baden

Kristi-

Congratulations on finishing your ticket. It is a good feeling to wrap it up. Best wishes with your new Pack.

Baden

I used to be a Fox.

And a Good Ol' Staffer too.

Just returned from BWCA. Had a great trip, this was the best working crew I have ever gone with. The boys worked really hard and portaged like men possessed. The weather was very good for up there. A little cool in the mornings and some rain off and on, but very pleasant. It was odd to see float planes flying over. We were told they were hauling supplies to the fire crews, hence the lifting of the no-fly zone.

Scouting is an educational movement and I learned at least one new thing. I may be getting a little old to do the High Adventure thing.

Eamonn-

I admit that you have the drop on me when discussing Scouting-UK. I have always liked the idea of the County Commissioner but have no idea if it works well or not. Like everything else in Scouting I suppose it depends on the quality of the individual.

When I was speaking of Manpower in my previous post, I was referring to District level volunteers, not Unit volunteers. The D.E. is usually trying to recruit members for the District Committee. This seems to always be a CA around here. Having a fully staffed Committee. Sometimes it is a name in a slot, not much use.

Some D.E's I worked with shared their CA's with me, some didn't. Their call. I never asked. After awhile you sort of knew what they were anyway.

Our District has an unhappy history of recruiting Dist. Chairs on the basis of what they can contribute to the Fund Our Salaries (FOS) campaign rather than a commitment to Scouting and willingness to use their executive skills to improve the District. The best Dist. Chair I worked with had zero Scouting background. He was a skilled manager with a strong background in Service Organizations such as Kiwanis and the American Legion. He wanted to know what we expected of him and produced results. He came to some District events such as Camporees to see for himself what was going on and always visited Summer Camp once during the camping season and always sat down with the Scoutmasters from our District to get their input. I respected him very much. He has stayed involved to this day as an ADC and is very effective in recruiting UC"s.

Your point about the breakdown between Council Chairs and District Chairs is valid. And I mean all the operating Chairs such as Camping, Training, Activities, etc. Our Council has 13 Districts spread over a good size geographic area. We have 3 CCC (Council Co-ordinated Committee) meetings each year usually Sept. Jan. April and all the operating Chairs meet with the Dist Chairs. This is a good format in theory but seemed to me to be little more than Rah-Rah sessions. Not always productive. I did enjoy getting together with everyone and much of the productivity came from rump meetings in the parking lot afterwords. The thing I enjoyed most about my time in District service was the people I worked with, Scouters are an interesting bunch. I made many longtime friendships during this time. I work exclusively at the Unit level now and am having a great times with the boys and my fellow Unit Scouters. I encourage my ASM's to involve themselves at the Dist. level. What they learn there comes back to the boys in better program. I fight constantly to get new leaders to Training. I often hear things like "I don't need to go, you already know all that stuff. I just want to help out with the boys." I have been trying to get my #1 ASM to Wood Badge for 4 years. No luck so far.

Eamonn

I am not anti council, district or professional. I have known many fine DE's. I served four years as District Tng. Chair and another four years as District Commissioner. Having said that, I have become somewhat disillusioned with BSA operations as it pertains to Units and Districts. A District is an artificial entity that is the operating arm of the Council. Districts exist in theory to serve Units. The primary duties of the D.E. are the 3Ms. Membership, manpower, and money. Service to the Units is way down on the priority list for the typical harried D.E. I don't blame the Professionals. They are rated on their performance in meeting the CA's (critical achievements). These are typically set by the Scout Exec. with little or no input from the DE, the District Chairman, and the District Commissioner. Meeting their goals determines advancement and continued employment. Outside of the 3M's the biggest responsibility for a DE, in my opinion, is to make sure that Training of Unit Leaders is happening where and when it is needed. The DE's role in this should be supervisory, not hands on. They usually don't have the experience and really don't have the time to run Training. They have little or no place in Program. Again, usually little experience and no time. Some of the biggest busts I have seen as Professional are excellent former volunteers who see themselves as "Program Director" contrary to what they are told when they are hired.

