Lynda J

Everything that my boys take on outings must have their names on it. I have a small engraver that I can put their names on things like knives and compasses.

I have a real problem hanging a knife around a boys neck. I don't think that there is a problem with things like compasses and whistles. But I would never hand a knife around my neck much less one of my boys.

I do agree that when the boy has to spend his own money on a item most of the time they will be much more responsible for it.

This topic has brought to mind an event that happen when I was in highschool and in Girl Scouts.

My dad also helped with a Boy Scout troop. THere was a young man in the troop that got himself into some very serious trouble. Was on the road to Eagle. But there was talk about not only not allowing him to earn Eagle but to also kick him out of the troop. And to be honest it probably was justified.

My dad was a big believer that we are the stewards of our youth. He took this boy in hand. Worked through the trouble. Managed to convince the other leaders to keep him in the troop then worked with him to earn Eagle. This young man did a massive amount of community service as part of his agreement on the trouble.

Now remember this was in the late 50's, before we tossed kids on the junk heap as quickly.

When my dad passed away in 84 this man ask if he could speak at the funeral. He stood up in front of over 300 people and stated that my father is the one person who is responsible for him being where he is today. That he was the only adult that was willing to give him another chance and make his take responsibility for what he had done. Today this young man is the District Attorney in my home town. He is also very involved with youth. Especially kids in trouble.

So before we throw the baby out with the bath water what about looking at how we can help kids that make mistakes get back on the right path and hopefully turn them into honest, hard working, and fair thinking adults.

What I did with my Webs was keep them as a Den through Web I, When they started Web II I split them up into patrols and started working them as patrols. This way when they moved up into the troop they already had a good understanding of how a patrol worked. It worked extreemly well and my boys fit right in with the Troop. We had one boy serve as a PL for one month. Then rotated to another boy.

That was 3 years ago and I think it worked for my boys very well.(This message has been edited by Lynda J)

I have two boys in my troop that have blue cards that are not signed off by the counselor. They are from a Merit Badge College three years ago.

The work was all completed but the counselor never sign that the badge was complete. After making several attempts to reach the counselor with no call backs. I finally checked with one of the other District Commissioners and he told me to sign the cards. Neither were Eagle required. I later found out that none of the boys that took the badge had signed cards.

Had the boy tried to reach the counselor and couldn't. So he was scared and signed the card himself?

But I agree with Hunt. Look at the overall picture. Boy I know that I don't live the Scout Laws 24/7/365. I don't think any of us do.

When I was directing our districts day camp I had great luck with both Lowes and Home Depot donating things. I was getting some mismixed paint one day at Lowe's and when I got ready to check out and gave them my BSA tax Id card the clerk called the manager over and told him this was for Cub Scouts. He gave us the paint them ask if we needed any tarps. They has 8 that had been slightly damaged. He gave them all to us and let me go through the scrap wood pile and take anything we needed.

He called me a couple of days later and told me to come by. I went by and he had 6 sheets of plywood that had the corners chipped off. He gave them to us.

I think that most of the time it may depend on the store manager themselves. Some are great and some aren't worth a plug nickle.

But you don't know until you ask. They can either say yes of no. But you won't know until you ask.

One thing we always recommend that our boys do it put the project supply list in writting and have it on a letter head that indicates the troop and district and council. Ask if they can help with any of the items on the list. Also if you go to local business in your community don't ask for money directly. Give them the same list and see if they would be willing to purchase one item on the list for you. Make sure you give them a reciept and a letter of thanks. Also be sure that this information is included in your Eagle Project book that is turned in to the Advancement Committee.

Our District does three NLE and NLS a year. One in the Spring, one in the Fall and one just after the first of the year. This is for Cubs and Scout.

We do two weekend Outdoor Skills a year. Spring and Fall. We do OWL at the same time and Baloo twice a year. We are lucky in that we have a good program and great people willing to step forward and teach.

I was proud that at the last OLS three of my Boys Scouts were invited to teach Fire Building. They did a wonderful job. Taught about 40 new leaders. The reviews that were turned in bragged on them for their knowledge and skill. Nice thing was that most of the leaders taking the course didn't know that they were from my troop.

YPT can be had upon requires. As a trainer I also will go to any unit and do Basics or Fast Start.

Our Council has two Woodbadge courses a year.

We do Pow Wow once a year and UOS once a year, this will have MBC included. Commissioners College yearly with additional District Committee training yearly.

Safety Afloat and Safe Swim once a year as District level. Safe Climb is twice a year as a weekend outing.

