually the Girl Scouts will do a "merit badge" (try-it, badge or interest project patch) over the course of a few meetings and they will work together as a troop.

We won't even touch on how different Girl Scout camp is from Boy Scout camp.

But ultimately, when looking for Girl Scouts in your crew, you're going to want to talk to Senior Girl Scouts. They may join your crew for a number of reasons, perhaps their troop focuses on camping and they really enjoy it, or perhaps they dont do as much camping and their looking for outdoor oppertunities. I hope this helps.

No where in the Consititution does it say that the President of the United States (or any other office holder) must place their hand on a Bible in order to take an oath of office. It just happens to be one of the long standing traditions and most presidents do either use a family Bible or a Bible of historic significane (like one that another president has been sworn in on). I dont think it would be a legal issue if someone wanted to take an Oath on the Koran or a Bible without the new testitment. I suppose a President could even take his or her oath of office on the Boyscout Handbook, if he or she really wanted to.

I think that it's a great idea to invite the troop's moms along a campout, if only once a year. It'll keep them camping oriented so that when their sons join a coed Venturing Crew, you have some ready, willing and able female chaperones. Although, I am a huge activist for youth leadership, I dont think it would hurt if these guys were advised this one time on this particular issue.

In the most recent poll released by CNN-USA Today- Gallup pitting George W. Bush head to head with Wesley Clark, Clark had 49% and Bush only 46%. In the same poll, Bush tied with both Kerry and Lieberman.

The Gallup also reported Bush's lowest approval rating of his presidency at 50%.

The numbers are looking like we could see a new president in the White House.

Ah, NWScouter, Presidential Trival -- fantastic!

The answers to your question is as follows:

The pair with the same name and no relation are the Johnsons, Andrew Johnson and Lyndon Baines Johnson share a last name, but no DNA.

On to the relatives:

1) George Bush and George W. Bush: Father and Son

2) John Adams and John Quincy Adams: Father and Son

3) William Henry Harrison and Benjamin Harrison: Grandfather and Grandson

4) Theodore Roosevelt and Franklin D. Roosevelt: Teddy was FDR's fourth cousin once removed, but Elenor Roosevelt's uncle, so that makes him an Uncle-in-law, too

5) (Last but not least, the pair that don't share a last name, but are more closely related than the Roosevelts) James Madison and Zachary Taylor: second cousins

Keep an open mind, open lines of communication between your youth, advisors and any council liasons and have fun. You won't avoid all problems, but it'll make the problems easier to manage.

OGE sounds like you have quite a crew. Have the girls always been in leadership positions in the council? How do the other crew members and crew adults in the council dealt with the girls in leadership positions? I know that I have had my uphill battles with the higher ups in council when I was beginning to emerge as a youth leader in my council.

As an inquiry and to see how things worked out, have you advisors had experience working with teenage girls prior to having your crews become coed (ie working with the Girl Scouts or having daughters of your own)? If not, how are things working with your girls? Perhaps those of you who do have females in your crew have some insight for those advisors who havent done a lot of dealing with female crew members.

We, the females of our crew, were the first interaction with teenage girls for all but one of our advisors since they themselves were teenage boys. After nearly four years of being a crew, they've gotten pretty good at interacting with us and have become very paternal. A+ to them.

OGE, I know this message is too late for you and your son (I hope the bagpiping went well for the court of honor), but I hope that maybe it can help another scout who would like the bagpipes to play "Scouting Thunder" at his court of honor. Ask your bagpiper to play "Scotland the Brave" a common tune in most bagpipers' repitoire, it's the same song.

While we are on the topic of Venturing Crew awards on uniforms, I have a question about the Council Venturing Crew Leadership Award. I recieved the award a little over a year ago, in a very memorable Court of Honor that I had no really part in the planning, in fact, I almost didnt show up (it was a very hectic weekend), because I did not know I had been nominate nor did I know that I would be recieving the award.

I really love my medal. It's beautiful, however it is bulky and pretty burdernsome to wear when in uniforms, does anyone know if there is a pin or bar or patch that can be worn on Venturing Crew uniforms all the time, so that I only need to get the medal out on special occasions?

I have to say OGE (is that good?) started a thread that I am really excited about. Politics goes right up there with scouting when it comes to things that make me tick. And to Pounder, I didnt say I was voting for Wesley Clark, yet. I perfer to keep my options open for a a little while longer.

OGE (see, I am getting the hang of this informality thing.)

In my unbiased opinion I do have the best Venturing Crew there is. I've had the same two awesome advisors since we chartered almost four years ago, you can't find two better advisors anywhere, no offense to all of you who are advisors. I can truly say I wouldnt be here or had spent my nine weeks at camp without them and their influences.

Just as an update, while I was writing my message about Wesley Clark, he officially announced his candidacy for the Democratic Presidental nomination. He began his speech: "My name is Wes Clark. I am from Little Rock, Arkansas. And I am here to announce that I intend to seek the presidency of the United States of America."

MomScouter has a point. Wesley Clark is looking like he could be the Democrats ticket to the White House. Keep your eyes peeled for his announcement by the end of the week. I am, however, a little skeptical, because he seems as though he's everything that the Democratic Party could have dreamed of as a candidate. I am, however, hoping he's the man.

Wesley Clark, for those of you who arent up on your whose who of candidates for the Democratic ticket, is a retired General. He's a Vietnam Veteran, who is against the war in Iraq. Some of his other top issues include the enviroment and lowering the teacher to student ratio in public schools.

The next couple of weeks will prove very interesting for the Democratic Party and I feel that I can answer OldGreyEagle's qustion better then.

Writes: Right

Throws: Try not to

Bats: You dont want me to

Votes: Left