Many Units run very well with limited contact with Districts, Council, and Professionals. To be fair, these Units were probably started with impetus from a Pro. There were Troops in the U.S. before there were Councils and Districts. I sometimes wonder if we wouldn't have better Scouting if we followed the model of the U.K. with limited Professionals and County Commissioners. Of course we wouldn't have a massive corporate HQ in TX and highly compensated National Staff. We would be smaller. Perhaps leaner and meaner.

Thanks to Dan and Eaglebeader for the updates. i'm looking forward to the trip. I haven't been to the BWCA for 8 years. I have some trepidation about the blowdown area. I have such great memories about the tall pines

We're leaving for the Boundary Waters Canoe Area on 7-29. Does anyone have any current information on the fires in the Ely area? I have some concerned Mommas.

We are leaving Saturday for the Boundary Waters. This will be a 1400 mi. round trip for us. We have been trying to budget as close as possible to make participation easier for all. Budgeting gas prices beginning last December has been a challenge. The gasbuddy web site posted by evmori is a good resource. We budgeted $3.00 p/gal in our planning last winter thinking that we would be OK. Looks like that will be close. We always budget an amount for contingency ($25.00 for this trip) and refund it after all accounts are settled. This year we may get into the contingency fund for gas. Hope not.

We don't pay gas for local events or for transport to summer camp. It is 85 mi. to Camp. The only thing we budget gas expense for is High Adventure trips.

Welcome back. I envy you. I was last at the Ranch in 1998. So long ago I've forgotten the Trek #, but we went over Mt. Philips and the Tooth. We have tried getting a slot a couple of times since, but no luck.

Leaving for Boundary Waters next week. Pray for an old Scouter.

Is summer really over? We just got back from Camp!!!

Leaving next week for the Boundary Waters. Is summer really over???

I find this forum to be, in general, a congenial place. A very few times a reply to one of my postings has been a bit sharp. I usually shrug it off, thinking the poster is having a bad day. I am sometimes amused when a couple of posters get their hackles up and go at each other. This is usually not interesting for long and I choose to not follow the thread. I would recommend that if someone is offended by a response that they let it go and move to another topic.

I meet with my #1 ASM every month on the way to and from Roundtable. We ride together (35 minutes each way) and get quite a bit out every month.

Recently our turn around time from National on Eagle apps. has been consistently 7-10 days. Sometimes the delay is at the Council office. We had one a few years ago that seemed to take forever. I finally inquired at the Council office and was told that the woman that did the reviews on the apps had gone on vacation and quit when she came back, so everything was sitting in a pile on her desk with several others. The delay is usually not in Texas.

This sort of thing drives me crazy. I know that BSA walks a fine line between the traditions of the past and being relevant to today. I also realize that if we never changed we'd be wearing wool uniforms and working on the harness making MB, but the mindset that everything must be utilitarian with no regard for our rich history is sad.

A few years ago a lady in our community came up to me at a Troop Court of Honor and said "I think it is wonderful what you do for these boys". I told her, "Well, I'm not too Saintly, if it wasn't fun I wouldn't be doing it".

When it ceases to be fun, I'll cease doing it. So far, so good.

I am happy to hear about some Scouts showing interest in Space Flight. When I was a "ute we watched the manned space launches in school on black and white TV. I remember being very interested in it. When Alan Shepard and John Glenn went up they were like rock stars. Now the astronauts are sort of ho-hum to the kids.

John Glenn did a promo for Scouting in the early '60's. I remember seeing a poster with Col. Glenn witha Cub Scout, Boy Scout, and an Explorer. Something about Go for Roundup.

There have been many postings in the past about the number of BSA alumni in the ranks of the Astronauts.

Recently our D.E. called and asked if I would participate in a District Manpower Conference. I sort of laughed to myself and said "I forgot, you just got back from Texas" Every newbie D.E. I have known has come back from PDL Tng. and immed. scheduled a Manpower Conf. I think I've been to about 10 of these cluster-flops. The 1st thing that happens is a review of the old charters, then a discussion of the NESA list, followed by a trip down memory lane about old District volunteers we might be able to blackmail into service. Prospect lists are drawn up, assignments are made to make the contacts, followed by a period of inactivity after which the whole thing is forgotten until the next D.E gets back from Texas.