What about a chili cookoff. Where the boys do the cooking and people pay to sample the chili.

They could work this into the Cooking badge/

One of our boys favoites is RESCUE CHICKEN.

It takes. 5lb of chicken leg/thigh sections.

l bottle of French Dressing

1 Jar of Apricot or Apple Preserves

1 onion chopped,

Brown onions, add chicken in dutch oven. Add dressing and preserves. cover and cook until tender. Serve over rice.

We won first place at a cook off with this. And it was truly "rescued". The scout that did the shopping got Ranch Dressing and Grape Jelly.

The boys used catsup and sesame oil for the french dressing but we had to use the grape jelly. It was good but the color of the sauce was a little on the gray side.

There may be a year or more from the time that an Eagle Project is approved by the District Advancement Committee until the time that a Scout has his BOR. This depends on how fast the Scout completes the project and how agressive he is about coming back for his BOR. In that time there could be a new AC. The same people that sit on the approval committee may not sit on the BOR.

I would think that with a committee setting the amount of time a boy can contribute to the project over how much others do and he is turned down on that. In a appeal that committees decission would in all probability be over turned.

I have been on our District Advancement committee for the past 3 years. You can not alter or add requirements for any Rank Advancement.

By setting % requirements you are adding quirements a boy has to meet for Eagle. There is nothing anywhere in the requirements for Eagle that says anything about breaking down work done on a project by %'s of the amount of work done by anyone.

As far as showing leadership. Did he work the group benifiting from the project and work out the plans for the project? Did he have to get donations of materials or have to earn money to pay for material? Did he arrange for others to help him on the project? Did he oversee the work on the project through it completion? If the answer to these questions is YES then he showed leadership.

Wishing you and yours a wonderful Christmas and a Happy New Year

Some time ago there was another thread about a scout that several piercings and someone was upset about him not removing them for his EBOR.

I sat on a BOR for a young man with green hair. But you should have seen all the work he had done.

He was a great scout and I voted to pass him.

As far as the uniform. If he has a uniform I would expect him to wear it. He his troop has not encouraged their members to have uniforms you can not add a requirement. Since BSA does not require a uniform to be a member, if you require a uniform for BOR then you have added a requirement. I personally think that a uniform in some form should be required. If nothing more than a shirt with a nice pair of jeans of pants.

They should both be pressed and neat. But to exclude a boy because of a uniform I would vote NO.

Once a year our boys plan a "Game Campout" We have it at one of the camps that has a nice building with plenty of electrical outlets and heat. This camping trip the only thing required of them is to cook their meals. All of the other time can be spent playing games. We take several TV's and power strips. The boys sleep in the room and can play as late as they wish. The only other requirement is that any game brought must be appropiate for all age groups that are there.

The boys love it. We will be doing this trip in Feb. Last night the boys started making their list of which games they would be bringing.

To be honest my boys had so much going on at summer camp that they didn't need to do much planning. They would have maybe 2 hours out of the entire day that they didn't have activities.

They actually enjoyed having some down time.

One afternoon late we had a great water fight with another troop. Water bottles with a hole poked in the top make great water guns.

I think we can many times over plan for our boys. Sometimes they simply want to "Hang"

Have a question. Are you part of the CO or part of the unit that left. If not I would stay out of this mess. Leave it to the Council and the CO.

The CO legally owns the unit. Lock Stock and Barrel. If a unit leaves their CO they can not use their old Unit number or take any equipment that has been purchased with money earned my the unit.

One thing we have been doing just in case is we have had parents donate equipment. Though we see no problem with our CO there is always a chance. The Lions Club has chartered the Pack and Troop since 1948.

But unless you are part of either the CO or the Unit involved I wouldn't get involved.

I just staffed ours. The course was $10.00 and you furnish your own lunch. Some of the craft classes did have a supply charge.

We were full. I had three classes and there were 28-31-34 in my classes for map and compass.

A good den leader can make earning all 20 pins fun. We had a ball. Personally I think that we should push our boys to do their best. To set goals and reach them. To not accept second best if they want to achieve. There are no "giv'me's' In the real world. Hopefully I will always expect my boys to reach for their best and not settle for anything else.

Kevin is Den Chief for a Web II den. Their Web I leader didn't feel it was important to earn pins. Well guess what. They are now Web II's and have just now received their Web Rank. They aren't close to Arrow of Light. Simply because doing Advancement wasn't important. They earned lots of fun patches like "Movie Night" "Tour a Fast Food business" But nothing that pushed them. Nothing that helped them learn.