I don't know what the solution is. I found that Unit Commissioners and other District volunteers are not like turkeys. You do not find them in flocks. They are more like Eagles and are usually found one at a time.

This will not help Jeff, but we can all learn from this. For things such as Philmont we must get the money upfront, then if circumstances require someone to drop, they find their own replacement or take the loss. This also keeps a lot of "circumstances" from ocurring. Philmont is tough. The commitment so far in advance does make for some challenges. We were fortunate a number of years ago. We had a boy decide he wasn't interested about 60 days out. We tried to fill his spot, but no luck. His Dad came to the Troop Treas. and paid the Philmont fee. We hadn't asked, but he said the Troop had laid out money for his Son and he saw no reason we should eat it. This is not always the case.

E-man-

Remember, you're only young once, but you can be immature forever!!!

Baden

45 miles one way. Been averaging probably 10 RT's a year for 18 years. I'm amazed when a leader I know that lives 2 blocks from our meeting place can't make it. I think it is about commitment rather than distance.

Kittle-

Scouting does not end at 52. I'm 56. My son is 25, and I'm still the SM. Have fun, the boys will slow the aging process. Or maybe the maturity process. You're only young once, but you can be immature forever.

#1 My son's Eagle Court of Honor

#2 Serving as an advisor at Philmont for a crew made up of Scout's all from my Troop

#3 Serving as Scoutmaster for 1997 National Jamboree. This also included my most terrifying moment as a Scoutmaster, but that's a story for a different day.

Bob, welcome to the campfire that never ends. There is a wealth of experience and knowledge represented by the poster to this list. You may have to sift some chaff from the wheat sometimes, but I have found this to be a good resource.

Yesterday was a nice rainy Sunday and I spent some time in the basement cleaning up some of my Scout debris. I have a box of old Boy's Life magazines from when I was a 'ute. '58-66. I don't have all the issues and they aren't in sequence, but I have moved this box with me several times over the years. I sat down and read through some of them. Pee-wee, Pedro, Whittlin'Jim all brought back great memories. I still subscribe as I like to know what the boy's in the Troop are reading (or not) and I wondered if 45-50 years from now any of the boys would be re-reading their old issues. Somehow I doubt it. I know I am not the target demographic for Boy's Life but I have been disappointed in it for many years. We are a 100% Boy's Life unit. We build it into the dues, but some of the boys grumble about it. I suppose it has always been this way, but I can't help but think that most boys today are not as excited to find their monthly issue in the mail as the old boys in the Flaming Arrow Patrol were. We used to actually talk about it in school and at Patrol meetings. Green Bar Bill was our hero. Just a rant from an old boy.

I am a big believer in having the boys signed up for something for every activity session. Free time in Camp can lead to problems. Boys getting into mischief and homesickness are two bad outcomes.

Idle hands are the Devil's workshop!

I've held a number of positions. CM, ACM, WL, ASM, Dist. Tng. Chair, Dist. Commissioner, UC, Council Exec. Bd., Venturing Advisor, OA Adviser, Jamboree SM, and the greatest job to me was Scoutmaster. I followed a long tenured SM in our Troop and have been able to slowly make some changes such as becoming more truly boy-led and really getting the Patrol Method up and running. I was ASM under the old SM for 12 years and chafed at how we did things. Old SM was (and is) a great guy and a dedicated Scouter, but was really a one man show. He often talked about the good old days when he could just take the Troop out himself with no other adults and the time he was was the sole adult as a Crew Advisor at Philmont (early 70's). As much as I chafed under his Leadership, he chafed at any outside interference with how he ran the Troop. But, he was dedicated to the boys and loved Scouting. We didn't agree on how things should be run, but we always enjoyed a good personal relationship. When he retired he asked me to move up as his successor. My son had been grown and gone from the Troop for about 5 years then and I was sort of hanging around but headed for the exit. It was a tough decision to accept the position, but I have never regretted it.