Telling kids that it ok not to push and try, is like telling them that a C is ok, even though they are able to make A's.

Scouts should "DO THEIR BEST" in everything they try.(This message has been edited by Lynda J)

I think I have to agree about Apollo 13.

Congrats.

Our district will not allow a Unit Commissioner to work with their own Unit. There may be times you will have to "step on peoples toes" and you should not be put in a postion of having to do that within your own unit.

I am a Unit Commissioner and even though the Pack I moved up from is having major problem I would not want to work with them. It could have a adverse affect on the relationship with the troop.

I would talk to your District Commissioner and ask to be assigned to a different unit.

If the committee requires a scout to wear a uniform for SMC and BOR. They have in fact added a requirement to advancement.

I wear my uniform to any scouting activity and so do my boys, which in most cases they do.

BSA does not require a boy to own a uniform in order to be a scout. I personally like the uniform, except for the pants with pockets you can't put anything in, I am proud to wear it.

I think all of the above apply. There is also a problem with some leaders accepting the fact that this program should be run by the boys and they have a problem not being in control. But also there is a lack of many younger adults to make long term committements (30ish age group, Sorry guys). I have been working in some form of scouting as an adult for 40 years. Was in scouting from 2nd grade through high school. My own son went through the program to Star and is now 34. Currently he is not involved but plans to be later. My daughter was in GS through highschool. My mother graduated her last GS troop from high school shortly after turning 70 and had a troop before I was old enough to be in the program. At time of her death at 75 was registered as an assistant leader. My grandmother was working with GS until her death at 75. I guess it is simply breed into me.

I think there will always be a few people out there that have a total committement to the program long ofter their own children have left the nest. On of our District Commissioners has been in scouting for over 75 years.

At going on 60, I have no interest is not working in this program. Kevin (my foster) is 12 will earn Life in December. He loves scouting and is talking about wanting to be a JASM.

Like my wonderfully wise Gram always said

"Your community is like a tree, you are either a leaf that feeds it of mistletoe that sucks it dry.

Be dang sure you are always a leaf. So I will continue to be a leaf and sometimes the entire limb.

Welcome from Ft. Worth.

TRAINING. TRAINING. TRAINING. I don't know when Circle 10 is doing their Cub Scout Pow Wow but find out and take as many courses as you can get in.

I have one question. You stated that the SM did nothing but critize your sons Eagle Project.

If he approved it, as required, he must have seen quality in the project. So suddenly he is critizing that same project. Also I have a question regarding his having been a Den Chief for 4 years. Our District requires all Den Chiefs be at least 1st Class Rank and have attended Den Chief Training through the Council.

If he has just turned 14 had has been a Den Chief for 4 years that would mean he became a Den Chief at 10.

I also worry about boys that rush Eagle. They have until their 18th birthday. Slow down and enjoy the scouting program. Don't be in such a hurry. My Kevin, 12, is very scout orientated. Has all but two if his Eagle Badges. Is currently a Den Chief. Just spent the weekend teaching Fire Building for Outdoor Leader Skills.

He is targeting 16 for Eagle. His choice, because he wasnt to have fun. He also wants to earn Eagle at an age where he can then become an JASM.

That age requirement is 16. He said then he can spend until 18 earning Palms.

I personally thing that when a boy gets Eagle at such an early age he is more likely to drop out of Scouting simply because there isn't much higher he can go.

As far as an SM being jelous. It can very well happen. As a Unit Commissioner I have seen it.

Was called in because an SM refused to sign of on a boys Star. He all but refused to give me a reason. Just simply didn't feel the Scout was ready. This was a very good kid. Worked hard and was 14. Went to District Advancement Chair. He talked to the SM. Still no real reason. The DAC did the conference and signed the boys off.

Within 2 months the SM had left. New SM has grown the troop about 50% and their boys are once again advancing. They hadn't had a rank advancement above 1st Class in almost a year.

You son can appeal to the District Advancement Committee is HE, (not you) truly feels he is being

penalized. But my recomendation would to be let your son handle as much of this problem as he possibly can.

I am the counselor for about 8 badges. If Kevin is interested in working on one of these badges I expect him to contact me just as he would any other counselor. With blue card in hand. After that I will announce at a meeting that work will be beginning on a certain badge and anyone interested should see the SM about a blue card.

I did Pets just after school started. Of the 7 boys that were interested 3 actually completed the badge.

As far as counseling your own child. To be honest I probably expect more of Kevin that another counselor would. But we like doing badge work together.